1News Multi-Party Debate Review – Seymour and Winston attack each other all debate

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Jack is finally fronting one of the debates.

After the way Winston threatened Jack with his job for asking him hard questions, it’s funny watching them cross swords again.

SHOTS FIRED

David attacks Winston right after the opening statements.

Oh the Alliance of Arseholes will be a joy to behold.

James Shaw points out that National = ACT and NZF extremism.

Great question from Jack – is Green hate of National greater than their desire to help the environment.

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Rawiri is actually very funny and I had doubts about him being in this debate, but he’s nailing it.

Climate change is on, seeing as NZ First and ACT are climate deniers, it’s outrageous they are even allowed got speak on it.

Climate Change is an existential threat, and we have no choice but to adapt and change because catastrophic weather events will disrupt the agricultural calendar.

Claiming that our Framers are the most efficient in the world means nothing – catastrophic change to our agricultural cycle is coming whether we like it or not!

Next up, the never ending love for cows.

A cow creates the feacal load of 14 humans.

There are 10million cows.

That’s the equivalent of 140 human beings pissing and shitting into our rivers every year.

No wonder 2/3rds of our Rivers are too polluted to swim in!

David claims ACTs climate denialism was written in 2008, which is true, but ACT STILL HAD IT ON THEIR WEBSITE IN 2016!!!!

So they were climate deniers last decade using the previous decades lies!

Why the Christ should a climate denial Party have anything to do with trying to slow down change again?

Watching Rawiri talk over Winston’s race baiting was beautiful. I loved watching Winston get angrier and angrier.

David is playing his whitewashed race baiting bullshit. He ignores the impact of race, he ignores self sovereignty, he ignores his own race baiting and he whitewashes the impact of negative colonialism.

James is the voice of reason.

Co-governance has been hijacked by the Right into an existential threat against Western Democracy.

Rawiri points out that he doesn’t have race rights but have Treaty rights!

David is trying to explain how his racist referendum that will redefine the Treaty and force it upon Māori won’t start a race war.

His bullshit argument will open a debate that will be ugly and racist.

David claims no one can point to one thing that he has said or done that is race baiting.

Well allow me to clear that up.

When David released the unique code for Māori to be vaccinated, that was a public health vandalism stunt that he used to race bait Māori.

When he called Opotoki ‘Mogadishu’, he was race baiting.

When he called gang member behaviour, ‘subhuman’, he was race baiting.

When he claims this…

…he’s race baiting.

When he wants to remove January 2nd as a State Holiday because of ‘Matariki’, he is race baiting!

When he does his pseudo one law for all wank, he is race baiting.

When he looks to amputate all the Ministries that aren’t male and white, he’s race baiting.

Look, most of the time he opens his mouth, it’s race baiting.

He’s now arguing why building a prison empire is important for society.

The Dunedin Study however shows coming from poor backgrounds does have an impact on crime.

Labour’s drive to lower the prison population is admirable because with almost 60% recidivism rates nothing says you are likely to go to prison again more than being in prison in the first place but clearly the means to monitor the huge jump in home detention has not been met with proper monitoring of prisoners on home detention or updating ankle bracelet technology so we have a situation where heinous crimes are being committed because prisoners can just wrap tin foil around their bracelets to confuse the system.

It’s another example of a big plan by Labour with none of the properly funded oversight!

However, in 2016/17, the 12-month recidivism rate was 46.8 per cent while the 24-month rate was 60.9 per cent. The latest rates, for 2021/22, show these falling to 35.8 per cent and 56.5 per cent respectively. Labour’s prison policy is bringing recidivism down, yet the angry electorate want revenge, not justice!

Ram Raids and Gang turf wars generate enormous attention but if we look at the stats we see a very different reality of crime for the vast majority of Kiwis.

In 2022 – there were 886 ram-raids, 57 murders and 175,573 domestic violence investigations.

Ram raids and murders are terrible crimes, but their numbers pale into insignificance when you look at domestic violence in New Zealand – we are very selective when we discuss crime this election.

Of course there is more crime, we had over a thousand hard core criminals deported from Australia straight into the domestic gang world using extreme violence and vastly higher sophistication to take over the domestic meth trade by importing purer and cheaper Meth from their South American Cartel links.

Banning Gang Patches won’t do that, a targeted move against the 501 syndicates who are generating the Turf war will do it, but none of these politicians ever seem to be vaguely aware of the mechanics off the meth trade and the 501 syndicate influence.

The average age of these Ram Raid perpetrators mean that they were the children of John Key’s State Housing meth evictions and were the children living in cars – our disconnect between the environment these children were raised in and our refusal to do anything meaningful on child poverty means a never ending river of broken boys and girls who damage society and the only solution being boot camps that don’t work and more prisons:

To date the sophistication of the debate has been ACT wanting ankle bracelets on 11 year olds, National wanting them on 10 year olds while Labour wants them on 12 year olds!

