Ummmmm, forcing Jami-Lee Ross into mental health services? What?

Whoa, whoa, whoa!

MP Jami-Lee Ross admitted to mental health care

MP Jami-Lee Ross has been taken into mental health care.

Newstalk ZB understands he was taken in by police.

He was taken to a facility in Auckland.

A National Party spokesman said: “Over the past several weeks the National Party has taken seriously the mental health concerns raised by Mr Ross and the medical professionals he has been involved with. That has included seeking advice from medical professionals and involving Police wherever necessary to ensure support is made available to Mr Ross. It would not be appropriate to comment further.”

Ross took leave from Parliament at the beginning of the month. He told reporters this week that it was because he was “devastated” at being accused of harassment and denied natural justice.

When he talked to media on Tuesday and Wednesday, he said that his doctor had cleared him and he was feeling healthy. He rejected comments from National deputy leader Paula Bennett that he was suffering from mental health issues, saying that his doctor had called Bennett to tell her that he was healthy.

Those comments were made before six women spoke publicly about what they called bullying and intimidating behaviour from Ross. Ross disagreed with the way the women portrayed him in media reports, but admitted to extra-marital affairs and said he had apologised to his wife Lucy Schwaner.

Paula Bennett has repeatedly expressed concern for Ross’ health.

It is unclear if Ross was admitted under the Mental Health (Compulsory Assessment and Treatment) Act, which means that someone can be admitted to a safe place and given treatment against their will if their safety is considered at risk.

Am I reading this correctly? Has JLR been forced into mental health care? Folks, we can all be disgusted by his behaviour – but we also can see involuntary imprisonment by the State into mental health custody as ummmm terrifying right?

Look, if he has suffered a mental health break down where he is unable to make rational decisions for himself and is a threat to himself, that is a terrible outcome and while his actions and behaviour have been offensive, on a purely human level, what a tragic outcome and a symptom of the clusterfuck toxic masculinity leaves in its wake.

Buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut IFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF this is something else, ummmmmmmmm, I mean, Jesus wept!

We are in incredibly dangerous waters now. I think it is of the highest importance that IF JLR has been forcibly taken into mental health custody that decision be reviewed immediately to ensure that a terrible wrong hasn’t just occurred.

Because, Jesus folks, just – JESUS!

This is a shocking turn of events in a story that has managed to lower the bar with every single revelation.


    • Interesting you should mention “civil war” because there are now many influential people who will not idly stand by and see Jacinda Ardern taken down, either by collateral damage from the National party in fighting or further “Dirty Politics”. The National party can implode and disintegrate if they must but their days of any influence in the running of this country are numbered.

      • I’ll be standing in the frontline of that war. No one touches our Jacinda. The bitter National party hags and their henchmen won’t know what hit them if they try.

  1. Jami-Lee Ross crossed a line he’ll never be able to come back from when he threatened to release text messages proving beyond all doubt that National’s ‘Parnell Jesus’ was corrupt. National will go to any lengths to prevent that from happening.

    • Paula Bennett has no qualms in releasing personal information. She is a hideous political beast at it’s worst. Remember back to the two solo mothers when Bennett said she would do the same if she had too, well that had too was JLR.

    • Yes Simonm, JLR will be cleared and released in 21 days. Around about the time he would have been evicted by the Waka jumping bill.

  2. The only official that can have him involuntarily admitted to mental health care is a psychiatrist. (we actually don’t know if it was involuntary or not). The bar for involuntary sectioning is INCREDIBLY high. It means he was either a clear and present risk to himself, or to others. Very often, family members will be rightly concerned about a person, but they will not be sectioned because despite being very obviously unwell, they are not yet a risk to themselves or anyone else. A person’s autonomy is held very highly in mental health, so it’s not a matter of ‘the state’ or whatever just taking him in to shut him up.

    • Can he forcibly be put in front of said psychiatrist for causing “danger” to NZ democracy (i.e. can that technically count as a danger to “others”)? If so who, exactly, has the authority to make that decision? Finally, who appoints said psychiatrist for the assessment?

      • No. The Mental Health Act specifically rules out sectioning someone on the basis of their political views.
        ‘Sectioning’ or use of MHA involves independent assessments by two doctors, one being a consultant psychiatrist. Each DHB has a roster of psychiatrists providing cover out of office hours.
        Both doctors must be satisfied that there are symptoms of a mental disorder (e.g. depression or anxiety) and risk to self or others (e.g. suicidal intent).

