HOW SERIOUSLY should New Zealanders take the words of Green MP Barry Coates? In a recent post to The Daily Blog he said: “The memorandum of understanding with Labour is the foundation for building the next government. However, if we were not part of the coalition, we would not accept a Labour-New Zealand First government and certainly not a National-New Zealand First government. Neither will be acceptable to the Greens.”
On its face, that statement suggests that if Labour attempts to form a minority coalition government with NZ First alone, then the Green Party will withhold the support it needs to withstand a Vote of No-Confidence from the National Party and its allies. In other words, if the Green Party is not included in a progressive coalition government, it will send New Zealanders back to the polling booths before Christmas for another go at electing a government.
How do James Shaw and Metiria Turei feel about this extraordinary statement? Do they endorse it? Or, have they been blindsided by their most junior Member of Parliament? [Barry entered Parliament off the Green Party List on 7 October 2016, following the resignation of Kevin Hague.]
Let’s assume, in the absence of any loud public denials and/or disciplinary action from James and Metiria, that Barry’s summation of the Greens’ position is accurate: what are its likely consequences?
Well, let’s just consider what the electorate will have witnessed between 23 September and whenever the newly-elected House of Representatives is dissolved by the Governor-General.
First, they will have watched in disbelief as the Greens allowed the proposed coalition government brought together by Andrew Little and Winston Peters to be voted down by National, the Maori Party and Act. Then they will have seen Labour, NZ First and the Greens vote down Bill English’s attempt to form a government of the Right. Just weeks after participating in one general election, the voters will be faced with the unwelcome prospect of participating in another.
But surely, some will object, if Winston is unable to govern alongside Andrew Little, then he will simply switch his allegiance to Bill English? That is certainly what an utterly cynical politician, quite unconcerned about the moral quality of his political legacy, would do. A more astute populist politician, however, would recognise, in the extremity of the political crisis precipitated by the Greens, a heaven-sent opportunity to improve not only his own party’s position, but also that of his preferred coalition partner.
Because there can be little doubt that the electorate would punish the Greens mercilessly for landing them with such an unwelcome Christmas present. The voters would reward the Green Party’s dog-in-the-manger irresponsibility by hurling it unceremoniously out of Parliament – a place to which it would struggle to return.
The Green Party vote would be swallowed-up by Labour, while NZ First would be rewarded for its principled refusal to refuse the baubles of office by harvesting an even bigger crop of erstwhile National Party voters than they had already gathered-in on 23 September.
Paradoxically, the very thing the Greens had hoped to prevent, by refusing to guarantee Confidence and Supply to Little and Peters, will have come to pass: a Labour-NZ First Coalition Government. Except on this, the second time around, it will be a government over which the Greens are unable to exert any influence whatsoever.
If Barry misspoke, then surely it is long past time that James and Metiria said so.
Dunno if Coates mispoke. Turei has already talked the Greens out of cabinet, and probably out of influence, with her pathetic ‘purer than thou’ attack on Winston Peters.
Two petulant dummy spits in a matter of days suggests to me that the Greens are resigned to both coming fourth and another 3 years of political irrelevance.
On the upside, Labour has pretty good environmental policies anyway, so that side of things will still get attention if NZ is lucky enough to have some form of progressive government post election.
YES THE GREENS ARE HOLLOW NOW AFTER I LEFT THE PARTY IN 2002.
I GUESS THIS IS A YOUNG MIND PARTY NOW AS MOST OF THE OLD SCHOOL HAVE LEFT AND NOW THEY HAVE THE REACTIONARY ELEMENT IN THERE.
SORRY TO SEE THEM WITHOUT SOLID POLICY IDEAS LIKE WE HAD DURING ROD DONALD/JEANETTE FITZSIMMONS/SUE KEDGELY.
THOSE FOLKS NEED TO LECTURE THE MODERN GREENS ABOUT HOW TO GET ALONG WITH OTHERS.
BETTER GET THEIR SHIT TOGETHER BEFORE LONG – GOD SAVE US ALL.
It is interesting that you say what you do.
