As TDB pointed out months ago, the 2 real issues posed by 3 Waters are can it stop foreign companies from bottling NZ water and can it ensure National and ACT don’t privatize the water once it’s nationalized…
The Government has sought cross-party support to safeguard the public’s water assets from privatisation, as opponents to the Three Waters reform organise themselves for battle.
Local Government Minister Nanaia Mahuta wrote to the leaders of each political party on Wednesday, as the Government released its first draft of the Three Waters reform legislation, asking for their support in entrenching in law a prohibition against the privatisation of the public’s drinking, waste, and storm water.
The attempt to gain some cross-party support within the reforms comes as the Government sustains heavy criticism for forging ahead with plans to create four new public water entities, that will assume control of all the water assets currently owned by local councils.
The Government has this week faced claims it quietly decided to mandate the reforms while still consulting with councils. Opponents to the contentious reforms descended on Parliament, for its last sitting day of the year.
…I am in favour of 3 Waters – I absolutely believe water should be nationalized so it can be protected and think Labour should seize the water assets via the Public Works Act.
I don’t see co-governance with Maori as a threat, I see it as another check and balance.
The only real question to 3 Waters is will National and ACT privatize water the millisecond they ever win power?
Based on ACTs far right agenda, you would have to say yes and based on Key selling 49% of our hydro power assets to create a $400million irrigation slush fund for corporate farmers, you would have to say yes as well.
3 Waters will be fought like this:
Labour + Environmentalists + Maori = public protection of water
National + ACT + Corporate Dairy = water privatization
Once Labour lock in this narrative framework, opposition to 3 Waters will dissolve against anti water privatization forces.
3 Waters will not be the great vote loser all the pundits are predicting – properly framed as a fight against water privatization, 3 Waters will propel Labour forward and take back some protest Green vote.
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I don’t think 3 waters is a vote loser. It’s several layers beneath boring to get your head around and if one gives it the slightest thought, just look at the Waitemata and Manukau harbours turning into open sewers everytime there the slightest rain, which in Auckland is frequent. It’s a disgrace!
Or the fact a huge lack of foresight and investment saw Auckland running out of fresh water.
Or that Wellington City has to ensure sewer geysers because no one in council realized sewer infrastructure did not last forever or need maintenance.
If it is set up well it can only be a good thing, surely?
You have just reminded me of something XRay.
The negotiations for the Treaty Claim(s) for the Manukau Harbour and the Tikapa(Firth of Thames) was due to start this year but was delayed.
The Battle of the Harbours continues ….
re wellie —
oh they realised alright, they just chose to ignore it and keep their fingers crossed, maintainance is a line item where instant savings can be made and they just hope that they’ve individualy safely moved on before it bites them on the bum…..it was a deliberate policy decision and should be seen as such.
the 3month financial outlay report problem which makes the next tranche of figures more important than long term planning….no one gets a bonus for long term planning.
In fact Watercare is already constructing the central interceptor project that will fix the sewage problem in the harbours, long term. We can blame Goff & Brown for delaying this project to pay for escalation on the CRL project it, but it well under way now and due to be complete by 2025. Watercare is also constructing or expanding new treatment plants in several areas including Snells Beach, Waiuku and Pukekohe.
As regards Auckland “running out of fresh water” that was definitely not the case. The lowest level the Auckland dams got to after 2 years of drought was about 48%. But that’s not all! 12 years earlier the ol Auckland Council has constructed its phase 2 pump station on the Waikato but had not been able to turn on the pumps thanks to an intransigent Environment Waikato who wouldn’t give them a resource consent. This was eventually overruled by the Minister, who has this emergency authority under the RMA.
So in the case of Auckland, the money is being invested and there is absolutely no need for 3 Waters.
the last storage dams in auckland were built decades ago there is alot more work needed all councils used water as a cash cow and run the systems down including auckland when was the last time you seen a sucker truck pumping out cess pits on your street its basics that are just not being done or been cut
In the South Island, Maori ARE corporate dairy.
Keepcalm
Give us some reliable figures and source about this claim about Maori being corporate dairy in the south.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/108049548/ngai-tahu-farming-replaces-forestry-with-14000-cows-at-eyrewell
Iwi felling trees to convert to dairy and wanted to do more but didn’t get consent.. yet.
What happens when they get veto powers on the water?
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/116661441/new-zealands-biggest-50-landowners-revealed
Ngai Tahu land area is equal to the single biggest private land holding in NZ, other iwi have more.
