The Demonstration Effect.

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WHAT HAPPENED IN AUCKLAND on Saturday, 25 March 2023, revealed the power of officially-sanctioned protest. That power was demonstrated to even greater effect the following day in Wellington. New Zealanders are blessedly unfamiliar with this type of politics, which is more commonly associated with authoritarian regimes such as Viktor Orban’s Hungary, or Nicolás Maduro’s Venezuela. Nevertheless, the mass demonstrations against Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull (a.k.a “Posie Parker”) strongly backed by government ministers and the state-owned media, revealed just how potent a weapon the mass mobilisation of sympathetic citizens by official, or quasi-official, forces backed up by the news media, can be.

Since Keen-Minshull has announced her intention to visit New Zealand again in September of this year (perilously close to the election date!) it will be interesting to see whether the same politicians and media outlets who denounced her attitudes towards the trans community back in March – “inflammatory, vile and incorrect” – are prepared to offer the electorate a repeat performance six months later. Were they to do so, there can be little doubt that the result would be the same. New Zealanders sympathetic to the trans-gender cause would rally against Keen-Minshull in their thousands.

The response of those who share Keen-Minshull’s views about the impact trans-gender ideology is having on the rights of women and children will, however, be very different the second time around. Should Keen-Minshull return to these shores in September, she is certain to arouse a powerfully demonstrative response from those who support her cause. The March spectacle of 2,000 trans-gender activists and their supporters drowning-out and then physically attacking Keen-Minshull and her fewer than 100 supporters is unlikely to be repeated.

Citizens hailing from both the left and the right of the political spectrum will not be backward in coming forward to Keen-Minshull’s defence. Moreover, since the trans community set the rules of political engagement so violently in March, Keen-Minshull’s defenders in September are unlikely to pull their punches.

Given, that Keen-Minshull is calling for New Zealand women to speak up for their rights outside the Auckland courtroom in which the person who showered her with tomato juice back in March is set to stand trial, the egregiously “hands-off” policing on display on 25 March (now the subject of an internal Police investigation) will not be an option. Indeed, if two vast crowds of mutually hostile demonstrators seem determined to confront one another outside His Majesty’s courthouse, then Police Commissioner Andrew Coster has no option but to prepare a very “hands-on” response. Hundreds of police officers will be required to maintain public order.

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Scarcely a fortnight out from the General Election, with early voting already underway, it is difficult to conceive of anything the Labour Government would welcome less than dramatic evidence of the deep political animosities dividing New Zealand society. The very real possibility that some deluded individual, inflamed by the white-hot passions besetting the trans-gender issue, might turn protest into tragedy, will only heighten the Government’s trepidation. Political violence on the streets is the last thing Prime Minister Chris Hipkins needs as he goes head-to-head with the Opposition leader, Christopher Luxon.

Which is why Immigration Minister Andrew Little will be under enormous pressure to deny Keen-Minshull entry to New Zealand under Section 16:1(iii) of the Immigration Act – the sub-clause which authorises the Minister to deny entry to any non-New Zealand citizen who “is, or is likely to be, a threat or risk to public order”. This was the clause cited by the trans community back in March as they attempted to keep Keen-Minshull out of the country. The courts ruled against them then, but they may not to do so a second time. It would not be difficult for Little to make the case that Keen-Minshull’s arrival in March did, as predicted, contribute to a breakdown of public order, and that given the intensity of feeling aroused by her ideas, and by other people’s reaction to those ideas, it risked doing so again if she was granted permission to enter New Zealand.

What Little almost certainly would not mention is that, back in March, Keen-Minshull’s opponents were arguing that public order would be threatened by attacks on the trans community perpetrated by Keen-Minshull and her supporters. If a second attempt is made to keep her out, Keen-Minshull’s defenders will, quite justifiably, respond that on 25 March it was the supporters of the trans community who broke through crowd barriers to harry, harass, and inflict serious physical and emotional harm upon the few dozen people, many of them elderly, who had assembled in Albert Park to join Keen-Minshull in speaking up for women’s rights.

If Little does decide to bar Keen-Minshull’s entry, then the story is most unlikely to end there. The Free Speech Union (of which the author of this opinion-piece is a member) is practically certain to launch a bid to rescue Keen-Minshull from the so-called “Thug’s Veto”. It will argue that those presenting disorder as the most likely outcome of Keen-Minshull’s visit and, hence, the best reason for banning it, are the very people most likely to cause it. Equivalent to Ku Klux Klansmen warning a civil rights worker that if she insists upon addressing the local Black Baptist congregation, then there’s just no telling what might happen to their little church.

