The question isn’t ‘can Chloe be the co-leader’, the question is ‘why would Chloe want to be the co leader”.
More about that later.
Let me begin by saying this.
There are genuinely few politicians in this country who excite my intellect and provide me with real optimism and hope.
Chloe is one of them.
Ever since she came third for the Auckland mayoralty, she has stood out as an intellectual and philosophical giant for the Left.
Her ability to articulate and promote progressive ideas and values is a once in a generation talent.
She’s the Jacinda we all wished Jacinda could have been.
Her power to persuade, her wit and her intelligence mark her out as the leader the NZ left have been begging for.
And that could spell political doom for Labour.
One of the take aways from the latest Roy Morgan Poll which saw the Right lose almost 7% was that barely any of that went to Labour.
Left wing voters have turned to the Greens, Māori Party and TOP.
ABL.
Anyone But Labour.
Labour’s fecklessness to be transformative burnt and poisoned many on the Left.
In working class Auckland, these voters stayed at home and didn’t vote.
In middle class Auckland, they voted Green.
Labour haemorrhaged working class left vote AND lost middle class left vote.
In the Auckland middle class electorates, the Greens were incredibly successful because the Green Wealth Tax won them over intellectually.
If Chloe becomes the co-Leader, she will rip Labour voters from the hapless Chippy as middle class AND working class voters dump Labour for political parties with actual political values and real solutions.
If Labour are not frightened by Chloe as co-Leader and the ramifications of what that will do to the Left vote, then they have become as delusional as their GST off your banana strategy was.
So, the question isn’t ‘can Chloe be the co-leader’, the question is ‘why would Chloe want to be the co leader”.
I’ll make my argument that this is the real issue for Chloe on Sunday.
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If she takes the job, how do we ensure she is not harassed and threatened by the right-wing dirty politics brigade and the crazies.
Grow a back bone. Win the economic argument in full don’t just whinge how it’s all to hard.
If only it was so easy. Economics is like religion in that no amount of evidence will convince someone who doesn’t want to change their world view. The only thing you can guarantee is that the hardcore supporters of a particular view will disagree in the most objectionable way possible with any politician who contradicts them, especially if they are a woman or someone else they consider less worthy that themself.
Just don’t talk to them and raise wage inflation anyway.
Exactly @ P.K.
Further more “Chloe Swarbrick as co-leader could spell political doom for Labour”
I’d ask; But what labour? The current iteration of boneless crazies isn’t ‘Labour’. It hasn’t been Labour since 1984. Since the traitor douglas swept in under our noses. Roger and seymour his blood boy and his diciples of greed are there and now and immediate after 40 fucking years. They’ve gone nowhere. Yet. So, one could argue, nothing to lose then. Go Chloe Swarbrick! You’re a glorious twinkly star of hope. The Darkness hasn’t won yet.
She’s old enough to handle it. She doesn’t need you as a bodyguard.
+1
You’re playing the victim card already?
I think Chloe is ready for it because she pays attention because the vast majority of people just don’t pay attention because everything is hopeless and there is nothing anyone can do and that the duties and responsibilities of government is just to big to takle. I haven’t seen any polls but I’m willing to beat that a large portion of New Zealand question our involvement in the bombing campaign against Yemem and reckon that New Zealand is run by a bunch of homicidal maniacs. Yes Chloe as leader will have to contend with disadvantages like Stephanie Girl Power Rogers but there are obvious take over opportunities that Chloe can click into by leaning on her track record and political history. But she’ll have to have balls. Bibi got on the phone to Jacinda and threatened her life just for signing upto to a pro Palestinian stance so we have to understand you gotta have balls.
Working class voters are going to flock to Chloe? I’m not sure about that Martyn.
Of course they won’t they have absolutely nothing in common Chloe is a smarmy city girl who presents herself as superior.
That’s Bob speak for being insecure around very intelligent women.
How the hell could you accuse Swarbrick of being smarmy and then gush over Luxon? ‘Luxon’ could be found as a synonym for the word ‘smarmy’ in any decent thesaurus.
Poor old Wheel cannot grasp what is being said, never mind.
You have said Swarbrick is perceived as too smarmy for working class people. Luxon is ‘smarmy’ personified, but clearly must have attracted some “working class” votes.
I think the reality is you are just projecting your own insecurities supposedly as someone who speaks on behalf of the working class (whatever working class means).