After strongly supporting the Greens in the late 1990s and early 2000s I saw them for what they were and attempted to help get them on track: they were not interested.
I now see them as a disorganized rabble of well-meaning fuckwits and slight-tweaking-of-business-as-usual nutters who, when push cones to shove, couldn’t organize a piss-up in a brewery, enthusiastically promoting much of what is completely wrong with the dysfunctional society we endure.
Nandor is a Whakatane regional councilor, he was the sole vote against first past the post town plan rigging. He’s also attempting to modify health and safety regs. So you too are wrong but in a very good way. Hope you guys agree. Let’s not down play the demise of old school greens just yet eh chaps.
I suspect this requires a Winston reply….no need to commit …until after the electorate has spoken
[…] astounding announcement that the Greens will rule out a Labour/NZ First minority Government means that voters who want to kick National out of power must now question lending their Party vote […]
What a load of scaremongering Trotter. Just like US (Bernie) and UK (Corbyn), a lot of voters want more people-friendly left policies, and much less influence by big money interests.
So why would the Greens prop up a treacherous regime directly opposed to their supporters interests? Barry Coates is good at speaking the plain truth, something voters want, and entirely missing from Winston’s ramblings. Winston has also knifed the Greens many times in the past, so deserves no support from them.
If the people of NZ deliver a mangled unworkable minority vote, then they deserve to have another go to provide some clearer direction.
Other than 2005, which I guess you could consider ‘knifing’ them if you mean that he had a bigger caucus and was able to trump them in negotiations, when else has he ‘knifed’ them?
When the topic of the Greens comes up with Winston, he always replies immediately with a sarcastic or dismissive comment. And that’s just in public. You can imagine how vociferous he is behind closed doors.
His own web site is has anti-Green rhetoric. http://www.nzfirst.org.nz/greens_greenwash_climate_change_policy_by_stealing_nz_first_s
Dave;
Thanks for this link.
It seems you have missed the main point of what he is saying here.
“No one can tax their way to a better climate and NZ First is alone in understanding that. says Mr Peters.
“The great advantage of the New Zealand First policy is that there are enormous savings of $1.4 billion per annum which will be spent financing the success of our own policy,” says Mr Peters.
I heard Ron Marks mention this figure on Backbenchers a while back that seemed overlooked.
This was Trumps main critique of the ‘Paris Occord’/system as well.
That $3 billion per annum would disappear into a ‘Green Fund’ going offshore to “Who knows where” when China, which is now the biggest polluter in the world, does not have to pay anything!!
ie; gets off scott free.!!!
Nor does India or any other of the developing countries and the MSM never inform us of this.
When will people realize that this Carbon Tax Scam is only targeted at Western Countries and it pretty much would be better to use
that money to address our own issues.
Just another part of the strategy to take down the West.
Besides, just compare that $1.4 billion to America’s $3 billion per annum to see how NZ would/is being seriously disadvantaged.
Makes Common Sense to me and a growing number of others.
One more issue while we are at it.
Chris Trotter, (whom I have criticized myself for his American election coverage) would be one of our most honest,neutral,
experienced Political Analysts NZ has/had.
I don’t think “scaremongering” is part of his ‘tool kit’.
Be careful, when dealing with these sorts of issues, that your reasoning is not subjective instead of objective.
Cheers.
The Greens have Knifed Winston in the Past also.
Barry Coates makes Chris Trotter look like the middle of the road Blairite that he is, I get tired of listening to his weak-kneed stance on anything.
Can someone tell me what he actually stands for? It’s easy to lose track of what he represents because of his cringing attitude regarding having a principled stance on anything.
Corbyn is calling for an election in the UK only weeks after the last one and it has not appeared to have affected his popular support. Of cause, Corbyn has successfully beheaded the Blairites in his party whereas Labour here is still in the process of doing so.
Chris appears to fully support this attitude of not being for or against anything and he just can’t come to grips with the fact…that the Greens represent principle.