Recognising Labour’s discomfort, National and Act would be most unlikely to refuse the political gains of presenting themselves as the staunch defenders of Free Speech. Nor would they likely forgo the opportunity to castigate the Labour Government for lining-up with extremists who cannot give a straight answer to the question: “What is a woman?” They would pillory Labour, the Greens and Te Pāti Māori for lacking the guts to defend the core principles of a democratic society. The Right’s message to the country would be unequivocal: Those who threaten the right of freedom of expression must not be appeased, they must be fought!

The parties of the Right might even feel emboldened to take a leaf out of Labour’s own playbook by throwing their weight behind a mass demonstration in support of New Zealanders’ right to speak freely and without fear of being shouted down or attacked. Were they to help organise such an event, they could be absolutely certain that elements of the Left would not be able to resist organising a counter-demonstration. Like Keen-Minshull, herself, they could rely upon the intolerance and aggression of their political opponents to clinch the argument.

What the Labour Government should do, of course, is what any democratic government should do in such circumstances: uphold the right of both sides to make their case. Let Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull and her supporters have their say. Let the trans community register its disagreement and disgust. And make damn sure that hundreds of cops, in full riot-gear, are standing between them. Holding the ring, as the state is bound to do, and keeping the peace.

92 COMMENTS

  1. The last paragraph is substantially how it should go. Uphold freedom of assembly, speech and association while minimising violence and harm to participants.

    Is the tide turning a bit with attitudes to the trans issue–or at least the trans activist sector?

    I support trans peoples right to live their lives without harassment or discrimination, but am not keen on the language that mangles reality–“chest feeding”, “people with uteruses”. People with uteruses are women, the trendy new women–the ones with cocks and balls–are trans women in many people’s opinion.

    Lesbians and other women being attacked by trans activists has to end. Respect for rights is a two way street.

  2. Chris – That is correct – Official sanctioned protest…that turned into a official sanctioned riot.

  3. “deny entry to any non-New Zealand citizen who “is, or is likely to be, a threat or risk to public order.”

    Im fairly sure that is about actual criminals not people with unpopular political opinions.

    The unhinged Woke/Authoritarian Left should be banished from New Zealand shores for “threat or risk to public order”.

  4. Every left activist needs to see the Posie-taking-selfie image that accompanies this story.

    The deep joy in her eyes, the satisfaction of a job well done. The left fell for her scheme and undermined their own cause.

    • Reading a lot into a photo aren’t you. Others could read ‘barely disguised annoyance and contempt for her attackers’ but we would both be wrong as we have no idea what’s going on in her head. But your comment is fundamentally a distraction and would normally be called victim shaming.

      • a fa fa fa fa faaaaaa. Fa faaaa fa. A fa fa fa fa faaaaaaaaa.
        I’ll defer to your cleverness, but only if it makes you feel good.
        fa faaaa fa-fa fa fa fa faaaa fa, fa fa faaaa

      • I think Post is correct. She is a shit stirring idiot. That does not excuse what happened in terms of the violence but it doesn’t change who she is.

        Yes some of those supporting trans rights stupidly took the bait and gave her undeserved credibility (and bought shame upon themselves) but I am amazed at how many supporting women’s rights give her that same credence.

        It’s a bit like Trump. He said things to get himself elected by appealing to aggrieved people . Some of what he said was correct but people made the mistake of thinking he was genuine and actually cared.

        • we would not have needed Posie to come here wheel if the tra’s had allowed us to speak, been respectful of the many older lesbian women who are against gender ideology.

          Don’t try and palm off what happened in Albert Park as just a few bad apples. It was a violent mob. And they were aided and abetted by the Green Party who put a post on their social media saying come and fight some Nazis.

          • Anker I suggest that they should be respectful of all older women, not just of older lesbian women. It’s ok to be hetero, male or female. Respect for all older persons is a cultural norm elsewhere.

            Davidson has laboriously demonised cisgender males, this lot hate biological women, the Greens hate old people, and their combined negativity is very socially divisive and exactly what the ‘ divide and rule’ brigade want.

        • Desperate times means desperate tactics.
          This woman is not prepared to stand by and see hard fought for woman’s rights expunged by a bunch of deluded Jonny come lately’s who think they can co-opt and hijack biological sex for reasons of faddish perversion and power over women.
          Emancipation and respect comes after years of graft, dedication and perseverance and winning the battle of intelligence, wit and style not throwing childish tantrums laced with ignorance, dogma and violence.

    • The left can never be failed, right, but in this case the ‘trans euphoria seeking’ mobsters fell for their own petard.
      Again, the ‘left’ was lucky that this liquid was tomato juice and not acid.

    • Post Malone, I am not sure what your point is here.

      Posie Parker strategy in taking her cause to the street, allows people to see how the trans rights activists are.
      Authoritarian, violent thugs. They will smear you to stop you and if that dosen’t work they will smear you with tomato juice and then intimidate and hound you out of the public square. Posie Parkers assertion about the mysogeny and violence of the tras gets revealed to everyone. It is a clever astute political stratgy.
      But having taken that selfie and I have seen others in the series, she then had to be escorted from the rotunda to safety. She says she feared for her life and if you watch the clips of this, its easy to see why.