Luxon is smarmy personified, Swarbrick is repellant to the working class for other reasons.
Not insecure at all I’m independent and always have been.
Jeez Bob, everyone’s superior to you, not just Chloe.
The working class rejected Labour they will certainly reject the Greens in any iteration.
Absolutely Jack the Greens by any iteration will not attract working people.
She will be great so long as she does not scream and rant like she did a while ago .She is impresive most of the time .The haters and anti female brigade will be disgusting .
@ GW. ” so long as she does not scream and rant like she did a while ago ” Why the fuck not? Did she make you feel threatened little rose bud? I’d like to see her knock luxon, seymour and fucking peters out then jump on their oily smirking fucking faces.
Your admiration for Chloe Martyn is fair enough, but if you think the Greens will be a force to be reckoned with because Chloe is co-leader is not only doubtful, but fanciful!
Labour will get back on its feet when Chippy has left warming the leaders seat, and that increased support will be cannibalised from the greens, the old faithful Labour vote, that deserted them last election, will return and it’s a good 10+%
Greens have had their success at Labours failure, watch the tide turn over the next two to two and a half years.
@ Im right. I’m only one person but I can say with certainty. I don’t give a fuck what you think.
Voters will flock back to the left as they have now come to realise the inevitable, tge three headed monster government is crap, oh and also corrupt.
Corrupt Costello and Bishop.
Labour and Greens to form a new government in 3 years without a doubt and will take in TPM for balance. Winston going with National will consign NZ First to the trash bin and Act will be a one man party again simply because Epsom is gifted to Seymour.
This of course could change if they oust the corruption and get rid of Luxon as he is clueless.You just don’t learn politics overnight.
Don’t get too excited Martyn. Your favourite Efeso couldn’t get working class people out to vote in South Auckland – either for mayor on a Labour endorsement or for the Greens as a candidate. Chloe is smart and will be a great co-leader, but I wouldn’t wish that on any younger woman after the way Jacinda was treated. Three years is a long time : Labour will rebuild and has some great people in the wings. The worst vote Labour had this century is when you and your mate Trotter decided that Cunliffe was the second coming. Guess what ; they rebuiit and became government for two terms three years after that terrible defeat.
Darien
Jacinda went from being widely liked to widely despised not because she was/is a woman. It was largely due to what she did (segregation) and what she failed to do (as campaigned on).
This current Labour lot are largely untrusted to deliver. And I don’t see any great up and coming potential waiting in the wings.
Rubbish: she was the subject of an unprecedented disinformation campaign. As Chloe will be – The Right in NZ can hardly stand on their record or their merits. Flinging poo shows the level they have attained on the primate tree – on a par with their smaller tailed brethren.
It wasn’t/isn’t just the right that despise her, Stuart.
The segregation she imposed tore families apart, ended careers, livelihoods and friendships. She did a lot of harm. Hence, the immense hatred.
One can’t do that to a nation and simply walk away thinking there would be no blowback.
Furthermore, while she had no gas in the tank to continue in the party, she’s not finished with us all just yet.
She’s still got enough in the tank to work on shutting down our free speech.
Darien+Fenton
> The worst vote Labour had this century is when you and your mate Trotter decided that Cunliffe was the second coming.
f you look myopically at the percentage of party votes cast they yes, Cunliffe’s result was historically low. But if you look at it by comparison to the previous result, a very different picture emerges.
Under Cunliffe’s leadership, the Labour party vote dropped less than 2% on their 2011 result, and didn’t lose a single MP. Under Hipkins, the Labour vote in 2023 crashed to about half what it was in 2020, as did its share of MPs. I would argue that’s their worst result under MMP (comparing MMP with FPP elections is a mug’s game).
After Cunliffe, Labour elected other leaders who talked like they were part of the left, and its vote recovered. Hipkins and his advisors totally missed that memo, tacked to the right, and decimated Labour’s vote. In an election, where the Greens, TPM, and even TOP grew their share of the vote with actual left-leaning policy
The electorate’s message for Labour seems clear. Unless and until they don’t get the memo, Bomber is right that they’re in serious trouble.
Totally agree. And they don’t seem to be getting that memo, at all.
It will be a tsunami tide.
Im right your comments are on the button.