      • Short answer, no, that doesn’t count. And no, you can’t be forcibly put in front of a psychiatrist unless you are at great physical danger to yourself or others.
        Sorry to ruin the conspiracy theory but a ‘threat’ to NZ democracy in the form of airing potential dirty laundry doesn’t fit that criteria.

        • Hey man, it’s not my theory. I was just posting a question on how “danger” is defined to see if it was legally possible to force someone into psychiatric care against their will as implied by Bomber in this blog.

        • You are 100% correct itme. Having had personal experience in the past couple of years with a family member, i know how incredibly hard it is to have a person sectioned. (as it should be)

    • NOPE, as of early this year a mental health nurse can do the job quite legit. They lowered the bar by amending the relevant statute, it was started when the Nats brought in the law change, I think.

    • This is what it takes, it only requires a registered nurse or practising mental health nurse to provide a needed certificate alongside an application by any person (an applicant):

      “8B Certificate to accompany application for assessment

      (1) This section applies when—
      (a) a health practitioner is asked, by an applicant, to issue a certificate to accompany the application form; or
      (b) a health practitioner is the applicant and wishes to issue a certificate to accompany his or her application form.

      (2) A health practitioner to whom subsection (1)(a) applies must not issue a certificate if he or she is related to the applicant or to the person.

      (3) A health practitioner to whom subsection (1)(b) applies must not issue a certificate if he or she is related to the person.

      (4) The health practitioner must—
      (a) examine the person; and
      (b) if he or she considers that there are reasonable grounds for believing that the person may be suffering from a mental disorder, issue the certificate.

      (5) The certificate must—
      (a) state that the health practitioner has examined the person:
      (b) state the date of the examination:
      (c) state that the health practitioner considers that there are reasonable grounds for believing that the person may be suffering from a mental disorder:
      (d) set out full particulars of the reasons for that opinion, explaining in what way the health practitioner believes that the person’s condition may come within the statutory definition of mental disorder:
      (e) state that the health practitioner is not related to the person or to the applicant (except when the health practitioner is the applicant).

      (6) In this section,—

      health practitioner means—
      (a) a medical practitioner; or
      (b) a nurse practitioner; or
      (c) a registered nurse practising in mental health

      registered nurse practising in mental health means a health practitioner who—
      (a) is, or is deemed to be, registered with the Nursing Council of New Zealand continued by section 114(1)(a) of the Health Practitioners Competence Assurance Act 2003 as a practitioner of the profession of nursing and whose scope of practice includes the assessment of a person’s mental capacity; and
      (b) holds a current practising certificate.”

      The law was changed to be effective from January 2018, so to include nurses and mental health nurses to be able to provide a certificate, as far as I know.

  3. So. Who made the call? The Nats or whanau or a Nat MP or MP’s? National party HQ? Peter no so Goodfellow?

  4. given the polices very close connections to the national party was this done to muzzle him ?, and if so we have a very very serious problem with corruption in this country i think the coalition government will need to act and announce a royal commission to investigate national party corruption at the highest levels. national and there backers have become a very real threat to the well being of the people of this country .

      • National Party people have already stated a number of times that they’ve involved mental health professionals and police. It’s an unprecedented move for any employer. Might be a first for infidelity.

        • It could well mean that he is sick so did not respond to the standard behind doors threats to him and family nor the likely provision of substantial hush money to go quietly.

          Minds you this could be what is happening now with an planned exit that will be used to discredit his claims.

          • For me the more national wonks respond to there displays of incompetence the more it just confirms what we’ve known all along – Simon Bridges is running for the Olympic gold in fibbing.

    • I fully agree with Darth on this.

      Why haven’t a police spokesperson spoke up?

      We must demand a independent investigation into this muzzling and forced incarceration of Jami Lee Ross immediately as this looks like being where we are entering into a “police State” situation now.

      This makes the Police raid in the urawheres look tame by comparison.

    • In the most recent public interview (Ross vs de Plessis Allen ZB Friday) he appears remarkably sane to me. Far more so than at any time in the 10 days preceding

      All the more reason it appears the convenience of a long weekend has been taken advantage of to get Ross locked up and the evidence located

      • Indeed, even if there may have been hints of irrational behaviour, that alone is not sufficient to establish a ‘mental disorder’.