      I am afriad the trans rights activists took the bait and proved her point. The trans rights activists are a bunch of authoritarian, potential violent mysogenists.

  5. Instead “we” have hundreds of thousands on non-New Zealand citizens with voting rights. I wonder how that pans out? *crickets chirping*

  6. Great article Chris. Thanks!

    The part I’m most disturbed about is the way Costa’s Cops deliberately didn’t turn up to what was clearly going to be a fight. At this stage nobody can persuade me to think that the Minister didn’t have a quiet word with Costa, telling him to deliberately leave this woman exposed to a violent mob. Labour (formerly claiming to be the “most transparent government ever”) are now so adroit at evading OIA requests, will not be found out and I have zero confidence in the police’s ability to investigate itself.

    • Andrew. Nonsense. Once somebody explains to Commissioner Coster that biological women have rights, it should be a simple matter to trickle this down to the ranks and stop lipsticked blokes in frocks from belting them about again.

      Besides, some real men have volunteered to accompany their womenfolk next time and to protect them should the odd Labour and Green pollies and boys in blue be reluctant to do so. Those cisgender males hated on by Marama the chocolate peddler will have a chance to show that there’s more to being a man than doing things with sausage rolls.

      Besides, this time world media could be observing this antipodean backwater doing its mad imitations of Salem, Massachusetts, of two or three centuries ago. Should be fine.

      • He should not need to be explained that women – human females in 2023 have the same fucking human rights as anyone else. If he does need that education he or is it they, should not hold the post he currently holds. If he does not know that women – human females have a right to politically meet, discuss and be amongst people whom they choose to associate with without interference by others and without violencec coming their way, then he needs to go and count chickens or clean toilets or something more suited to the level of his education and knowledge/skill base.

      • > Besides, some real men have volunteered to accompany their womenfolk next time and to protect them should the odd Labour and Green pollies and boys in blue be reluctant to do so. Those cisgender males hated on by Marama the chocolate peddler will have a chance to show that there’s more to being a man than doing things with sausage rolls.

        A very bad idea if so.

        The problem isn’t a lack of police. The problem is that the cops will go after anyone who defends themselves against the enforcers of American values.

        • It could be that the police were merely being advised by their policy advisors. I doubt that the Police Minister would have told the Commissioner which way to jump. Transgender extremists have captured strands of the public service and established transgendered persons as victims, and victimhood is the currency of the identity politics left; that Albert Park occurrence was a carefully orchestrated event for which they may not have the same support systems for an encore. Sure, transgender ideology appears to be an American import, but to what extent this country is embracing American values, dunno.

  7. What happened was an officially allowed mob that just per chance and luck did not kill some women on a lifestream watched by many, and life on twitter, and life on cameras of many.

    NZ should thank its lucky star that these rioters did not kill some old Nana whilst they experience a bout of Trans euphoria, something they are obviously entitled too, a guaranteed human right to euphoria, one bashed women – human female at a time.

    And the left is still trying to find an angle that would make their women hating their chauvinistic pig attitude nice and kind and who could have forseen that people who call women Terfs or Nazi would end up punching women – human females in the face.
    But as the esteemed ‘cis’ brown female leader of the Queer Party stated, all violence on the whole world is only the fault of ‘cis’ white male, so i guess….its all good with that euphoria.
    Fuck this shit.
    It was officially sanctioned to be a riot to scare women – human females from exercising their legal rights to meet with people of their choice, to meet with people of their sex, to politically organise and to have a cup of tea afterwards. To scare them into staying at home, unseen and unheard, yada yada yada. Those of us old enough we know what happened damn well.

    As for Posie Parker, as per her X/Twitter she has her entry visa. The guys will all have another reason to clutch their inclusive perls and find another way to tell women to shut the fuck up. Males are now women and these woemanly women will tell human females what is and what is it not that they are allowed to do and with whom they have a right to meet and human females will affirm males in their idea of womanhood by hook and by crook, one broken eyesocket a time, one thrown container with liquid at a time.
    There is no difference between the Mullahs of Iran and the Trans Mullahs of NZ. They know whom the real women are and they would bash them into submission as evidenced by the past as much as the regime in Iran does.

    Well done lefty NZ, you could not have given women – human females a better reason to not vote for your troupe, who have no issues with mobs bashing women – human females in the name of trans euphoria.

    Well done left, the next right wing government is one of your own choosing. You made it, by constantly failing, by under mining the rights women – human females worked so hard to gain, by coming after kids – no one is born in the wrong body, its the only body you have, and by elevating bullies to a status they should never had in the first place. Well done Labour/well done Queer Party/well done anyone who supported that shite.

