So the NZDF lied to all our faces about war crimes in Afghanistan? This unblinking cretin must answer new OIA revelations

By   /   March 13, 2018  /   25 Comments

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If we have a functioning fourth estate, this should lead every news bulletin and Keating must be forced by the media to explain why he lied.

This unblinking cretin must answer new OIA revelations

Can we all pause and just consider that today we found out that the NZDF lied directly to our faces about war crimes in Afghanistan.

When the book Hit and Run was published in March last year, the Chief of Defence Force Tim Keating held a press conference claiming that the book had nothing to do with the New Zealand SAS because the SAS had been in a different place on that date.

In response to questions from reporters, Keating said:

It’s irrefutable that we operated in a different area to the claims of the book” and

it’s not on an operation the NZSAS conducted.”

Just before the 2017 election, the Chief of the Defence Force lied directly to our faces about a revenge attack personally signed off by John Key that burnt civilian houses, wounded 15 civilians and killed 6.

NZ ordered the Apache Attack Helicopter strike, we are responsible for this, we may have committed a war crime personally signed off by the Prime Minister and the military lied to our faces about it.

If we have a functioning fourth estate, this should lead every news bulletin and Keating must be forced by the media to explain why he lied.

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  1. Kevin says:

    ……If we had a functioning fourth estate…..instead we have a propaganda outlet for the Uber Elites, full of piss poor journos, who are biased & undemocratic.
    DO NOT read, watch or follow the MSM. Their job seems to be purely propaganda and mind conditioning. It convinced Kiwis to vote & then keep voting for the biggest traitor this country has ever had.

  2. CLEANGREEN says:

    If we had honesty at the core of our society today we would have accepted the truth years ago but now we will live in doubt for a long time sadly.

  3. Marc says:

    Oh no, we must honour our soldiers, no matter what they may have gotten up to, do not disturb the next ANZAC Day Parade, thanks.

  4. Kim dandy says:

    He lied to cover PM John Key’s a***. Simple.

    • mary_a says:

      @ Kim Dandy … absolutely right.

      Now let’s hope Key is faced with some stiff questioning on this whole issue. He has plenty to answer for here.

  5. Michelle says:

    agree 100% with Kim Dandy all the lies are spilling out

  6. e-clectic says:

    Should he explain before or after he resigns?

    What standard of accountability will the Minister of Defence be seeking? He needs to cut a clear distance between himself and his predecessors, especially on this matter.

  7. Steve Earnshaw says:

    War is brutal and collateral damage is a necessity of it.
    Those of us that are old enough will recall quizzing our parents about our grand parents in WW2. The answer, most often was that they never talked much about it. And there is very good reason for that.

    As history written by the victors, we seldom hear of the bad bits from our side but only those from the losing side. The Germans did accuse NZ Troops of war crimes over the Minqar-quaim incident.

    “When the Brigadier Clifton, commander of the 6th NZ Brigade, was taken prisionier by the Italian paratroopers of the 187° Reggimento Folgore on 4th Sept 1942 he was questioned by Rommel about the bad fame of his troops regarding their habit to kill prisoniers and wounded. The answer was: “Too many goddamed Maori!” asking, anyway, the grace to be sent as a POW in Germany and not in Italy, as he was fearing a trial; this permission was not granted and so he escaped a total of nine times, the last, on 1944, successfully”

    Fast forward 60 odd years and we get a movie called Lone Survivor where they attempt to portray soldiers as humanitarian. The end result being the whole squad got wiped out bar one that was lucky to escape with his life.
    In reality, any squad leader worth his salt would have been screwing the silencer on his 1911 while the rest of the squad were discussing the fate of the old man and the boy.

    Figures recently released estimate that between the D Day landings and the eventual withdraw from Germany a few years after wars end, US Troops were responsible for an estimated 18,000 rapes of civilians.
    Now, that figure may seem unbelievable to you Nancy boys but being the realist that I am, it comes as no surprise to me.

    War is a brutal game that we shouldn’t be playing for the bankers benefit in foreign lands and they, soldiers, aka trained killing machines, should only be utilized as a last resort for the defense of our own land.

    • Sam Sam says:

      I disagree that collateral damage is a necessity. Being a competent soldiers means knowing how to wield the sword so it remains sheathed.

      • Steve Earnshaw says:

        Well, I’m eternally grateful you aint leading the squad. You’d get us all slaughtered before the end of the day.
        I’d follow you to the point you made that stupid decision then you’d be in that shallow grave with the old man and the boy.

        I’ll go in with the Maori’s thanks,and the job will be done before you’ve finished pondering the consequences.

      • Steve Earnshaw says:

        There is good reason the supposed most powerful military on the planet can’t achieve anything. It pc thinking like you are exhibiting.
        It always comes back to paid mercenaries having to complete the job and absolve your pc thinking arse from any responsibility.