        The often thrown around concepts of ‘mental health’, ‘mental illness’, even psychological or psychiatric conditions of various types, they do not necessarily mean a person is truly deluded, is truly seriously unwell.

        So much can fall under the umbrella ‘mental health issues’, the terminology is increasingly abused by the ones working in the health sector, by administrators, even by some sufferers themselves, so to use it for reaching one’s own ends.

        There are serious conditions, there can be serious depression and common depression, there can be ‘normal’ anxiety or fear, there can be severe anxiety.

        I fear that in this case there may really be potential abuse of the mental health legislation and of the system, so to keep the man shut up and kept away from the public and colleagues for some time.

        He may though be out again sooner than later, and then new attempts may be made to silence him.

        Those who have suffered serious mental health will also know how patronising health professionals, health administrators, other bureaucrats, employers and much of the public are, when it comes to ‘mental health’.

        All vows of understanding, of support and all nice words do not hide the fact, that sufferers of mental health conditions do more often get treated like they cannot be ‘normal’, cannot do certain thinks and are not to be taken too seriously. When it comes to legal applications, such people are more often written off, than truly supported and taken seriously. We live in BS PC overdrive times with endless lies, deceit and backstabbing, that really goes on.

  5. In terms of all the delusional homeless people I see who are screaming at passers by about racist nurses putting sleeping pills in their coffee to steal their weed is to me, a problem health professionals can address.

    Guy has an affair, lies to wife, gets caught up in The National Party machine and is sent into severe depressions? Seems a little difficult to address.

  6. If anyone needs a mental health assessment, it’s the anti-human National Party members. This is just sick. It’s like living in Russia. No doubt about it, some very powerful people want to shut Jamie-Lee up. The Karma is with so many people now awake to what’s really going on, the backlash on National is going to be huge.

    • Poor bastard. It’s a great shame the sanctimonious political cow who pulled the bed sheets back last week can’t be muzzled too.

      It is very hard to get people committed nowadays, and rightly so. He may find more sanity in a psych ward – and chances are he won’t be in there long, maybe off to somewhere where he can get real non-threatening support, like Ashburn Hall.

      He’s only 33, at the start of his life, and it was not a very good start being conditioned in a very sick artificial milieu of sick selfish grabbers – and I don’t include Simon Bridges in that, but I do include most of the vulgarian National women who piss me off incredibly. Where was Louise Upston when bovver boy Key was pulling ponytails ? Hmm ?

      “How many kids have you got, Petal ?” Unctuous Barry. “Zip it up, Sweetie” Ghastly Bennett. Collins’s pathetic online machinations with Whale Oil, and smugness about being smug. They shame us as women.

      This isn’t Russia. The guy had to be shut down, but he may have been closing himself down anyway, and one can only wish him well.

      Probably psych tests on all the dirty politics people before they do any more harm to each other and to this wounded country.

      And pray. Tracy Watkins said Mark Mitchell is a politician in the mold of John Key. Thanks Trace, but I think we can do much better than that. Well I mean we are – the country turned to some-one clean and wholesome, Ardern. Get used to it.

  7. Its true is a serious territory we are entering now… but !

    Who started all this?

    Well , – was it the toxic legacy of the Key years ? Dirty Politics ? – or just the plain end game results of the anti democratic ideology of neo liberalism we are experiencing?

    And would all of this , culminating and embedded firmly in the National party by and large, have happened if right back in 1984 Roger Douglas had been stopped?

    A long bow to draw?

    I think not.

    Because that odious ideology has enabled so much in the decline of standards in this country. This is globalism calling. This is what it breeds. The Slater’s, The Lusk’s, The Keys, The English’s, The Bennett’s, The Richardson’s, – 34 going on 35 years of skulduggery in high places is coming home to roost.

    I’m glad we have the coalition govt. NZ would not have lasted another term of the globalist , Chinaphile National party. I’m glad Winston Peters has not retired. Look at the alternative, – a seedy , abusive anti democratic , anti sovereignty party like National.

    Now it is true,… if this is a type of incarceration via the mental health legislation,… we are in deep waters. But always remember if it is , – it started with National. Always remember that.