    As for Posie Parker, she has more guts in her small finger then the whole left of NZ combined has in their hands and feet.
    She knows what she is fighting for, the left in NZ and elsewhere does not. And she has a great sense of humor, something that is lacking everwhere on the left, but i guess they are serious people who are inclusive and no joking about that, balled fist and all.

    • Wonderful RB.

      Yes Labour and the Queer party have brought this all on themselves. They brought this stupid ideology into govt and legislation and were hostile and disgraceful when women tried to chalenge it in the select committee.
      I am looking at you Deborah Russell, Ginny Anderson, Elizabeth Kerekere, Louisa Wall, and others. Not to mention Jan Tinetti.
      Shame on you . You are traitors to your sex.

      • Anker why don’t you be consistent? What legislation are you referring to? If it’s about gender for example ACT and National voted the same way. Do the “traitors” on the right not get included?Those women not having the same level of paranoia as you makes them traitors to their sex. Interesting

        • No one expect anything better from the right, but for the left to pretend that women are nothing more then the euphoria a males experiences whilst using a female changing room….
          oh well……… i guess labour will find out the hard way if they have enough ‘women’ voters – no matter their sex.

    • It wasn’t an officially “allowed” trans activist mob, it was officially encouraged which is the sickening and dangerous part.
      And follow the funding of the trans activist backers to find more government involvement.
      Brown shirts.

      At least river of filth Woods won’t be able to fan the flames this time.

  8. THIS IS NOT WHO WE ARE?

    The Demonstration Effect?

    Note how the “woke” are allowed to demonstrate and get away with it while anyone else with alternative agendas is either silenced or ostracised. Political commentators have been highlighting how even the Ukraine war is being weaved into the wokeraties agenda. In other words if your truly woke, your for the Ukraine war.

    Why in NZ do we see no protests against the Ukraine War, why do we see NZs MSM and RNZ pro war stance…NZs political class (left or right) has turned into the US Neocon Democrate party.

    As Foreign Minister Nanaia Mahuta, State Secretary Antony Blinken highlight ‘strong, wide-ranging, and growing’ US-NZ relationship one has to reflect on NZs support for the Ukraine War (rather than suing for a peaceful diplomatic solution). With circa 300,000 Ukrainian soldiers dead I wonder NZ, is this “who we are”?

    Do you remember the event that led to the meme in NZ “This is not who we are”? Do you also remember the halcyon days when NZ would punch above its weight and take on the “big guy” (banned nuclear weapons in NZ).

    Unfortunately now NZs political class (left or right) are rather gutless . Happy to suck up to power under the guise of “keeping you safe”, using dis/mis/mal information to limit freedom of speech.

    Our political class is 100% pure NZ altruistic, nothing in it for them personally a? Nope… no intelligence community or NZDF state beneficiaries here

    So as they suck up to the Biden administration (NEOCONS) I wonder if NZs intelligence agencies have given our political elites the inside scoop on Volodymyr Zelensky (President of Ukraine) and the real geopolitical history of US / Russian relations with regard to Ukraine. I suspect they have… which makes NZs actions even worse. We’ve doubled down:

    MFAT: $10.59 million to the NATO Trust Fund for Ukraine
    $7.5 million to contribute to weapons and ammunition
    $4.1 million to support commercial satellite imagery

    Given the real background to the conflict and NZs support for continuation of it it I’d say we’ve turned into a bunch of gutless wonders.

    I wonder if Chris Hipkins and Foreign Minister Nanaia Mahuta will be signing up to go fight the war for the mighty Volodymyr Zelensky… Or will you just use plausible deniability to hide behind immoral decisions, nice and comfy awaiting your considerable state pensions…..

    Here’s what peaceful protest looks like:

    Here’s some solid research by Scott Ritter into the Ukraine conflict…. Bon appetite

    “As a former intelligence officer, I’ve been wondering why has no one done an investigation about Volodymyr Zelensky, the President of Ukraine? His rise to power, in my opinion, represents an incredible manipulation of world opinion that will go down in history as a classic case study in social psychological engineering: an ordinary comedian who came to power because he promised a long-awaited peace, who then dragged his fellow citizens into a bloody war that can only be described as a massacre. With the help of colleagues and experts with first-hand insights into Zelensky, I have poured over documents and video to produce a film that captures this investigation. This story has so many twists and turns that I had to break it into two parts. In the first episode, presented here, I will answer the question about Zelensky’s improbable rise to power, and how the Ukrainian President accumulated his vast wealth, a sum that has only become larger since the war with Russia began.