Spot on Peter – recent writing in this blog would suggest that writers are more interested in having their own point of view aired, than in changing this Government for the sake of all
No one in NZ politics has Corbyn’s work ethic , or his set of long held long proven values. So no one in NZ politics has the respect Corbyn has. There is no comparison to be made.
I can’t speak for Chris Trotters knees never having seen them much less experienced their weaknesses or strengths but I can say, from reading @ CT’s Posts here, the fellow has a formidably strong brain part. It’s not necessarily his fault that we can’t intellecshully keep up.
CT does what he does best and that is to remain, as much as possible, impartial so as to gather in all the information. After all, if you want to know what’s on the enemy’s mind then break bread with the enemy, or at least try and see their point of view, Isn’t that right winston peters? Or was there something else going on in your funny little mind when you were doing the cafe thing with don brash dahling?
On the Greens thing. ( I fascinate me, I really do. I ever know what I’m going to come out with next.)
The Greens should change that god awful name to , say, The Environmental Warriors Party and have a banner like two crossed swords over a Pansy. ( I know what you’re thinking… )
If they spoke of the sanctity of all living things and the security of our space ship; earth, they’d get pelted with savaloys and tomato sauce then towed out of town behind a seven litre V8 son. The Greens have to play the wanky game of softly-softly with us or we’d all freak out then beat up the mister/missus, either -iether. The voter numbers the Greens need are like the ones who voted trump. The Boo Yeah Mutha Fucka Grip Your Diddle types. And there are a lot of them, even here in Nu Zillind mate. Do you watch TV? You do? Then, you will know the up hill battle the Greens have on their recycled plate. Do you really expect @ CT to try to appeal to that particular demographic? Think of the gibberish he’d have to write?
” Hey Dumbass! Tha Greens an’ that aye? Fuckin’ Green as. I like Green. I like Grass. Grass is green so, yeah/nah. Green. ”
I think the problem for the Green Party is that those who are smart enough to know, also know that they like the artificial house prices they can borrow against. That’s why, National.
National are so over stuffed with money now that they really don’t give a fuck and Labour have the specter of a gargantuan 1980’s swindle to live with while the perps of that swindle now hang from the Bat Cave that is ACT as NZ First run a deflective defense against any inquiry as to where our money went while the Arse Pickers and Ball Scratchers Party does well in Western Southland. My suggestion? Get debt free asap and learn how to paint sunsets and pluck chickens and leave Chris Trotter alone.
Has anyone else seen ‘ Team America. World Police. ” America ! Fuck yea ! ”
” Mat Damon! ” Ba hahahahahaha ahaha aha a a That sex scene! I nearly, literally died laughing.
Ses it all.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Team_America:_World_Police
I couldn’t survive another wet weekend on a diet of ” Idiocracy, Mars Attacks and Team America.” I’d have to get carted away.
Countryboy, you are a poetical boy. Without the tiresome poetry.
Trotter is strung out halfway between principle and pragmatism. He has often spoken for me (and us I assume) in the long dark age of the rich’s rule–and you can’t appreciate golden shards better than in that black.
He just doesn’t think revolution is possible in the few months before the next election with this cast of characters. His recommendation for the Mana/Internet Party last election prove his revolutionary spirit.
But it raises the question whether pragmatism can be cut with principle amid 3 year election cycles and 30 year truth cycles. We have no uncompromised Corbyns and Sanderses left. Better Trotter, as our talker, never narrowed his mind to the former.
CB, you are the colourific muralist of NZ politics.
Chris stands for making people think and react. He’s quite good at it isn’t he.
D J S
Very poor and evasive interview on NZ Radio this morning by James Shaw. If I was a Green voter I’d be highly suspicious of this Tory-like character. He daren’t say outright that he would not go with a Labour/NZ First coalition because it would scare the horses before the election – yet probably would accept it afterwards – and betray many Green supporters. What a lousy politician.
Very poor and evasive interview on NZ Radio this morning by James Shaw. If I was a Green voter I’d be highly suspicious of this Tory-like character. He daren’t say outright that he would not go with a Labour/NZ First coalition because it would scare the horses before the election – yet probably would accept it afterwards – and betray many Green supporters. What a lousy politician.