        • Sam Sam says:

          I just read your first paragraph and dismissed the rest.

          Being politically correct or against PC culture is dangerous. You don’t know what you are talking about and just quickly I’ll prove it. Hitler was the most anti PC person ever, he hated that Jews could deviate from the majority even a little bit and killed millions.

          So do you understand why getting so upset about being PC or not is a terrible idea? If you understand how the game is played, and how to wield the sword, you CAN keep the sword shieved, and just pull it out for the appropriate occasion.

          The just following orders defence is no longer valid. So soldiers have to be smarter now. The killing game is all rulz of engagement and operational hence the word “counter.” COIN, counter barrage, counter ops. I suspect the way NZDF does business has changed a lot since you where an enthusiast. NZDF must now be viewed through the lense of FLOC (Future Land Operating Concept 35. Just type in the Google search “NZDF” and “FLOC”) developed after the events of the book Hit and Run FLOC seeks to take NZDF philosophy and procurement and revolutionise it for the recruit who will be born in 2018. They will likely be urban, more diverse in ethnic background, and less likely to be able to cope with the hardships because New Zealand has experienced 3% economic growth year on year for the last 30 yrs.

          So the way NZDF conducts business in the next 50 years will be a lot different than the last 100 years. That there are more opportunity for woman to join the military than the private sector as a consequence NZDF culture will approach problems more peacefully as its a woman’s natural instinct to want to make sure every one gets a fair shake.

          You’ll also find that drones will be as available to section leaders as the MARS-L.

          So it IS a case of out with the OLD analogue mentalities and in with the new coolness.

          That’s out with the old busted joint, and in with the new hotness, my boy.

          • Steve Earnshaw says:

            Ah, the victors write the history. For most of my life, I believed the brainwashed line fed to us about Hitler.
            Having been retired for 6-7 years, I’ve had the time to dig around on the internet. History may need re writing as exposure of the truth comes out.

            There is a doco called The Greatest Story Never Told. It paints the picture completely different. Lots of things don’t add up, some noted below.

            1) General Patton was silenced two weeks after publicly stating “We have defeated the wrong enemy”
            2) Hitler was said to be persecuting Jews yet it was the Jews that were financing him.
            3)Scientific experts went to one of the camps around 2012 and could find no evidence of gassing. They in fact concluded that it didn’t happen due to the proximity of the crematorium and something about the ventilation of the shower blocks.
            4)Pre war Germany with its jewish controllers bears a striking resemblance to current day USA. Just a coincidence that many jumped ship and went there?

            And the list goes on.

            A lot of my family were in the military. My grandfather in 27 battalion. Both cousins in the NZ Navy. One was on the Otago when it went to Mururoa.
            My nephew is currently serving on Australia’s new flagship.
            I don’t take orders very well and for that reason, I never went down that road. A Mercenary/Hitman is much more me. I’m not the guy you would sent on a sensitive diplomatic mission. I’m the guy you send when the mission must be achieved at any cost.

            I wouldn’t want to have any part in the new look armed forces.
            I’ve seen on the internet, the piss that is being taken out of the United States new look fruitcake army. The LGBTQ lot poncing into battle in their tu tu’s. Not a good look at all mate. Can you imagine what would happen if they had to confront a team of hardline Russians? Wouldn’t be pretty.

            Funny you mention drones. The neighbors got them for xmas. My first comment was. Don’t fly them over my place, they’ll be shot down, and once the dogs gets a hold of it, you won’t be wanting it back.

            • Sam Sam says:

              Ah yes, every ones got a really bitching plan until they get punched in the face. That’s in part why policy,my raining and mentoring is wrapped around the 2035 recruit to muld them into something useful.

              At the bottom of the IQ ladder so about 80- 89, you’ve got all the low payed IQ jobs the system try’s to funnel the underclass into ie:

              -Check out operator
              -factory worker
              -so boring repetitive jobs no one wants to do

              And underneath an IQ of 80 the system doesn’t provid any jobs and the thing with technological revolutionists like Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg is they are introducing computational technology that will make below 90 IQs redundant and that’s a lot of Nee Zealanders with zero stake in all this that we have to find a job so shifty politicians don’t convince them to stand either side of a bayonet.

              • Steve Earnshaw says:

                Best they get that universal basic income instigated then before we have to seed them all off for slaughter 🙂

    • David Stone says:

      As a kid the men who worked with and for us were mostly returned from WW2. They didn’t talk about it much but looking back, though it seemed an age ago to me at 8 or 10 it must have been yesterday to them.
      I think they quickly gave up talking about it as they realised that no-one who hadn’t been through it had any concept of what it was like. They couldn’t communicate the horror to the people who had not lived through it. Some were probably ashamed of things they had done, but that wasn’t the main reason they didn’t talk about it. It was better put in the past, and to live in the future of work and family and peace.
      D J S

  8. Pete says:

    We put up with Key and Collins blatantly lying, not lies in failing to carry out policies they said they’d carry out, just lied about what they’d done.