    In the intelligence business, every agent is assigned tasks by his or her handlers. In the case of Agent Zelensky, I’ve identified ten obligations that define his relationship with his foreign intelligence masters. Once you’ve examined each of these, it becomes clear why Zelensky the comedian said one thing, and Zelensky the President did another. What are the true reasons behind the current situation in Ukraine today? What kind of operation has the CIA been running in Ukraine over the course of many years? You will find the answers to these and other questions in Part 2 of my investigative documentary film, “Agent Zelensky.” Click here to watch Part 1.”

    An investigation of Volodymyr Zelensky. More info: https://www.scottritterextra.com/p/a-scott-ritter-investigation-agent

    Agent Zelensky – Part 1: https://rumble.com/v30nd8w-a-scott-ritter-investigation-agent-zelensky-part-2.html

  9. The trans community and supporters who are being actively aggressive are the ones who need to understand what a democracy is and their actions are offensive. In this country most of us subscribe to the idea that it’s their life so let them get on with it but we don’t subscribe to their attitude to others with different views. Enjoy your freedoms.

      • jack Government may have little interest in democracy. Their Police Com enabled silencing women in Auckland, the Human Rights Com went to Wellington to protest against Parker speaking there.

  10. It will be interesting to see whether PP gets into the country. Nice article Chris. It seems every point of discussion on anything, is provoking polarised antagonism from those with an opposing view, and this is being reflected in the results of any attempts of any group wishing to push their agenda in the public arena. this is made easy by social media where rallying the troops against anything is but a few clicks away. This same scenario happened in Hastings when Julian Batchelor tried to have an invitation meeting against Co Governance legislation. Those noisey, and disruptive, opposing the meeting complained that the police should have shut down the meeting sooner to stop any violence. Go figure. The result as with PP was that free speech is the loser. If you don’t want to hear opposing views, be noisey disruptive and as a last resort get violent to get your way. These days populist politicians and the states police find it increasingly difficult to dance on the head of a pin when these situations arise.

  11. So if I turn up at the next Labour Party meeting in my electorate with a few mates and baseball bats the Labour meeting should be cancelled?

  12. Oh how are the mighty fallen? Great causes such as emancipation from poverty, for equal access to quality healthcare, for workplace safety, for freedom from sexual violence, need I go on. More relevant than ever. All sublimated to woke issues. I don’t give a toss if you think you are being repressed by people like me because I don’t care if you want to wear a dress. Be my guest, I really don’t care. I’m more interested in more important issues.

  13. It is sad that protest in NZ is now no longer safe to go to.

    Violence and abuse has no place in NZ during protest, and government officials and others trying to backhandedly stop debate from people who have something to say, that are now no longer able to book venues or not hold them due to the allowance of toxic, violent, disruptive protestors and frightened officials – is making people despise the woke movement and government wokies even more. They shouldn’t blame Posy for something they should have been neutral on a woman’s group, in the first place.

    Gone are the days where protest was 100,000 people with kids and families and the government listened. Too dangerous now. Now its become the norm for officials to make decisions behind closed doors and laws passed that nobody read with fine print that creates major problem further down the line aka self ID gender. All while they pat themselves on the back and retrospectively try to cover their arses.

    Keeps the legal teams in action though, more troughers making laws that are going to cause major problems everywhere in NZ, for those that both agree and those that disagree who all start suing over everything to do with gender – there are only two sexes. Nobody cares and trans already had the right to live as a man or woman. The speed of woke changing sex to gender creates a whole new ball game relating to discrimination and safety for woman and girls that they refused to bother to debate.

    We have child rapist/murders in the US who now have legal claims that their rights are not met because they wanted gender treatment! It’s the new ‘rough sex’ argument for defence for rapists and murderers.

    “The ACLU sympathetically tweeted on behalf of Duane Owen, claiming he was the victim of “enormous suffering” prior to his execution. Owen was in prison for over 30 years for crimes committed in 1984. Owen allegedly stabbed and then raped 14-year-old Karen Slattery and bludgeoned 38-year-old mother Georgianna Worden with a hammer and then repeatedly raped her. Both women were reportedly dead when Owen allegedly violated their corpses. (RELATED: Transgender Inmate Gets 7 More Years After Raping Woman In Jail)” https://dailycaller.com/2023/06/18/aclu-laments-convicted-rapist-gender-affirming-care/

    I am astonished that so many politicians and lefties are now more interested in the rights of rapists and murderers than the victims they prey off and the safety of 50% of the population!

    Female athletes are suing because opportunities in sports are now much less equal.

    Companies like Bud Light trying to push a trans agenda, that costs them billions of dollars.

    Instead of helping female athletes sponsership, big brands like Nike are giving trans men bras sponsorship deals. Not a step in the right direction for equality for woman in sports, that the mostly male organisers of sports seem to have given away woman’s rights by allowing the trans trend in sports without any data or planning on what that will mean for woman. Back in the day they sex tested athletes and it was frowned on that athletes were transitioned with male hormones to help them win against woman athletes.