Greens are having a teething problem. Bad time for ANY of their potential coalition partners (Labour or NZ First) to have a go at them. Only helps National just like last election with the clusterfuck of opposition fighting each other (in particular Labour).
Even heard the phrase ‘if you can’t say something nice, don’t say it at all’.
In the interests of a change of government, Labour, Greens and NZ First should follow ‘zip it’ with each other. Yes, they do not agree on all policies, but if their over riding vision is to change the government and reverse the National party rot, then they need to concentrate on getting National out and not get distracted, like last election with scoring points against each other only to be losers, yet again.
National need disharmony as they have nothing else good to talk about and opposition bickering keeping their clusterfucks for the last 9 years out of the headlines is gold for them.
More good work from the Greens.
The last thing I want is a Labour + NZ First government. That will mean the left’s solution is conservative third-way, or neoliberalism without the identity politics.
Labour have screwed up this election. They should have shifted left, but instead they too a step back into conservatism. Maybe Labour will find their roots again in 2020.
I think the best option from here is a National + NZ First govt. Going into coalition with Winnie always means you lose next time. And hopefully Labour will ditch Little and find a leader who will shift Labour out of the neoliberal gutter.
I doubt Winston is capable of working with the Greens constructively anyway.
I doubt this version of the NZ Green Party are capable of working constructively with NZ First. The reality is many former green voters now vote for NZ First Janine.
Yeah right. The only way that will happen is if the person is delirious and disorientated with their head up their arse.
Or slightly miffed that the Greens have made a slight tactical error as of late. I would prefer if we gave support to the incoming Labour led Greens / NZ First government rather than focusing on side issues and tearing each other down in some sort of preemptive pre election exercise in self destruction.
What the end game goal is – is to sack this National government. That, – and that only , – should be the primary focus . Not this self defeating infighting and constant threads dedicated to it.
Face it , – at the end of the day , (did I just say a ‘ Keyism’ ?) the goal is to get rid of National for a very ,very , long long time.
And Labour , Greens and NZ First are the party’s to do it.
And they can . And we should be supporting them to do so. Lets get in behind all three party’s even if that means some disagreements on perceptions , or minor points of policy.
The end reward for that loyalty is a renaissance for New Zealand. And that will be magnificent.
Wild Katipo;
“The end reward for that loyalty is a renaissance for New Zealand. And that will be magnificent.”
How very, very, very true.
Open your minds to the bigger picture,folks.
Cheers.
Wild Katipo;
“The end reward for that loyalty is a renaissance for New Zealand. And that will be magnificent.”
How very, very, very true.
Open your minds to the bigger picture,folks.
Cheers.
Yeah, how many times has he called them separatists?
Storm in a teacup.
Compared to the REALITY of what the National party have been doing to this country over the past 9 years , … this is nothing.
Try a little bit of DIRTY POLITICS, then try a little bit of mass surveillance and the XKEYSCORE program , try a little bit of the HOUSING CRISIS , try a little bit of BENEFICIARY BASHING , try a little bit of NZ workers are too LAZY AND DRUG ADDLED so we have to import cheap labour from Asia to keep those wages low, try a little bit of common assault via ponytail pulling, try a bit more of Aaron Gilmore and Barclay…
The list goes on ,.. and on , .. and on , … and on…
Or perhaps even some of Blips Honest john lies…
…………………………………
01 – I promise to always be honest
02 – We’re not proposing to change the Employment Relations Act in a way that weakens unions
03 – we are not going to sack public servants, the attrition rate will reduce costs
04 – we are not going to cut working for families
05 – I firmly believe in climate change and always have
06 – We seek a 50% reduction in New Zealand’s carbon-equivalent net emissions, as compared to 1990 levels, by 2050. 50 by 50. We will write the target into law.