Robbing Gen X of our super is debated next.

Winston is defending 65.

James in defending 65.

Rawiri is defending 65.

David Seymour wants it to rob us.

Surprise. Surprise.

No one thinks National’s Foreign Buyers tac will win.

Winston isn’t aware that GST of fruit and vegetables was on his website. He seems very confused.

David is back attacking the red tape that protects you and a functioning democracy.

James is championing wealth tax.

Winston wants to investigate supermarkets and banks.

Rawiri is pointing out Māori Party tax policy will do more to counter inequality than anyone else’s policy.

David is boasting slashing 15 000 jobs.

Boasting.

He’s boasting the amputation of the State.

Jesus wept.

Winston is wandering off on something.

Education is talked about, nothing is solved. The answer of course is Billions more into our schools and use them as community hubs, with free breakfasts and lunches and we should fund that by taxing the rich.

Winston is appealing to feral antivaxxers.

Which is funny because…

David reminds everyone that ACT wants to punish and hurt criminals and the poor.

Jack notes that race baiting and hate has been stirred up and asks how the 4 have calmed things down.

Winston and David make pious noises.

Rawiri attacks them.

Beautiful.

James won, Rawiri was second, David was third, Winston wandered off somewhere.

The panel afterwards is very dull.

Guyon Espiner’s hair is on meth.

Janet Wilson’s face was unbelievable.

Kris Faafoi is as useless as he was when he was a Cabinet Minister.

Jessica looked shocked at Janet’s face.

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50 COMMENTS

  1. Rawiri was the stand out, lied completely but great performance.

    Winston waffled.

    Seymour said nothing new.

    Shaw tried to look edgey with a bunch of rehearsed one liners attacking Seymour.
    There’s a difference in respect given to an angry Rottweiler or a chihuahua, Shaw lacks big dog energy.

    All candidates were playing their base, doubt many votes changed hands.
    Tame was OK but asked no hard questions of Shaw (white cis males) or Waititi (genetic superiority on their website) but did of Peters and Seymour (“race baiting”) so not unbiased.

    • Tell me his lies?
      All three political analysts disagree with you and none mentioned lies. Seems you are a liar but we knew that already.
      Great performance by yourself however.
      Best line was Wiston to Seymour” put your big boy pants on”
      Seymour was childlike and Winston geriatric.
      Shaw outstanding as mentioned by the panel. Your biased view is on show so nothing new.
      Tame asked the same question of all leaders, seems you watched what you wanted to see.
      You are embarrassing.

      • Neihana, you have this dislike for indigenous peoples exercising their self-determinations similarly your indefensible support for the racist jewish state treatment of the indigenous Palestinians.

        • Tipene – Yawn..Both David Seymour and Winston Peters are Maori, and yet, you kick them…why? Whakapapa is whakapapa…deal with it. As for the Middle East stuff, stay on topic.

  2. How about a referendum on the westminster system that was foisted on us instead of the treaty ?

    The country is fucked because of the racist political/judicial system and white European cis males, not because of the treaty and Pasifikans, inclusive of Maori.

  3. Far too much muffling for the last days of the species. Down to Shaw. He has to configure his anger.

    There is a fury in the world, I see it often, in political causes as well.It’s needed now.

  4. Can someone ask Whinny what he was talking to don ‘bare chest’ brash about in that photograph outside that cafe that time.
    winston peters and the Twerk are fuckin with ya.

  5. I wondered why you were so adamant for us NOT to vote before Oct 14 and not vote early, MB.
    I got my answer in no uncertain terms last night with the deplorable, juvenile cat-fight between two potential coalition parties for National.
    A lot can vote-changing behaviour can happen in the days between now and Oct 14 – and it sure IS happening!
    Good advice, MB!

      • Mmm … the Right have a mortgage on civic engagement, do they? One stop away from saying only Christians can pass through the pearly gates, or only the civilized have human rights.

        • Mmmm … Maybe, Bozo! The Right are ‘born to rule’, aren’t they? Like the Cons in UK who are said to be the Tory Party at Prayer, so the Right are here…

          And reading Tova O’Brien’s story today about Luxon and Greg Fleming vis-a-vis their past and present views on Christianity, it seems equivocation and prevarication is the name of their game.

  6. “Great question from Jack – is Green hate of National greater than their desire to help the environment.”

    He didn’t answer the question though- Jack should have pressed him on this.

  7. Winstone looked very tired he forgot his own policies. I just sped read his manifesto it says a lot about what they want to do but lacks how they will do it and how much policies will cost. He needs to retire he is living in the past.

  8. The panels have been average to poor. Don’t need to hear from previous useless Cabniet ministers, why do they glorify previous useless Minister s

    Chris Trotter is always great with his analysis.