    The poster child of woke trans, is not popular and the average person it affects daily such as girls, woman, parents and victims of crime (in particular crimes of men against woman), have not been given the right to debate this issue and have their voices heard, before law changes.

    There are so few real trans out there, that they are preying on kids with autism to transition to try and get the number up. Or the men who dress as woman, but obviously want to keep their penis! But they are a woman apparently, not transgender! It’s fucked!

    Bring back old fashioned trans I say, like Georgina Beyer, just like bring back old fashioned woman, you know ones that don’t have a penis!

    Not even getting into sexual consent issues, with people who are pretending to be another sex on dating sites.

  14. Wonderful article. Thanks Chris. If Labour are sweating over this, they brought it on themselves. The sooner they are voted out the better .

    Signed;
    Former Labour Party member

  15. Denigrating trans people, is that the point of this person or is this issue simply a way of silencing whatever she really is here for? I don’t know her from a bar of soap but blind freddy can see what the elevation of trans issues and what wokeness was really designed to do – censor those questioning Govt actions.

  16. Rioters, activists, reactionaries, direct action groups, strikers etc. All good stuff. It’ll keep our greedy abusers up at night.
    I sometimes think of what Banksy wrote about putting graffiti on bill boards, advertising hoardings etc.
    To paraphrase: “If they think they have the right to influence you with their adds without our consent we have the write to fuck them up.”
    Posy parker thought she could come here and preach her gibberish so we exploited our right to make her run for it. Right fuckin’ On!

      • Delia. Women are free to meet as long as they don’t talk when doing so. They’d still be well advised to wear full body armour, crash helmets, steel tipped boots, and knuckle dusters. Men who would be women can do whatever they like, and the rest have – understandably – buggered off and remain little more than fond memories of more normal sorts of times.

      • we will see if women – human females are free to do that this time around, last time they tried they got bashed by some males with ambiguous pronouns. .

    • So saying that women (adult human females) should have the right to women only spaces such as change rooms and s?porting competitions is gibberish Country Boy? And that men who say they are women do not have a right to access female change spaces where there are women and girls, is that gibberish too?

      FFS man how can you not support women’s sexed based rights?

    • Gibberish? No one has been able to explain to me what work has been done to ensure predatory men posing as women are NOT going to be able to victimize women and children in what were previously safe spaces. This is at the heart of Posie Parker’s message and many of us women agree and are concerned.

      We all support the right of trans people to live their lives as they wish but if affording them the rights they demand puts others at risk is this not something we should be able to debate like adults?

      None of the Ministers I have asked seem to have done any work on this issue before legislating that men can have access to women’s spaces by claiming to be trans. Of course, genuine trans women are then disadvantaged and that’s the issue we should be arguing, not whether or not we have the right to speak.

    • fuck off countryboy you’ve gone sour as old milk on this – stick to rubbishing Johnkey

  17. Agree with Trotter’s views here But imo he has extraordinary faitg – I would argue naive faith – that the Opposition will stand by free speech National has shown no courage and Act only a little on this issue. My MP, Erica Stanford ( National East Coast bis) even joined in the attack. against Minshull. I expect Winston Peters and NZF will be on the ground supporting,It s one of the few politicians who has seen the lie of the land Also the media played a big role in. the last debacle. Especially NZME – which formenting the violence of the mob last time. With Shaneel lai and Rainbow tick on board – NZME is likely to have the same again.

    • Did Stanford have a go at PP or did she merely make political capital out of the situation by saying the immigration minister, Michael Woods could have stopped this. Geniune question

    • Rimmer just rebranded ACT with the troon colours.
      Nats and ACT ALL voted for the sex self-ID lies bill, now law. Not a one with the courage to say this gender nonce-sense is wrong.

      • Shows how lazy and what fools we have in our government – it’s not just one party. Same with lazy, foolish, immigration where they import in poverty to blow up the welfare system.

        Last poll 64% thought NZ was going in the wrong direction, problem was those who knew NZ was going in the wrong direction knew that there were no parties to vote for in the right direction thus the 64% had nobody to vote for and had to settle to what was available thus the close split.

      • Ditto. Peters is also concerned about the genderID ideology being forced onto young children via the school and pre-school system, and I’ll support him for that too.

  18. Did she pay for someone to spray her with tomato sauce, sticks better than juice, because it makes for good camera fodder. This whole thing is Trevor Mallard territory. Foolish lacking in reasoned procedures that show the gummint in the light of a fair approach ensuring that there isn’t an outbreak of fisticuffs.

    I’m reading Georgette Heyer writing about the early 1800s when they used to have ‘mills’ where a travelling pugilist would take on local promising boxers. Let’s have these again. NZ has never got over its low-class agricultural beginnings; now farmers are higher class but the old ideas still linger. We are full of pretensions and so easy to butter up it’s pathetic.