07 – National Ltd™ will provide a consistent incentive for both biofuel and biodiesel by exempting them from excise tax or road user charges
08 – I didn’t know about The Bretheren election tactics
09 – If they came to us now with that proposal [re trans-Tasman Therapeutic Goods regime], we will sign it
10 – I can’t remember my position on the 1981 Springbok Tour
11 – Tranzrail shares
12 – I did not mislead the House (1)
13 – Lord Ashcroft
14 – National Ltd™ would not have sent troops into Iraq
15 – Standard & Poors credit downgrade
16 – the double-down grade doesn’t really matter and its only about private sector debt
17 – I did not mislead the House (2)
18 – I didn’t say I want wages to drop
19 – the real rate of inflation is 3.3 percent.
20 – the tourism sector has not lost 7,000 jobs
21 – no I have never heard of Whitechapel
22 – I won’t raise GST
23 – people who are on the average wage and have a child are $48 a week better off after the rise in GST
24 – the purchase of farmland, by overseas buyers will be limited to ten farms per purchase
25 – the Pike River Mine was consented to under a Labour Government
26 – no promises were made to get the remains of the miners out of the Pike River mine
27 – I did not provide a view on the safety of the Pike River coalmine
28 – I did not mislead the House (3)
29 – capping, not cutting the public service
30 – raising the minimum wage to $15 per hour will cost 6000 jobs
31 – north of $50 a week
32 – privatisation won’t significantly help the economy
33 – wave goodbye to higher taxes , not your loved ones
34 – I never offered Brash a diplomatic job in London
35 – Tariana Turia is “totally fine” with the Tuhoe Treaty Claim deal
36 – Kiwisaver
37 – National Ltd™ is not going to radically reorganise the structure of the public sector
38 – tax cuts won’t require additional borrowing
39 – New Zealand does not have a debt problem
40 – New Zealand troops in Afghanistan will only be involved in training, not fighting
41 – the wage gap between New Zealand and Australia has closed under my National Ltd™ government
42 – It took 9 years for Labour to make a complete and utter mess of the economy
43 – National Ltd™ has changed the Overseas Investment Act to include 19 different criteria
44 – the price of goods and services has risen by 6 per cent since the last election, while the has actually gone up by 16 per cent
45 – no, although its a week ago and here I am being interviewed on television about them, I havn’t seen Gerry Brownlee’s comments regarding demolitions in Christchurch and which caused such outrage, but I can talk all about them
46 – our SAS soldiers were not involved in the Kabul Hotel gunfight
47 – the use of the Vela brother’s helicopter was required so I could attend meetings relating to national/international security concerns
48 – the DPS makes the decision about accompanying the Prime Minister or not, I had no choice but to take them on holiday to Hawaii
49 – I did not mislead the House (4)
50 – oh, maybe our SAS soldiers were in the Kabul hotel gun fight but they weren’t wounded by friendly fire
51 – New Zealand has lost $12 billion from GDP due to the Christchurch earthquake . . . oh, it might actually be around $15 billion from GDP due to the Christchurch earthquake . . . Blinglish said what?
52 – 10,000 houses will have to be demolished in Christchurch due to the earthquake
53 – 14,000 new apprentices will start training over the next five years, over and above the number previously forecast
54 – Our amendments to the ETS ensure we will continue to do our fair share internationally
55 – we are committed to honouring our Kyoto Protocol obligations
56 – any changes to the ETS will be fiscally neutral
57 – we [NZ] have grown for eight of the last nine quarters”
58 – National Ltd™ will tender out the government banking contract
59 – we will be back in surplus by 2014-15
60 – Nicky Hager’s book “Other People’s Wars” is a work of fiction
61 – unemployment is starting to fall
62 – we have created 60,000 jobs
63 – we have created 45,000 jobs
64 – the 2011 Budget will create in the order of 170,000 jobs
65 – I don’t know if I own a vineyard
66 – no, I did not mislead the House (5)
67 – the Isreali spy killed in the Christchurch quake had “only one” passport
68 – the Police will not need to make savings by losing jobs
69 – GCSB re Kim Dotcom x 3 (that we know about)
70 – I did not mislead the House (6)
71 – I voted to keep the drinking age at 20
72 – New Zealand is 100% Pure
73 – I’ve been prime minister for four years, and it’s really 24 hours a day, seven days a week, 365 days a year
74 – baseball in New Zealand is attracting more government support
75 – the decision to buy brand new BMWs was made by the Department of Internal Affairs without reference either to their minister or to me
76 – I didn’t have a clue that Ministerial Services, which I am in charge of, was going to buy brand new BMWs
77 – even though two of my ministers knew all about it, I didn’t have a clue that brand new BMWs were being bought.