  8. jamie lee jimbob obviously suffering from cognitive dissonance and it looks likes perhaps mania.
    when the forces of the state who are untrained enforcers are let loose then it is time for great consternation about the constitution of this state.

    • McMurphy the police are compelled to attend and pick up anyone threatening to self-harm. Normally they take them to their local holding cells and ring the mental health people to come and do an assessment.

      And wait. And wait. And wait – because the mental health services are under funded and under staffed because that’s exactly how John Key and Bill English and co wanted them to be.

      Cops have little training in mental health issues, but they do have protocols which they have to follow, and they are likely very meticulous about it too, after having been used time and again by bullying politicians.They are likely to be very very careful.

      No way the police could pick up Jami-Lee Ross just on a call from some National Party person – unless he was doing something untoward. Some reports say he was being supported by Simon Lusk and Whale Oil, which is frankly surreal given that the pair of them have so much to answer for in dragging NZ politics into such dark and dirty places – with willing followers.

      What triggered this may be none of our business, and nor should it be used to deflect attention from the issues Ross raised, inadvertently or not, about the National Party selling political power and advantage.

      Bridge triggered all this by over-reacting to his expenses apparently being leaked, and Bennett used her broomstick to flick back private bed clothes utterly disgracefully, but that is, after all Paula’s modus operandi.
      Men do not hold a monopoly on toxicity.

      • If Jamie-Lee was the “expenses” leaker, then he also threatened to commit suicide if identified. However, if he WAS the leaker, recent events would strongly suggest that he has changed his mind about that; so the suicide threat should not have constituted a reason for the sectioning.

  9. This is weird and reminiscent of what has actually occurred politically in mainland China and in Malaysia .China has the death penalty . China executes people every year. It does not have a Justice system .
    Look at what happened to Russel Norman when he protested against China over their genocide in Tibet.He was pilloried by the NZ press.

    However the signs of severe mental distress are there. am sure he will recover quickly. I really don’t care tho because he is utter douchebag!

  10. It happens on a Saturday night, the media reports it late the following afternoon on a long weekend. But no details about the process.

    1. Who got access to his phone/phones, other electronic devices etc in that time … (identify and remove while he is isolated)
    2. within a month he loses parliamentary privilege, if he is not able to attend in that time he will not be able to use it (and without any lost evidence he is vulnerable in court if he speaks truth to power outside of parliament).

  11. A far more mundane explanation is he is mentally unwell which is public knowledge,, fronted by JLR himself. The last month would be enough to break the most steely of humans.

    He has either done something pretty concerning or is having serious thoughts of doing something serious and has either consented to be seen by mental health or being sectioned by mental health. They use police for this purpose to assist in emergencies, that’s it!!!

    I do not know what is in the corn flakes this week people, but the Stasi/Gestapo/KGB have not suddenly morphed into the NZ Police taking a Member of Parliament against his will, down into a castles torture chamber to have Igor perform a frontal lobotomy to keep him silent! Even Judith Collins doesn’t have that kind of pull!

    I just hope for his sake he doesn’t get the service or lack thereof that mere mortals get from the mental health service his National government tried so hard to run into the ground with their total indifference and budget cuts!

  12. Very worrying, very worrying indeed. Perfect timing in the evening during a long weekend. In another country in another decade this would be considered “Nacht und Nebel” (Night and Fog) and be considered normal practice shut up the outspoken.

    Wheres our leader? Not a murmur from her. Winston is usually outspoken…why so quiet today? Looks like National and their masters are going to succeed in silencing Ross.

    How long before they come for us?

    • Depending on how ‘serious’ his situation may be considered, and on the practitioners they use, it can take weeks until JLR may be able to have a chance to escape the regime they put into place under this statute:

      ‘Mental Health (Compulsory Assessment and Treatment) Act 1992′

      ’16 Review of patient’s condition by Judge’

      After the lapse of weeks following reviews, JLR could be examined by a Judge, who may provide an assessment that may be a different one than made before, depending on the circumstances of course.

  13. Ooooo… exciting stuff!
    Fuck them all. It’s about time they were made to panic. I have no sympathy for any of the bastards.

  14. Wankers, this guy is crazy.
    Don’t defend him, as if you do you are the same. Don’t care what party he’s on this is …..really don’t know how to describe.