  19. What is not often mentioned on this issue is that is was three Green Party MPs who posted a provocative, dishonest and inflammatory post on the Green Party website in the form of an open letter to then Immigration Minister Michael Wood a month before Keen-Minshull’s visit. It was apparently directed to the youth and rainbow wings of the party and telling them that they would be doing God’s work if they adopted any means necessary to prevent someone portrayed to them as an evil fascist from speaking. The resulting violence was aided by other Green Party MPs.Golriz Ghahraman carried a sign calling Keen-Minshull a NAZI to the event and Kerekere performed a tasteless ditty with two parliamentary candidates doing the same thing. All were essentially incitement The post is hidden from view unless you were provided with the url. https://www.greens.org.nz/kellie_jay_keen_minshull It went to Wood, who appeared to believe it true and the content was subsequently summarised on Stuff and Radio New Zealand.

    However the debates about sex and gender should be the stuff of ordinary politics with a pluralism of views and an attempt to forge a liveable compromise across wide number of dimensions – not of suppressing debate by intimidation and violence. It is the Green Party who are supposedly about consensus building and pacifism and who are seeking laws to ban incitement who are making a nonsense of their own supposed values.
    There is a solution and it is one that the UK Labour Party leader has decided belatedly to take. Keir Starmer has decided to steer a middle ground if elected that will take a lot of heat out of the situation.

    • If elected Steir will go back to believing that some women have vaginas and that all women are women because they identify as and not because they are. Unless of course one is male born that makes one automatically a women – just say so.

    • Jan Rivers. Thanks. The Greens are sex/gender obsessives. Kerekere’s maiden speech slammed ‘ “colonialists” for curtailing the gender acrobatics of her ancestors, and her big bully antics at Select Committee to an innocent young man from the provinces was totally unacceptable for a Chair. Marama’s antagonism to white heterosexual males looks quite pathological, but in any case, politicians behaving like gutter journos and spreading unsubstantiated lies like they did here, simply show what shallow irresponsible shit artists they are, and certainly not fit to be in Parliament. They behaved like hysterical adolescents, they need to grow up, and probably never will.

      It’s astonishing though, that parents and grandparents are perturbed about offspring sharing spaces with extreme transgenderists for all sorts of reasons, including some quite simple ones, like natural modesty, but that these Labour and Green politicians are determined to get blokes in frocks into kiddies’ toilets and dressing rooms, and that they label grandads and responsible old aunties, anti transgender and fucking terfs, for being naturally protective towards those to whom we do have a duty of care, even if the politicians don’t. Hopefully Posie Parker will take legal action concerning the misinformation peddled by persons who should know better.

  20. Just defer any visit until after the election.

    Locals are free to do what they want in our election campaign period, outside the courthouse, whenever, wherever and whatever.

    It’s not a right of foreigners with agendas.

    • I think Posy is back around the time the perp that punched out the elderly lady has his court case. If you punch out an elderly woman in a trans protests it’s all ok in NZ!

      Sounds like the perp was promised diversion but that was not a good look with all the violence and murder against woman in NZ, so there was a change of heart!

      The other offender, who threw the liquids at Posy (who is now a NZ refugee based on her story of violence from being trans) but happily popped off with selfies to the US! What a life for refugees in NZ who get everything for free, (housing, medical, free tertiary etc) as they tour the world after stopping others from freely speaking and inciting mobs here!

      I’m also looking forward to Chippy having to justify how he doesn’t know what a woman is to the Nations woman. Honesty is the best policy after all.

      But if Chippy really believes than men can be a woman with magical thinking, maybe he should look less frightened when he says it or actually stand up against the trans stupidity because the trans movement is breaking down the more people it affects and the more kids and adults that are suing the state for being victimised by transition that has wrecked their life.

      ‘NHS trans surgery damaged my body for ever — it’s not safe’
      https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/cf857796-01ec-11ee-b730-2607a18701aa?shareToken=54d973d4e53176374a00ea6ad2570f86

  21. If anyone here is at all concerned about the beloved tourist industry which supposedly supports the economy (yes, I know , countryboy, it’s really the agricultural sector but let them have their Steinlager moment) then they would be working damn hard to ensure No Repeat of the horrific scenes from Mt Albert park which are still surfacing, showing mob violence and just cretinous stuff which is prompting cancellations and aborted trips to nz.
    Scenery comes secondary to safety.

    • Current murders, gun attacks and terror attacks show the direction NZ has chosen to go. This is more worrying for tourists! Axe attacks in restaurants, real estate agent disappeared and another weirdo handing out in NZ for a few months the person of interest, gun attacks in CBD, people knifing each other in CBD and petrol stations, mass attempts at beheading people in west Auckland mall, and the 51 people dead at place of worship. The woman with depression who comes to NZ and kills her kids. Another lady is in court when her kids are found dead in a suitcase years later. Torture and killing of a teenager by some youth thugs. Not looking like a safe place, NZ.