78 – even though my Chief of Staff met with officials to discuss purchase of the the brand new BMWs, I didn’t have a clue
79 – Labour forced us into buying the brand new BMWs, its their fault
80 – ummm, look, sorry about that BMW thing , it was because I was so upset about the death of a New Zealand soldier and Julia Gillard was visit too
81 – the public demanded that we change the labour laws for The Hobbit
82 – “The Hobbit” created 3000 new jobs
83 – we have delivered 800 extra doctors in the public service
84 – I did not mislead the House (7)
85 – I wasn’t working at Elders when the sham foreign exchange deals took place
86 – I was starting School Certificate exams in 1978
87 – I don’t know who arrived on the CIA jet to visit the spies I am responsible for
88 – reducing barriers to property developers will increase the availability of affordable housing
89 – Labour left the economy in poor shape
90 – forecasts show unemployment will fall
91 – we have closed the wage gap with Australia by $27
92 – Ngati Porou and Whanau Apanui are not opposed to mining
93 – I have not had any meetings with Media Works
94 – our [NZ’s] terms of trade remain high
95 – the TPP is an example of democracy
96 – National Ltd™ will use the proceeds of state asset sales to invest in other public assets, like schools and hospitals
97 – New Zealand troops will be out of Afghanistan by April 2013
98 – overseas investment in New Zealand adds to what New Zealanders can invest on their own
99 – overseas investment in New Zealand creates jobs, boosts incomes, and helps the economy grow
100 – National Ltd™ will build 2000 houses over the next two years
101 – there are only 4 New Zealand SAS soldiers in Bamiyan and all working in the area of logistics and planning only
102 – selling state assets will give cash equity to those companies
103 – the Sky City deal doesn’t mean more pokies
104 – there was nothing improper about the Sky City deal
105 – my office has had no correspondence, no discussions, no involvement with the Sky City deal
106 – SkyCity will only get “a few more” pokie machines at the margins
107 – any changes to gambling regulations will be subject to a full public submission process
108 – Sky City has approached TVNZ about the purchase/use of government-owned land
109 – the Auditor General has fully vindicated National over the Sky City deal
110 – there’s a 50/50 chance the Hobbit is going off shore unless we do something
111 – David Shearer has signed up for the purchase of shares in Mighty River
112 – Solid Energy asked the government for a $1 billion capital investment
113 – fracking has been going safely on in Taranaki for the past 30 years without any issues
114 – no front line positions will be lost at DoC
115 – Iain Rennie came to me and recommended Fletcher for the GCSB job
116 – I forgot that after I scrapped the shortlist for GCSB job I phoned a life-long friend to tell him to apply for the position
117 – I told Iain Rennie I would contact Fletcher
118 – for 30 years, or three decades, I didn’t have any dinners or lunches or breakfasts with Ian Fletche
119 – I did not mislead the House (8)
120 – No, I did not say we would follow the US and Australia into a war against North Korea
121 – I paid for that lunch and I’ve got the credit card bill to prove it
122 – I called directory service to get Ian Fletcher’s number
123 – I did not mislead the house (9)
124 – I am honest and upfront
125 – cyber terrorists have attempted to gain access to information about weapons of mass destruction held on New Zealand computers
126 – the illegal spying on Kim Dotcom was an isolated incident
127 – New Zealand has an arrangement to have asylum seekers processed in Australian detention camps
128 – the law which says the GCSB cannot spy on New Zealanders is not clear
129 – the only way net new jobs can be created is by private investors putting their money into businesses in New Zealand
130 – an increase in the number of people looking for work indicates that confidence is returning to the economy
131 – the 10 percent of taxpayers in New Zealand who are the top earners pay 76 percent of all net personal tax.
