Tweedledum & Tweedledumber
Wait, What?
Gun crackdown: National wants bipartisan support for police raids on gang premises
The National Party wants bipartisan support to give police greater powers in raiding gang premises to seize illegal firearms.
National MP Judith Collins, a former Police Minister, said in Parliament on Tuesday that the time had come to revisit her colleague’s Bill last year that suggested the move.
“My colleague Chris Bishop had a private members’ Bill last year around this and it was defeated in Parliament. I would hope that given another chance it could be successful.”
The introduction of Firearms Prohibition Orders was recommended by a 2017 Select Committee Inquiry, which would widen the powers available to police to search the homes and cars of gang members for firearms.
This is bullshit, the Police already have the power to search homes and cars for firearms if they suspect a person has a gun, they need reasonable grounds to do it and what National are asking for here is to make it lawful for the Police to search ‘gang members’ (code for brown people) unreasonably.
It wasn’t a gang who shot & killed 100 Muslims – it was a white supremacist – demanding Police gain the power to storm brown people’s homes to seize guns as a response to that terrorism is ethically bankrupt.
This is a political stunt to use a tragedy to attack a group National love to marginalise.
It’s ugly.
“Never let a tragedy/crisis go to waste”. I was trying to explain that here, but got instantly shot down (no pun intended) by readers – even got called a “gun nut” despite not having a gun licence let alone a gun. We can’t let the Government dodge normal law-making procedure just because an extremely rare event happened, that might not even be avoidable in the future regardless of what we do now (especially considering the very basic gun Anton Brevic used in Norway to even greater effect than in Christchurch). This is how the US ended up invading two countries, and introduced and/or strengthened the NSA, Homeland Security, TSA and the Patriot Act. Do we want that for New Zealand?
“Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.” – Benjamin Franklin
I like guns. I’v used guns for different things and there’s a few that I can’t use but would like too. But if it meant tougher access to them and no more gun violence limiting the potential death toll to let’s say 10 before police can respond then I would forgo all privileged access to fire Armes. That’s just me though. I would prefer a system that makes it harder for the wrong people to have them.
I will never forget how they used their terrorism powers to attack the Tuhoe people. What did that achieve? Destroyed a lot of goodwill the police had and diverted their attention from the real enemy.
It’s far more than ugly Martyn, it’s a grotesque twisting of the facts and truth to make her look far better than goldilocks.
She is a trickster and mind blowing that she was once the police minister?
You realise Goldilocks was a sneaky little brat – trespasser and thief.
Both New Zealand “gangs” face off –
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDcv2LtPLXI&feature=em-uploademail
Meanwhile, hunters who trespass on other people’s properties with loaded firearms and shoot their animals (in a couple of cases deer, where I live) either get a slap on the wrist or are not charged at all
I agree police already have all the powers they need.
When the gangs admitted they kept guns for protection
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/christchurch-shooting/111594950/gangs-bosses-say-weapons-wont-be-handed-back-after-christchurch-mosque-shooting , they should have been raided and all guns confiscated.
It is not legal in this country to obtain or have firearms for personal protection. It’s one of the questions you are asked for a firearms license.
The fact that gangs flaunt abuses of firearms law openly says how serious the police have been in prosecuting firearms crime – they haven’t been, let alone doing their job and vetting to current laws – they have been giving firearms licenses to gang members, and not doing the specified background checks eg: on the shooter.
How many (supposedly legally) and illegally held gang guns are going underground with the MSSA ban and upcoming registry?
All of them
good old national going for the gangs as usual the gangs didn’t shoot 50 people while praying at their church/mosque. I think national are trying to be relevant when really they are gone at the next election especially with the leader they choose.
Yes Simon gets worse by the minute. Now he’s thrown a “junior staffer” under the bus to cover his own office lies.
Imagine if big, tough, masked cops roamed the streets of New Zealand towns, storming the homes of innocents willy nilly, jamming their assault weapons in the faces of little girls riding bikes with spoke clickers and tinsel flowing off the handlebars? Oh wait, they already did that in the Ureweras! Try that in Christchurch.
I still do not understand why we have so many guns in NZ 1.5 million weapons and 250,000 licensed gun holders = 6.0 weapons per licence.
NZ police should know the location of each registered weapon it is not that difficult to run a program with a register of each weapon and it’s actual location.
Spot audits should be done regularly otherwise we are going to end up like the USA with every man and his dog owning a weapon ?
Japan have very few registered gun owners and have very little organised crime maybe we should follow the Japanese Model ?
Guns in New Zealand inexplicably aren’t properly registered on a Cat A, i.e. no one knows who has what. Which is why imo a lot of MSSA owners are just going to keep their gun, especially if the compensation isn’t considered sufficient (i.e. it will need to not only cover the retail cost of the firearm, but also any and all accessories given they can’t be used on any other gun and so have no resale value).
I heard that Gun City are estimating the buyback cost at as much as $750M BTW – more than double Winston’s worst case scenario. There is a strong case to be made imo that the response to these super rare events (and they are thankfully super rare) isn’t really well served by throwing massive amounts money at in a knee-jerk reaction… relative to any number of truly societal beneficial programs you could have spent it on instead.
Not a good idea to follow the Japan Model. The Japanese Crime Syndicates run the country.