….And in the north island particularly the south Waikato, alongside Landcorp, Tribal corporate owned interests form the the vast majority of intensive, large scale irrigated dairy farms !
Historical note: Labour mayor Lianne Dalzeil doesn,t sell water, she gifts it to chineese bottling companies.
In exchange for lucrative political donations…
Wrong Lianne Dalzeil and the chch city council had no control over that.
The consents were already inplace from a previous industry that existed and the council had no control over those consents and so a high court has ruled those existing consents stand whether we like it or not.
semantics…look at Scottish Water, the basis for this proposal.
This is going to end up with a classic funder provider split, retail and wholesale markets, served by different businesses, with a tender process to ensure large overseas companies get to run our stuff. It’s the electricity sector all over.
The underlying entities may be held by the crown, but they will sure as hell be run to make a profit and subsidise industrial uses and return some kind of payment to the shareholders.
In future they will be sold, regardless of who says what now. Much simpler to package up 4 corporate structures than all the bits and bobs we’ve currently got.
exactly; and why bomber can’t see this is no mystery.
At the risk of sounding thick, isn’t the plan to ensure your scenario won’t happen s y d? Of course, National and ACT are unlikely to come to the party as their friends and funders won’t tolerate legislation that stops them majorly clipping the ticket.
took the words out of my mouth SYD
Labour WILL lose votes, no matter how hard you polish that policy turd Martyn, but please keep polishing and pushing 3 waters…Jacinda already putting brakes on it as she sees it’s not popular, if it does eventually go through it will be a totally different beast as to what is currently proposed.
Maori to have 50% representation – voting/veto rights when only 16% of the population?!
There is your first hurdle to sell to the NZ voters.
Maori are better guardians of environment…the Moa?!
Yes it is interesting how some of the mayors have come out arguing how their rate payers own this water asset as they invested heavily in this infrastructure and yet they didn’t do anything when John Key sold 49% of our hydro power assets to create a $400million irrigation slush fund for corporate farmers. Also I thought nobody owned the water. And the majority of our councils have breached the TOW failing to protect the rivers and streams as they have polluted these waterways and streams with many not swimmable. And food sources like eel and native fish species have almost been eradicated. Now who is holding the councils to account.
And what happens to those of us who have protected water catchments on our land for decades? We have paid for own private water system. we have protected breeding sites for native fish, koura, eels and more. It is proposed in this legislation we will be levied via regional councils . Fuck off! This is about privatization of our last remaining national asset Bomber. Wake the fuck up.
Good point KCCO, that is the corp structure, Maori or White is the actual problem and the same is happening up north with Avo farms and water.
Money money money…rules it all.
I also agree that nationalisation of three waters is in the face of it a good idea. But why are so many council’s against it? What could go wrong, apart from the threat of privatisation? Obviously if that was going to be done by some future government then there should be some rule it automatically reverts back to the local government who initially controlled it….? It’s all very well getting assurances from current government party’s but the thing is what could happen in the future.
A rainbow has more substance than any Political promise !!!!
If I’m Wrongs complaining about it then everyone here knows it’s a sure fire winner.
You are right. It’s a winner. Crack open the bubbly and start celebrating.
Keep the faith Bert, watch St Jacinda stall it and change it as the internal polling dictates.
What Mahuta was pushing NOW will look nothing like what will be passed in parliament. (If it doesn’t end up like the Harbour Bridge cycle lane lol)
St Jacinda does not do anything that makes her look bad, not when UN posting is due next year.
Wow, that pricked a few nerves! I’m surprised you weren’t at parliament complaining alongside your comrades about freedoms blah.blah blah, demanding the politicians show themselves. Difficult given they rose from the house yesterday, so not unlike yourself, not the sharpest tòols in the shed, lol. Ardern going to the UN, bahahahaha lol!!!
If you want the naked casino operators to decide how we drink our own (and cow) shit, leave it to the marketeers.
Mahuta and the Maori interest is the only bulwark against privatisation.
From the state the right said ‘that Maori’ was packaging it for sale and expropriate mum and dad rate payers.
She said no, it will never be privatised.
Scottish water is not a model as the SNP is a bourgeois arsehole that denigrates women.
If it cannot even defend women’s rights against upstart men it can’t defend water rights.
Yes the Liberal/Labour party establishment will go with the flow, but Mahuta and Maori have a long history of resisting privatisation they can call on.
Centuries elapsed between Maori hunting the Moa to extinction and bouncing back from the threat of extinction themselves at the hands of the white coloniser.