    James Off Shaw I think said National are hated more than saving the environment

    • Your name calling shows the maturity of a 6 year old and renders your comment useless.

    • “National are hated more than saving the environment”, which is a stupid, and self defeating thing to say when ones core political motivation dictates total opposition to most of what “the national party” will do.. Which is why he didn’t say it.. It would be an oversimplification that could be interpreted in any way one wished… Which is probably why Tame didn’t push it either. Not enough time available to waste on that “cul-de-sac”.

  9. National were the ones that neglected our train tracks they sold NZ Rail and Labour had to buy back the train tracks Raijin.

    • Kinda agree Jack. Greta Thunburg’s infamous words are not lost. Its all blah blah blah from politicians. But we’re all part of the problem, don’t ya think, and part of the solution.

  10. Too bad the question on defence was missed – again.

    Q: ‘Does your party support Defence Minister Andrew Little joining New Zealand to Pillar 2 AUKUS?’

    Given this question, Rawiri Waititi would have outshone the rest, to win the multi-party debate with James Shaw second.

    “James won, Rawiri was second, David was third, Winston wandered off somewhere.” Martyn Bradbury

    AUKUS is an election issue
    by Teuila Fuatai | Sep 24, 2023 | 0 | 12 min read

    https://e-tangata.co.nz/comment-and-analysis/aukus-is-an-election-issue/

    ,,,,For New Zealand, any role in AUKUS will likely be determined by a new government, after the October election.
    But, despite disquiet in the region about growing militarisation, we’ve had very little information from our major parties about what they believe New Zealand’s position on AUKUS should be, and why. And there are worrying signs that our politicians aren’t up to speed on what’s at stake if we join the AUKUS alliance….

    AUKUS
    https://www.csis.org/analysis/aukus-pillar-two-advancing-capabilities-united-states-united-kingdom-and-australia

    ….To realize the full potential of Pillar Two, the United States should reassure its AUKUS partners by taking radical steps to overcome barriers to cooperation, improve information sharing, and reform export controls….

    “Reform Export Controls”. Now what the hell does that mean?

    If the AUKUS partners, Australia, the US and UK, imposed trade sanctions on China, would New Zealand have to abide by them?
    Even to the destruction of our economy?

  11. James and Rawiri won the night hands down. Both were straight to the point and concise. David Seymour was playing himself as usual … all mouth and Mr Smarty pants. As for Winston, I think time has got the better of him now. That point was very obvious last night. He needs to step down from politics and stop wasting votes by hanging on. Retire with some dignity while you can Winnie.

    Should NACTNZF become the next government (OMG!), Luxon will have his hands full with a geriatric who’s becoming more lost than found these days and with Seymour, wanting to be the puppet master! Stock up on popcorn good folks and hang on tight, just in case. Could be some turbulence along the way!

      • /agreed
        If you look into Mr Smartypants background, it’s easy to see his/her/its ego rising – which is not an excuse, more a background and explanation. He’s the kind of guy one hopes one’s daughter never falls in love with.
        Is he ‘on the spectrum’ by any chance. Sure as shit there’s something a little awry with socialisation in his upbringing.
        Maybe Seymore spending a little time with the dominatrix Willis could be of mutual benefit to them both, although it’d be at the expense of the rest of us.
        How the hell did it come to this?

  12. Shaw was the only one with consistently sane responses across every topic that was discussed, though his sweet reasonableness might seem dull to some. Waititi was pretty good on most topics, but I thought some of the things he said implied that he wanted parallel Maori political systems which if taken too far would be difficult constitutionally, would not get public support and would make co-governance of water look like a stroll in the park. Seymour – as expected, he’s a deluded, small state, leave it to the market, far-right libertarian straight out of the 1980’s who would cause massive harm – and as a person he’s just a bit weird. Peters is incoherent and irascible – very little of what he tried to say made sense.
    As a whole it was just awful and was followed up by an ‘expert’ panel who were shockingly bad and spent all their time in horse-race commentary about the impressions the leaders might have made, the motivations they might have had, and who had the best ‘zingers’. Not a single word on the content of what anyone said. No insight, no broad understanding of anything, no sense of political ideologies and what underlies them. Just smug, comfortably-off, smart-arses who are above the fray. Feels like this whole place has gone totally bonkers for no good reason. Are aliens attacking us with mind-altering stealth rays? What else could explain the insanity?

  13. Sorry. I was watching Homeland again. I’m up to series 8. Man it’s good tv on the net. What did I miss?

  14. Unfortunately, your (and my) complete truths don’t ring out.

    What to do?

    But I don’t think Shaw won the debate at all. Disappointed. 40 years of a Left that can’t shout for truth. So, by definition, not a Left.

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