    When you have the leader of the country and a Minister of Justice who don’t value truth but set clear models of the opposite, why should anyone else value honesty?

    • Michelle says:

      don’t forget judiths visit to Oravida on the tax payer now she claiming to care about the housing crisis something they said didn’t exist

  9. Francesca says:

    I think our military has closer bonds and affiliations with other military players (the US, Australia,)than they have with NZ and its politicians.
    And lets face it, our military is doing the bidding of the US, following them in to their stupid wars
    Governments come and go, but the military goes on for ever (they hope)
    Playing with the big boys, seeing action allows them to progress the career ladder.
    Woe betide any PM who crosses the military
    A bit like the intelligence agencies in the US
    “let me tell you, you take on the intelligence community, they have 6 ways from Sunday at getting back to you”

  10. Michelle says:

    They (the NZ military) have too much power its needs to be reined in. We also have bad culture in our police force they are more interested in spying on people and doing illegal raids on people mansions American style. NZers need to wake up to this before we find ourselves in a full on war. Not a war like we fought before but one with evil cowardly people that just have to push a button. And believe me the 3rd world war may be closer than many think with Russia provoking the west and their allies and putin wanting to unleash his new weapons on anyone that dear question or challenge their power.

    • Steve Earnshaw says:

      You may wish to reconsider who is provoking who here. Nato, under the direction of the US have installed some 400 missile systems that now encircle Russia. How many have Russia installed on US borders?
      Russia are at the point they have had a gutsful of the behavior of the well
      recognized word bully. Just look at the situation the US have created in Ukraine with US backed soldiers bombing civilian the areas of the Donbass? Thousands have been killed but you hear little here from NZ media.

      America have been given clear warning what will ensue if they keep it up. Sooner or later, the bear will lose its cool and rip their head off.

    • Steve Earnshaw says:

      Michelle. Take a look at this if you have a spare 90mins. It is subtitled in English by Inessa S who was educated in Wellington. She has a Youtube channel and translates a lot of the Russian political speeches.
      Just released and already banned by YouTube (Can’t have Mr Putin portrayed in a positive light) . Its now been uploaded to the paid platform Vimeo.
      Its called “No Russia, no world!” – FULL MOVIE: WORLD ORDER 2018 and is an Interview with Putin that discusses many issues, past and present.

  11. mosa says:

    The point here is we don’t have a functioning fourth estate that ended in 2008 or what was left of it.

    Bill English and his resignation and its timeline had a lot to do with this enquiry.

    I will wager that the current government will not do what is right and just here as there are too many apologists like Mr Ron Mark and others who will never sanction a real enquiry.

    Labour WILL ROLL OVER to keep uncle Winston and others on side.
    This issue should be a make or brake for the Green party pure and simple.

    The more things change the more they stay right where they……are.

    The fourth estate is dead except for this courageous site that unfortunately does not have the cut through of the corporate media.

  12. countryboy says:

    God invented drugs for this reason.
    Crop dust the entire landmass of the planet with GOOD ecstasy powder and not one shot would be fired in anger. You can guarantee some idiot ( Like me ) would sit on their gun and shoot themselves in the balls by accident, but no state manufactured ( corporate) hate would be involved. ( Police/Ambulance/Screaming/Bleeding, yes. )
    You’d likely get buffalo rooting crocodiles then calling on them the day after with roses and chocolates but hey? Nothing’s perfect. Buffodile Babies? Cuuuuute! OMG! Crocolo’s! Extinction just got fruity.
    Better than dead, mangled children and wailing parents doomed to forever roam a haunted landscape, and those few of us who don’t enjoy schadenfreude? We are equally devastated. We’re right there with you. There in, lies the rub.
    Yeah, I’m being flippant. So what?
    Mr Waxhead the Soldier above is all a-puff because he has a tiny penis. And when it gets aroused? He whacks it with a stick while thinking about dead kittens.
    He should shave his head, grow a nice pair of sideburns and get a girl/boy friend combo.
    But what does he do instead? He kills people. Why? Did they come here and try to kill us? No. They did not.
    We go to a place in Auckland where there are mostly swarthy brown people with white teeth, and I know they have white teeth because they smile. Unlike Waxhead the Soldier, who, if he smiled his kitten stick would wilt and he’d be left to fend for himself in his dungeon with his handcuffs and rubber suits.
    Remember kiddies? Fucks like him are in a sickly and infamous minority. He, like those before him, have simply learned how to convince us otherwise.

    What if they gave a war and nobody came…

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