Maori today would easily see off any attempt by Luxon’s Cossacks to grab what is left of water.
HoHa!
It’s class war so pick your side.
Is it possible to insert a clause in the bill that prevents any sell off unless there is a 75% vote, or something like that?
why 75percent why not….you just can’t sell it, end of, period, full stop
If you are concerned about water ‘going offshore’ shouldn’t you be down at Port Waikato (or any other river mouth) trying to stop that outflow into the sea?
Because it is far, far greater volume than what gets bottled.
Is the objection because it’s foreigners (code for Chinese) owning the bottling plants?
Just to be clear – the majority of Councils and Councillors have failed to manage water infrastructure for years. Something like Three Waters is needed.
“Labour should seize the water assets via the Public Works Act.”
Joesph and Mao would be so proud.
Heroes are hard to find.
I can hear Churchill laughing in his grave
This is a fluff piece…the Government backed down from 3 waters once Kiwis worked out that the Government was going charge everyone for water in NZ to maintain the water supply. Everything else is smoke
Seems to me, some people are assuming Labour has the same dishonest values as the National party’s dirty politics. This isn’t the case, Labour have majority support and don’t need to divide NZers to get enough support to get into government.
Exactly GG.
Labour as always are clean as a whistle. No dirty politics ever. Time to start celebrating the 2023 election win?
Yes George they can rail road it through if they want they don’t actually have to consult the councils who are guilty of doing the very thing they are complaining about. Asset grabbing, lack of consultation with mana whenua, tramping on the TOW, divide and conquer tactics, majority rules, paying lip service, saying sorry and then doing it again gee I could go on and on. And while we are at it how many Maori mayors do we have? fuck all bloody bunch red necks many of our councils.
Yes George Garard they can rail road it through if they want they don’t actually have to consult the councils who are guilty of doing the very thing they are complaining about. Asset grabbing, lack of consultation with mana whenua, tramping on the TOW, divide and conquer tactics, majority rules, paying lip service, saying sorry and then doing it again gee I could go on and on. And while we are at it how many Maori mayors do we have? fuck all bloody bunch red necks many of our councils.
NZ water infrastructure is a piecemeal basket case waiting for another havelock north case of the shits. I’m not sure centralized management is the answer but a national standard is long overdue. unchlorinated spring water FFS – are we so backward to think this is a 21st century way to reticulate a city’s water supply? this is a public health matter and should be bought in to line – one way or another.
agreed. However 3 Waters is not the way to do this!. It is a neo liberal brain fart . Yet another waste of tax payer money on Northern Hemisphere consultants doing a copy and paste job on the NZ environment. It will not work!. Any fool with half an eye can see that. We are still capable of designing our own engineering systems in this country,hell we could even employ kiwis to do it! FFS we do not need another set of condescending over paid immigrants telling us how to sort our shit. This is our problem . It does not need the worthless useless posing of overpaid Wellington policy wonks and hacks. It needs local knowledge from New Zealand citizens with the bean counters at the very bottom of the food chain ,being dealt to every time they to impose their pea brained vision on viable REGIONAL plans for our water management. The geographical illiteracy is the obvious lunacy of this idiotic centralized plan. Have a central office maybe for administration of funding and levies, but ALL management of our greatest remaining asset needs to be regional to have a shit show of working. All decisions need to made at a REGIONAL level. We are NOT SCOTLAND .We are an island nation with a far greater geographical area with millions of micro climates and complex geographical features that influence ALL water supplies. This is why you are so wrong Bomber and why you don”t have a fucking clue as to why this will not work!
Both boring creeps flash harry-ing their way into our lives whether we like it or not. Fuck them both. We deserve better than this.
I shouldn’t worry about it too much . . .
Ice-free Arctic late in ’23, resulting in rapid heating of the earth.
Massive (and I mean MASSIVE) climate disruption in ’24, world-wide famine, world-wide deaths, world-wide migration, world-wide local conflicts. Plus 400+ unattended, un-decommissioned nuclear power plants around the world.
All gone by late ’25 or early ’26.
Ahhhh Tony, you been off your medication again and issuing doomsday predictions!
Tell us all how Nobel prize winner Al Gore’s doomsday predictions have planned out, no snow anywhere on earth, no ice at the polar caps, all cities in the coasts underwater…
Now, what was his timeline for these predictions Tony?
2000, 2005, 2010?
The beauty of doomsday predictions is they just keep up the rhetoric and move the goalposts to a new future date! No need to explain why they were so wrong…no one seems to ask!