132 – I did not mislead the House (10)
133 – the substantial wage growth under Labour was eroded by inflation
134 – National Ltd™’s 2010 tax changes were fiscally neutral
135 I did not mislead the House (11)
136 – the bulk of New Zealanders earn between $45,000 and $75,000 a year
137 – Pike River Coal did not put profits and its production ahead of the safety and lives of those 29 workers.
138 – Radio Live had sought advice from the Electoral Commission about my show just before the election
139 – it is because of National Ltd™’s policies that the price of fresh fruit and vegetables has dropped.
140 – the length-of-the-country cycleway will create 4000 jobs.
141 – police training for next year has not has not been cancelled
142 – National Ltd™ has only cut back-office jobs in the health service
143 – The Crown’s dividend stream from the Meridians, the Mighty Rivers of the world is large and there is no motivation to sell assets
144 – Gross.
And now we’ve got Pike River and the ongoing lies there with Bullshit English , … oh the hell with it… you get the picture… and I’m sure we could be here all day going on about this dishonest , immoral and corrupt government.
Labour, Greens and NZ First ?
Keep your eyes on the ball , work together and go hard.
We are depending on you to do so.
Wild Katipo;
Gosh!! That is an awful lot of lying and some, I suspect.
And I bet he has no problem getting to sleep at night.
Cheers.
I’m actually rather surprised that the MSM haven’t jumped on this already, seeing as though they are always looking for any inkling of evidence that the political left are in any way divided.
Perhaps they are still too busy with Lions rugby tour whingers, Americas Cup taxpayer paid parades and weather bombs (aka storms).
But it is a fair question.
It might be a storm in a teacup, but it might be more.
I suppose it might boil down to a simple question:
Which do the Greens hate more – a National led government or a Labour led government?
Assuming it is the first, what lengths are they willing to go to stop it?
Look at the scary stuff in planning by National. It should be the Green Party highlighting this type of stuff that’s about to happen under our noses. Not being in the headlines for the wrong reasons.
What’s National’s plan for the economy? Apparently, it is to suspend all environmental law for their cronies:
http://norightturn.blogspot.co.nz/2017/07/nationals-new-muldoonism.html
Savenz;
Winnie will sort them out.
Cheers.
I hope its true! I hope theres a coup d’tat asap,this weekend even & all done and done by Monday!
Barry or Denise,Eugenie, Kennedy,David Clendon or Mojo too and maybe the American(?) would be better than Metiria or even Shaw himself!
One or both have to go!
71 Days to Go!
Turia and Flavell, slave puppets to National. So much for maori and mana!
Truly arrogance from the Greens. They have to manipulate votes by scaremongering? I would suggest to the greens to let the voters decide and they should run on their policies. Not calling other politicians racists, and now this. Sounds like they are falling fast. I think the la la land party is starting to wake up and now they are seeing a nightmare. I hope they are voted out of Parliament.
“I would suggest to the greens to let the voters decide and they should run on their policies. ”
Really Jack??
I call bullshit on that.
Winston won’t let the “voters decide”. HE WILL DECIDE WHO HE GOES INTO COALITION WITH.
So its a bit rich for you to criticise the Greens when they’ve been more upfront than Peters ever has with the voters.
Whooooaaaaa there, people!!
So, what are we saying here?
That’s it’s ok for Winston Peters to play us for chumps by not declaring prior to an election who he will join in a coalition government?
But if another party – eg the Greens – try the same tactic, then it’s suddenly a crime against our most cherished democratic traditions?! (Note sarc.)
So Peters is allowed to jiggery-poke us, but the Greens must play by another set of rules?
It’s a shame that no one has picked up on the double standards that Mr Coates has exposed.
We would do well to ask the salient question of the Hon. Winston Peters why Green “petulance” is such a crime whilst NZ First playing fast and loose with their position in parliament is not.