  15. Martyn, your paranoia is so over the top to the point of appearing unhinged. You give justification to the term “The Loopy Left”.

    Jami-Lee is clearly unwell. It is very easy to imagine why a man who has lost the confidence of his wife, colleagues and friends is distraught to the point of needing mental health care. Your insinuation that some dark political figures are pulling strings to silence Jami-Lee is astonishing in its lack of logic. All you are doing is stirring the pot of delusion by giving credence to some of your followers’ own fallacious thinking.

    Personally, I hope Simon Bridges fronts the media in the morning to call time out in this whole saga. For the sake of JLR and his kids, I hope Bridges stands up and says the National will put all of this aside until JLR becomes well. The focus should be on his health now – nothing more.

    • There seems to be no-one involved in his sectioning but national MPs and political activists. No family members or neighbours or apolitical friends. It makes it impossible to avoid the political implications.
      D J S

    • JLR is a sitting MP who is currently dishing dirt. It is very natural for us to be suspicious and the lack of any statement from family or Police is strange. The alternative is to be Naieve at best.

  16. Does anybody remember the John Key ponytail pulling episode? Of course we do. But one thing that seems to have disappeared is why did the waitress suddenly go quiet. She could have had him convicted and therefore he would have had to step down as prime minister. Does anyone else think she was threatened into silence or just paid off with one of these famous National-style confidentiality agreements?

    Is that same nastiness now happening to JLR?

  17. There are questions to be asked indeed. I remember the law was amended not long ago, so to expand on powers to have someone assessed compulsorily, and to have someone treated.

    That is what I believe was done then.

    In any case, a court must first decide, so Jami Lee Ross will have to be brought before a Judge on Monday, I suppose.

    Who told the police, I wonder, and can the police simply act upon a reported incident needing to be acted upon, or have they acted beyond of what is reasonable?

    Has Simon Bridges called in the police, was it Jami Lee Ross’ partner or someone else, I wonder.

    The legal provisions:

    Strange all this indeed, very strange, NZ Inc police state anyone?

    • +100…interesting comments MARC

      …and another thought…maybe he went in himself to protect himself from outside threats

      …he certainly has his finger on the trigger of Nactional Party corruption , so he would have a lot of enemies…including jonkey’s Nactional Party

      ….the other point is that mental asylums have been used by totalitarian regimes for dissidents and whistle blowers eg Stalinist Russia

      ….so if this is the work of the National Party it must be exposed in the name of civil liberties

      …and the Labour led Coalition Government must investigate and provide him with protection

  18. When Bridges launched his ‘inquiry’ into leaks of information (about his own expenses) that would be publicly known a couple of days later, Police advised they knew the leaker and as the person had mental health problems they would keep the name secret. As well, they suggested restraint. So what did our caring gnats do? The gnat posse launches into a vile pursuit. Bridges continues to hunt for the leaker and then publicly announces that it was Ross. He’s caught. A deeply concerned Bennett forecasts complaints about Ross’ peccadilloes with females around Parliament. Caught out again. Ross fights back with taped conversations that expose Bridges’ fraud with election donations.
    Now we get restraint. Ross is straightjacketed and his next lot of exposes stopped. Have the heavy handed gnats covered up their political problems? Your commentators suggest it’s likely they have just started on a new round of scandals that bring NZ closer to Russian or Chinese ‘solutions’.

  19. Seems it may have been Jami Lee Ross’ wife or another relative or person close to him, who asked a medical or health practitioner to assess the rogue Nat MP.

    These are the legal requirements for a compulsory assessment and treatment:

  20. well, a doctor will get a free lunch from that. lets see what happens when one of their (ex) own is one of the affected.

    he must legally be a risk to self or others as a direct result of a mental illness which is then classed as a mental disorder… or be under assessment to see if he is…… which is the loophole they are probably running. expect him to be out within a week if that’s the case.

  21. Martyn;

    UPDATE: by Andrew Geddis

    “[Update: According to media reports, Jami-Lee Ross has been taken into mental health care (i.e. has not voluntarily committed himself for treatment).

    Good to see Q&A cover the issue of Chinese influence, that then lead me to wonder;

    With this now out in the open and Ross promising more revelations,
    could he possibly be deemed a threat to National Security?