Really ?
Please educate us ?
Here is a write up on Yakuza https://asianpoliticaldevelopment.wordpress.com/2018/03/18/the-yakuza-in-japans-corrupt-political-scene/
And another write up on Yamaguchi Gumi
https://www.inquisitr.com/2378557/yamaguchi-gumi-japans-largest-organized-crime-syndicate-nearing-gang-war-japanese-police-fear-unprecedented-bloodshed/
Gang members in Japan are, imo, like cockroaches, they’re everywhere.
NZ Gun Laws and Policing of Weapons her in NZ needs a big tidy up, from the Gangs through to the RWNJ’s and the Private Collectors ?
uhh… haven’t several gang members openly stated that they refuse to give up their soon-to-be illegal firearms, thus perfectly justifying a response such as this? why make something about race when it’s purely practical? is this group ‘being’ marginalized or are they marginalizing themselves by choosing to do things the rest of society deems wrong? I think that’s the whole point of a gang isn’t it? They wish to be anti-establishment.
Which is the justification being held up right?
Just think about that justification.
“Someone said they couldn’t hand their guns in”
“Well immediately raid every single one of that group”
You can see the absurdity of your position right Rebecca?
One person says something so every single one of that group must be penalised for that one person?
Do you appreciate how quickly shit would fly apart if that was the basis of our law and order?
“One person says something so every single one of that group must be penalised for that one person?”
A bit like all licensed firearms users being penalised at present?
Good for the law abiding but not drug pushing rapists.
Or, Rebecca, it could be one or two gang members grandstanding for the media and not representing their fellow gang members?
Those poor misunderstood gangs. They get a bit murdery sometimes, a bit assaultey, robbey and a bit rapey but don’t judge eh.
Let’s not be heavy handed.
A few bad apples.
FYI there are white gangs too if it helps your guilt complex.
Anyway back to those legal kiwi firearms owners who did nothing wrong. “Gun nuts” as we should call them.
“Anyway back to those legal kiwi firearms owners who did nothing wrong.”
As an appalling leader once said “nothing to hide, nothing to fear”.
The new law won’t make the legal kiwi’s outlaws and yes you are right there ARE white gangs out there, so that makes it right,right?
Correct the gangs are just like the Boy Scouts for the down trodden and a few bad apples give the gangs a bad rap.
They are like community groups where the down trodden get together have a few beers, practice their martial arts and street fighting techniques, it is all harmless fun.
one gang member from one chapter of the mongrel mob is not several gangs Rebecca it one, not two or three but one
What do you expect from ‘Crusher Collins’ and her party?
It’s desperation.
yes E -Clectic desperation by a party that have no friends accept those that get richer every time they get in power and those people only seem to care about themselves not the greater good and what is best for most Nzders
Our attention used to be drawn to the guns in the possession of the gangs. Some of us, including me, believe that such weapons are “made available” to the gangs for “enforcement” purposes. Drugs earn big big money. One just has to type in Black Nobility and the drug trade to know that money from misery does indeed make the world go round.
Interesting that our attention is now being drawn to every gun. We are drowning in problem, reaction, solution and what better way to cut to the chase than to quickly create the problem, drench the country with reactions and hammer in a solution. It’s all so bloody obvious.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDcv2LtPLXI&feature=em-uploademail
Both wrong
1.Lot’s of gang members are white. So let’s not spin it into a race issue eh?
2. Collins was wrong too. The cops already have those powers if they have “reasonable grounds” to suspect firearms are present. A gang leader stating on TV they have them would seem to be reasonable grounds to me.
The awful fact of the matter is that the cops are too weak to tackle the gangs so they attack lawful gun owners instead. Same as the UK where it is patently clear that Muslim gangs are a public threat but the cops arrest people for Facebook posts instead.
Amazing how quickly the righties want to reframe the conversation to attack and denigrate brown people. Because, you know, the Christchurch shooter was a screwed up, radicalised White supremacist. And that’s just, you know, embarrassing.
The National party will do and say anything to try and stay relevant.
Collins has used this as an opportunity to build her profile with the electorate.
Their law change’s and Key’s appointed friend did not stop this guy from committing mass murder.
But then he was not the reason for increasing the states surveillance pushed by Key who was acting on orders from the Americans at the time.
Totally agree MOSA.
Coppers in NZ have done little to curb the explosion in gang numbers and increase in drugs and weapons ?
And good ole Labours own minister, rooter Nash will ensure that Crusha Collins will get her way. ffs!
I see our dumb minister of police has taken the bait re- guns and gangs can we please have someone else in this job I find nash to be useless and ineffective.
Some gang headquarters may also be ‘brown people’s homes’ at the same time, I presume, but are gangs to be treated any different to any ordinary person in an ordinary home, when they are reasonably suspected of committing a crime by holding illegal weapons?
And not all ‘gangs’ are made up of only brown people, I think.
On 15 March, as we began to get a clearer picture what had happened in Christchurch, I had a prescient ‘flash’ as to how (eventually) the National Party would behave;
It didn’t take long…
“Err, arrh? The brotha misspoke. What he meant to say was, that, they will allow the Popo to keep the guns that they have already confiscated as we do not have anymore, ay cuzzies, thats right ay”
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