Just like religion eh?
Totally disagree that nationalising and centralising the water will protect it. It will do the opposite, make it nice and easy to sell all and bits of it, offshore like they did with power.
Being in councils protects it a lot more, as hard to sell it easily if it’s small and across the country.
To protect it, government just need to legislate that it is unable to be sold by councils. If they can’t do that due to trade agreements, then they should never have signed. Obviously taking responsibility is out of the question…
Labour are the ones that signed the free trade agreement, they would sell their own grandma if MBIE and business, told them to!
Other reasons that 3 waters will not work is, they government can’t create laws to build affordable houses either. Their terrible law changes have created a massive crisis (that was easy to predict) while lefties egged them on, as all too lazy to work out it would not work as it was demand driven by investors and foreign first home buyers, they then gave the green light to get more of!
Labour are only good at doing nothing and in the case of 3 waters and all the terrible new laws like woke sexual crime, and change your own gender on your birth certificate, will cause the same harm and mayhem to victims and constant court battles everywhere and police and justice overload, as their appalling housing law changes.
Labour through foolishness made many children, live in emergency houses, when they ‘cancelled’ the small landlords because the woke (paid by right wing interests) told them to.
How did giving money and zoning law changes to developers help? It has instead created a frenzy of pretend and luxury building in the worst possible locations on cheap building land.
Wait till it all floods!!! Then where will the people live, back to emergency housing and needing benefits from the government on mass!
The cycle of stupidity and reckless behaviour devoid of quality and reason, continues!
Natz if they get in will have a field day, making team of 5 million 35 million and selling off every inch of NZ to pay for it.
Bang on. This article is trash.
Welcome to corrupt NZ – where industry can just liquidate companies and then make associated companies try to claim debts….
Before another grab at power with 3 waters – maybe look at why NZ is such a mess and full of corruption in many industries and few prosecuted with jail!
‘Where did it go?’ – Question over $8m debt claimed by property developer and the struggle to find a paper trail
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/where-did-it-go-question-over-8m-debt-claimed-by-property-developer-and-the-struggle-to-find-a-paper-trail/UADUHCDKODQ445QCVFKWR3CFYI/
it does have to be said that the idea NZ doesn’t have corruption holds as much water as ‘clean and green’
We also have laws that positively encourage white collar crime, though the likes of the ‘sensible sentencing trust’ is noticeably quite on that front.
Yep, obviously if you are a subcontractor or person owed money for labour that doesn’t have to be paid due to NZ’s lax rules, it is another reason why people vote with their feet and leaving NZ if they have decent skills and morals. Why train to be a tradie or stay in the industry if you are not paid a lot of the time through the ease of liquidation, and there are a plethora of people pretending they have similar skills, but don’t know what they are doing undercutting you?
My guess the latest trend will be to reduce hours of work for skilled people. Why work when people don’t have to pay you, or pay you below international rates, for the so called ‘privilege’ or working in NZ.
Meanwhile others choosing alternative lifestyles like gangs and fake companies are the new heroes with extra benefits in NZ like wage subsidies, cash sales and money/tax laundering .
Neolibs are very worried about inflation from raising wages, but don’t care a less about food rip offs, consumer rip offs, and construction rip offs raising the cost of living for everyone in NZ, through cartels and other avenues that the government turn a blind eye to.
If it is a ‘product’ you are allowed to increase prices 25% per month in NZ, or the fake ‘sales at normal pricing, but if you are a person paying wages, to pay more for labour, is a crime against neoliberalism.
Some of the unions seem to have given up on Kiwi workers and now concentrating on benefits for temporary migrants like permanent residency and welfare, as it’s a much easier fit with NZ neoliberal ideology to keep encouraging high demand for more exploiters, exploited, gang members, consumers and slaves. One person come work or study in NZ and the other zero waged 5 family members, get to come too with Kiwis supporting the lifestyle and they all need to buy products and housing from the rip off merchants!
Also agree, about sensible sentencing trust, no concerns if it is white collar crime getting off jail time.
NZ’s explosion of ‘pretty’ legal white collar crime is one reason why nobody wants to list on NZ share market, the Mainzeals, and other associate company transfers that lead to liquidation and creditors not being paid, also has a massive loss for numerous families leading to suicide, health issues and non interest in working as it is not a fair system in NZ anymore. It’s become part of NZ culture to rip off labour and considered a good management skill here. Meanwhile they can’t work out why productivity and innovation is falling, and there is little confidence in the NZ system.
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