  22. This really is quite scary! The most unbalanced looking people of last week, Simon B and Paula B are still part of running our country and JLR has been disappeared to a mental health facility! Who are protagonists behind this? The Herald suggests this is not a voluntary admission of JLR but essentially taken by Police and with people like David Farrar saying stuff like; “Let’s worry about Jami-Lee’s health. There are obviously still issues to be resolved, but not in the next days, or weeks even. That doesn’t mean good outcomes for all those involved in the medium term, but it’s an opportunity for things to calm down.” Really! And David F is now a compassionate clinical pschologist, along with a sudden swing to the Nats being empathetic, caring people after really coming out to destroy him all week. Really?!?
    It feels like he was getting too close to dishing dirt on the really big powerful/wealthy players like John Key and it was time to silence him. Maybe just a “left wing conspiracy theory” but it smells!

    • “And David F is now a compassionate clinical pschologist, along with a sudden swing to the Nats being empathetic, caring people after really coming out to destroy him all week. Really?!?”

      Exactly – all very vomit inducing.

  23. this whole saga has been a laugh, it’s the gift that keeps giving. labour have to be smiling, jlr has knocked homelessness & poverty, teachers pay out of the media for a while. And lets be honest it is fun watching the nats tear themselves apart. come on jlr take a few more down with you

    • No, FTP, it is not fun watching the Nats tearing themselves, or each other apart. It is appalling.

      It may be the Nat/numskull way of functioning, but it shows the far right have regressed on the evolutionary scale – unless, of course, they have always lagged behind. Probably.

      Anthropologically and gutter press interesting, and that’s about it.

  24. Of course, now that the Nats have arranged for our Police to “section” Jamie Lee Ross into a mental hospital, the rest of his recorded phone calls and texts absolutely MUST appear next

    If they don’t appear, then the whole country will make the conclusion that while he was locked up (with his phone taken away from him) that National have deleted all of the evidence

    National can’t win

  25. Reading that awesum toilet paper blogger Blubber Oils spin on the situ with his mate JLR. He says that he was with JLR in the early hours of Saturday am when ‘he’ called JLR’s wife who then called the Police???
    Then he goes on to talk about all of the juicy inside info he has on Bridges! Did he just steal from JLR this informtion from JLR’s office? What a cunt! Doing the dirty work for the National party!

    • not what I am reading on that site:

      “Yesterday was a rather stressful day for me. I and a good friend have been working constantly over the last few days to help Jami-Lee Ross, who was to us clearly in distress. On Saturday night things took a turn for the worse and we received a text message at 0400 that indicated he was in care and not by choice”

  26. Surprised he wasn’t killed in a car accident. Love him or loath him, JLR has become a martyr for those of us who absolutely despise our rotten to the core party political system of governance, & the liberal globalisation elite who perpetuate it. If he gets through this my advice for him would be to launch a Manson like anti-party politics cult. I’m sure many would come flocking.

  27. Jamal Khashoggi, Washington Post journalist went into the Saudi consulate. He was killed there apparently and taken away.

    Bennett and Co (Key, English) killed off the mental health system over the years, but now tenderly caring about JLR’s mental health.

    JLR goes into ‘somewhere’ and nobody in the know is saying anything.
    Is this the NZ non-fatal carefully rehearsed version of making a ‘problem’ disappear?

    Corruption comes in many forms, some milder than others but eventually, all forms become hard core, because nobody stops it.

    Nobody mentions the control already exerted over our sovereignty, by political figures in JLR’s corrupt landscape, both in parliament and outside it.

  28. JLR has i am sure a tonne of dirt on that shyster Key , English , Joyce and others i have no doubt.

    This is an attempt to silence him and i the pressure on him and his family will be utterly intense.

    He has taken on very powerful enemies and they will be conspiring to destroy him and the important information he has on the last ten years.
    It has been a tight ship up until now which is how Key gota away with his crimes and corruption.

    Don’t forget that the media will play their part in providing the gullible public with a judge , jury and executioner.

    The cover up started a few days ago.

  29. What happens if JLR dies? Suicide? What will we believe really happened or more importantly what is happening? Hard to believe but things may get worse for those critical of corruption, that’s effectively what he’s doing (regardless of motivation). I’m worried, genuinely concerned…..

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