… ” We would do well to ask the salient question of the Hon. Winston Peters why Green “petulance” is such a crime whilst NZ First playing fast and loose with their position in parliament is not ” …
NZ First have answered that question . They clearly state time and again they are a ‘centrist’ party. Which is true and which is an incredibly clever positioning to put themselves into. It is also incredibly frustrating for those on either the left or right if they are wanting to overthrow a particular govt to have to count on NZ First because they are centrists.
Frank;
“That’s it’s ok for Winston Peters to play us for chumps by not declaring prior to an election who he will join in a coalition government?”
You have gone on about this for a while now and I can only assume it as
scaremongering.
Because as you would already know, Winston has never ever ‘declared his hand’
before the ‘cards have been dealt.’
Why would you? This is what MMP is all about.
Cheers.
“principled refusal to refuse the baubles of office”.
We are talking about Winston Peters hee. right?
“principled refusal to refuse the baubles of office”.
We are talking about Winston Peters here, right?
Chris, RYC:
Need I remind you that when Peters has joined in coalition, it has always been with the largest political party in Parliament?
In 1996, Peters coalesced with National (44 seats) to Labour (37 seats).
In 1999, as NZ First suffered a crushing set-back, Labour coalesced with the Alliance, with Supply & Confidence from the Greens.
In 2002, Labour governed in coalition with Jim Anderton’s Progressive Party, and S&C from Peter Dunne’s United Party. NZ First was again out of the picture.
In 2005, Labour won 51 seats to National’s 27. Labour coalesced with the Progressive Party, with NZ First and United Future giving S&C (plus ministerial baubles of office).
In 2008, 2011, and 2014, Key’s preternatural popularity with the propertied middle class and gullible afforded him government with minor party support (ACT, United, & Maori Party).
That has been the history.
If National retains it’s numbers in Parliament (or close to it), I see no evidence that Peters will shy away from a second National-NZ First coalition, or deal involving S&C.
Rather than criticising the Greens for not playing “The Game” perhaps we should be asking ourselves, “Why should we play Peters’ Game”?
Exactly.
He was a member of the National party.
The only coalition he’s been in was with National.
He says he goes with the party with the largest number of seats ( or is it votes?) that is likely to be National.
he’s done everything he can to keep the Greens away from power in the past… I doubt that’s changed whatever comes out of his mouth.
I predict that a vote for Winnie is a vote for National.
Oh and he’s popular with the alt right in NZ too it seems ( no surprises there)
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11888810
Greens should play hard-ball. Labour has taken it for granted because it can.
Greens could say if we are not in government, we assess each legislation on a case-by-case basis. The government would have to come grovelling asking for their permission.
A Labour-NZ first won’t dare rock the boat as an early election would be a death sentence.
Look at the cross-benches in Australian, they wield tremendous power. This is without being in government.
Greens can say, we give supply and confidence but that’s it. Come grovelling.
They would be keeping their principles without the unpopularity of being in government. They can keep NZF in check and say you have no power without us.
Try to remember the basics please. Voting for Winston is like buying a lotto ticket. Voting for Greens or Labour {or possibly Top ?} is a vote against the Nats
Best Greens, Labour and NZF stop shooting each other in the feet otherwise we can look forward to THE BRIGHTER FUTURE with National, ACT, the Maori Party and United Future for another 3 Years ?
This article completely misses the point and misplaced the blame.
The Greens are prepared for a Labour/Green/ NZF Coalition.
Winston refuses to work with the Greens. Winston is the problem.
In fact Winston has always gone with the Party with the most votes, which in this election will be National.
A vote for Winston is a vote for National, unless he decides to work it the Greens.
I agree, Peter, Winston IS the problem. We have no way of knowing which way he will jump. National? Labour? Who knows.
At least the Greens are upfront and honest with their declarations and NO ONE can misunderstand their intentions. It’s a shame the same cannot be said of Peters.
Otto Mann;
See my reply to Frank that should be just above.
And when will you guys learn? As with Brexit/Farage and Trump,
the more you keep bashing the man the more his support will surge.
Why? Because the peoples of the world have finally woken up.
Elections are about policy, not people.
Cheers.
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