      Allowing riots and violence in protest of a woman’s group, that (as many have said here) appear to be incited by NZ government MP’s and officials is probably not helping.

      The ease of crime and violence is also attracting the wrong sort of tourists and residents into NZ. The majority of the list above, seem to have just arrived in NZ in last decade, and feel ok to kill others. After all, murder and extreme violence is only a 10 year sentence here or even home detention. Fraud and financial crime, is just a slap on the wrist. Illegal work is wink, wink, encouraged. If you actually get caught and prosecuted a $2500 fine is laughable – pretty much an endorsement to keep going when it’s $30,000+ to offer a ghost job or avoid NZ employment laws!

      Unlike the UK the journos actually do some investigative work. An undercover investigation found that many lawyers in the UK were more than willing to make up a refugee story for 10,000 pounds.

      “One of the firms was Duncan Ellis Solicitors in Colliers Wood, southwest London, where a legal adviser named VP Lingajothy agreed to invent a story to use in an asylum application. It included claims of sexual torture, beatings, slave labour, false imprisonment and death threats that had led to suicidal thoughts and had compelled “the migrant” to flee to the UK.”
      https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/fake-claim-asylum-solicitors-face-full-force-of-sanctions-wkhtwktwc

      Follow the money to find out how this disinformation and security threats are coming from!

      The document that reveals the remarkable tactics of trans lobbyists
      https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-document-that-reveals-the-remarkable-tactics-of-trans-lobbyists/

      “According to the report, the countries that have moved most quickly to advance trans rights and remove parental consent have been those where the groups lobbying for those changes have succeeded in stopping the wider public learning about their proposals. Conversely, in places like Britain, the more ‘exposure’ this agenda has had, the less successful the lobbying has been:”

  22. If the cost of having Keen-Minshull speak here in person involves injury, potential loss of life, damage to private property, damage to public property and huge financial outlay by the taxpayer reassigning stretched police resources to protect the free speech of a foreign agitator, then that cost is too high and she should be kept out for those reasons.

    I don’t give a fuck what she has to say. She can say it from Britain using social media and get her message across that way. Or perhaps there is an actual Aotearoan/NZ woman who can speak on her behalf here at a rally and go the Batchelor/Co Governance shitshow of a road tour route.

    And all you righteous men up in here drowning out the conversation with your virtue signaling defending the rights of women need to shut the fuck up and…

    LET THE WOMEN SPEAK!!!

  23. The ‘government’ consists of two arms. The elected representatives, and the civil service. I am interested in the role of the latter in the days after Posie Parker.

    As Chris has noted previously the violence against Parker appeared to have widespread support among both arms of government and the media.

    Marama Davidson chose to commit political hara kiri via her “white cis male” comments immediately after this incident. These comments were rapidly modified and qualified. A lot of people in Davidson’s office and the PM’s office were reportedly talking to each other and the media as this was going on.

    Despite their best efforts the cover story was starting to come unstitched, and even Luxon was blearily beginning to appreciate the possibilities it offered.

    And then, just as the cover stories were on the point of disintegrating, the Stewart Nash incident, which had been known about for years in certain privileged circles, was suddenly publicly activated within government and seized upon by the media.

    Davidson was forgotten, and rapidly scuttled for cover as Nash was destroyed. The media never returned to seriously examine her statements and their implications.

    Was Stewart Nash, a member of the group who was apparently “responsible for all violence in the World”, deliberately ‘cashed in’ by those who supported this cause, and who also knew this information, in order to give the Meekly Modified Marama’ a critical breathing space?

    I, for one, have always wondered….am I alone?

  24. In no universe did our family ever consider not voting Labour on one issue so seemingly simple as “What is a woman?” But we have.
    We have agreed on this – now the question is, who can answer that simple question? KJM has awaken thousands of NZers who were sleep walking. If a political party cant define who your Mum is, how do they expect to care for her; defend her rights; offer her healthcare; just even acknowledge her right to exist?
    I hear you laughing.
    How ridiculous.
    We all know what a woman is.
    No, we don’t.
    Ask NZ Labour.
    NZ Greens.
    Ask your own MP. Then go and read the Min of Education NZ curriculum particularly the Health portion.
    Posie Parker (her Twitter handle) has come to wake NZ up from its own self inflicted nightmare. We welcome her, as should all NZ. If you know what a woman is, show up and support KJM when she comes back to NZ

    • Agree Alexi, problem is that the trans make it so violent a lot of woman are too frightened to attend which is exactly what they wanted with the previous riot and attacks on bystanders supporting woman.

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