Chloe and James should start there own green/ blue party and leave the other Co leader s
Stick to the environment and the economy and I might consider supporting them again. Their social engineering efforts have been enough to put me off them.
Yes Bonnie, me too. The Greens need pragmatic policies that will positively affect and appeal to 90% of NZ voters rather than pissing their energy against the woke wall.
Straight from the Right. Economics and climate change are completely entwined. If the Greens were to leave that (haha) I’d have no one to vote for. Like Martyn. The Greens are the only pakeha/maori party to put the neediest we’ve neglected for 40 years first. See how pathetic Labour was for the poorest.
On just sheer intelligence alone Chloe far far outstrips Hipkins. Hipkins is a plonker
Is she experienced and ruthless enough yet. No good running too early like popular prince Lange, not knowing how to use power and control his retinue, ending with a cup of tea and a lie down.
Well said about Lange. I remember post ’84 election victory him doing a publicity thing in the chambers and he couldn’t help but look up at the camera nervously and it was all ‘what do I do now’, like Robt Redford in ‘The Candidate’.
The Left is the Left is the Left…if Labour no longer wishes to, at the very least, pay lip service to the Left – to the people – then yeah, the floor is open for someone, anyone, that wants to serve the people, to serve our interests. The Left, the people, is not and should never be, binding to one entity. Let the most worthy, champion our cause.
The problem for Ms Swarbrick is that she appears to be a rational thinker in a party that embraces US identity politics. She would do better in Labour or even National. Just saying, could someone tell her that the ö should be ë. Putting accents on English names is silly enough without choosing the wrong vowel.
I once asked her why the umlaut is on the wrong letter – she told me that she had made the choice when too young to appreciate the incorrectness, and then decided to stick with her choice regardless.
Her choice, and fair enough.
‘Why would she’?! Duty! The Greens know above all there is no future sans fighting. The nitwit Jacinda did it as ‘CV’, as so this silly-arse material comfort goes ever on — hence the baby. The 30s crowd ruined their personal lives for the people, not least Savage, who had the understanding to know that it would most likely destroy a family.
In this house we kneel for Queen Emperor of Aoteatoa Swarbrick!
I think the Greens have little, if any real chance of forming a government without Labour, so if Labour crashes so do the Greens. The Greens, in my opinion appear to be a little flaky at times, many voters think they are a one trick pony, with a complicated constitution, which could be described as ” Woke”, like National and Labour they seemed to be lacking experienced and competent, dare I say it, politicians. Anyway, National coalition seems to have their hands full, with policy inconsistencies, dubious tax cut revenue gathering schemes, poor Internal and foreign affairs decisions, let alone the perceived racist policies, to be confident of being returned to the treasury benches at the next elections.
Shaw was the last politician, the rest are just shrill activists.
Socio-political and political participation is very important. You undertake this task in the best possible way. But we should evaluate far-left tendencies carefully. The element of balance is indispensable in politics.
She’s a smart choice, but the structural issues for the Greens are not trivial. Male and female co-leadership was smart, and let the Greens avoid a lot of internal wrangling. As that widened to include other criteria, especially identitarian ones, the value decreased.
The Greens need to replace Shaw too – but no worthy male contender remains.
She must be all right – the right loathe her. But when it comes down to it, the Greens are largely middle-class party. Still, their hearts are mainly in the right place.
guerilla surgeon:
> the Greens are largely middle-class party.
Please point me at a NZ political party who aren’t. Maybe TPM?
Labour in the 21st century are not only dominated by the Professional-Managerial Class, but about half of them are right-of-centre. By any measure that doesn’t arbitrarily move the centre line around willy-nilly, so it’s always just to the right of wherever Labour drifts to. National are exactly the same, but with capitalists and rentiers funding it instead of unions and centrist NGOs. TOP are pure PMC, as are ACT.
Winston First I’m not so sure about. But they squandered any chance of growing out of Dear Leader’s shadow between 2017 and 2020 and will sink without a trace once he retires, like the Anderton and Dunne parties before them.
So I ask again, is there any NZ political party that actively organises working class people and gives us leadership positions?
The Greens programme is for the people. Swarbrick said climate change and inequity are the main thing. That’s what I believe. Fkn good starting point. 4 constituency seats like Labour agin the Liberals 100 years ago.
if I never hear the words ‘Labour Party’ again it will be too soon.