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  1. It looks as if this will only be settled with handbags at 30 paces.

    Gentlemen! Choose your weapon!

  2. i can’t help thinking you have given Trotter more attention than he deserves. However, the subject he writes on does deserve attention. To me it is simple. I believe in the Treaty and Article 2 promised that maori could retain their land, estates etc. for so long as they wished. Until all of the land which was confiscated in Taranaki is returned to the hapu of Te Atiawa and Taranaki and so forth then the Treaty is still breached. The land is still stolen. In the coming week or so a random person will win over $30 million in Lotto. This is more than many iwi received as a so called settlement for the theft of all their land. This is the contempt with which Government still holds toward Maori.

    1. “i can’t help thinking you have given Trotter more attention than he deserves.”
      But, but, but don’t you know who He is?

      Sad, but the guy really has lost His way and He’s not doing Himself any favours. I recall 5 or so years ago a friend, and acquaintance of the Trotter saying “He’s all over the place” He is, and it seems to coincide with the passing of His mate Gerry who probably held the logic gates in that relationship.

      1. For context on Andrews comment,,, and his past history of commenting ,,,,,

        Andrew is a immigrant Pom & uber Zionist ,,, but ignoring his support for extreme racism maintained with extreme violence over there ,,, ignoring his hypocrisy ,,, he has a extensive history of repeating Israel propaganda as fact ,,, and NATO propaganda too for that matter….

        He’s not a lawyer ,,,, he’s a Pom immigrant ,,, he’s a Zionist and a border racist than just that ….

        …. His opinions on our various treaty matters should be weighted accordingly.

        N8V Child — https://youtu.be/vZHoz0IRAyU

    2. Peter, your $30 million comment is priceless. Here in Aotearoa we of an Anglo lineage, like those in Canada, USA, Australia sit upon the stolen real estate of the indigenous. Then when we finally address this we give pennies in the pound. And bigots like Seymour who fetishize “property rights” don’t recognize indigenous peoples property rights.

  3. It’s all technocracy and temu these days. Decolonisation seems to be a handy road for a detour around the practical issues (eg. fuel contamination and engine failure). There is a hidden tunnel which goes to the washroom in the beehive called local council and there’s no wifi signal so no updates.

  4. Forgot to mention three obscure points that are historically relevant to Trotter’s American Civil War examination:

    1. The British, and NZ, were generally pro-Confederacy. (Being anti-slavery I take it their support was to do with splitting their rival to reduce US power, not any love for slaveholding, but?).

    2. In Hansard (I think it was 1865) it is recorded in a debate in the House that a letter had been received from the US Government stating they see the NZ colonial government cannot win the war with Maori and offering to send their military to subdue them in return for becoming a US state. The letter was met with laughter in the chamber according to Hansard and the MPs responded that they had the war under control (they didn’t – the British forces had to remain well after their withdrawal date because it was not under control with Te Kooti especially).

    3. Not a convenient fact to recite, but for historical accuracy I must note it: the “Indian Territory” (now Oklahoma) where the displaced tribes from the East were herded had slavery and joined the Confederacy and was I think the last place to surrender to the North. There are no parallels with the Kingitanga or the situation in NZ however – there were no slaves anywhere except for maybe the Chatham Islands in the 1860s. Instances of prisoners being kept in slave-like conditions are to be found on both sides however. There was at least one incident in the Land Wars when Kupapa soldiers tried to take the women of defeated tribes as a war prize but the European officers put a stop to it from what I recall.

  5. Great piece.
    And it rebutts the big lie they’re trying to trot out (no pun intended). THat decolonisation is racist. It ain’t about race.

    Colonisation is a foreign system of cultural power instituted on unwilling people, subjugating their persons and cultures. When the influx on 10s of thousands of British settlers flooded in and used their power to breach the treaty, they put Aotearoa under colonial rule. “But we’re all free & colour blind under the law in this super peaceful and equal society” simply does not even begin to engage with the reality.
    We should be proud of the fact that decolonisation began with the Waitangi Tribunal, and all interested and engged in where it could take us as a society. A Maori worldview has a lot to offer the binary control and dominate disease that inflicts Western society, and the runt fruit of the anglo world that is NZ. Let Maori institutions flourish and develop organically, as they were, as they will continue to.
    I know most people are feeling insecure about jobs, money the world, but that is BECAUSE of the Western quest to control and dominate and how that has shaped our corporatist capitalist society, and didn’t the “pandemic” show how they can whip us so (but not the united iwi who quietly dissented). It ain’t because the iwi are getting some of their bikkies back out of our back pocket. t is the structure of our society as is, and the nature of the few people who benefit from it that are the problem. THey’re just pointing “look, racist separatists” to distract us all from the ones that have been raking it in for decades, and continue to rake it in.

  6. “Does denying human equality and rejecting the principles of colour-blind citizenship place you among the baddies? Yes, I’m afraid it does. The demon of unrest has claimed you for his own.”

    I’m finding it increasingly difficult to follow Trotter’s line of reasoning. His columns are getting more and more convoluted. I gave up on him for a while for various reasons, but went back – a little like a dog to its own vomit as they used to say. Mind you are not at all sure I follow your line of reasoning here either and I have at least a couple of degrees in subjects requiring a facility with the English language.
    However if indeed he is saying that we should have a “colourblind” society, he is doing no more than repeat the nuttiness you find on the MSN comments section whenever Maori are mentioned, particularly if they look like getting something they “don’t deserve”.
    I have suggested several times that he and the Conservatives who comment on his blog site read “Racism without racists” by (not sure of the spelling and can’t be bothered looking it up anymore life’s too short) Bon illa -Silva. He points out how so-called colourblind societies have for years now, embedded institutional racism.
    I’ve also repeatedly pointed out that – until the various minorities that engage in identity politics get the same outputs from the political system is the majority, then there will continue to be identity politics, it’s inevitable, and I don’t see a great deal wrong with it.
    After all, it was identity politics that fuelled the black civil rights movement in the US, and the women’s suffrage movement in the 19th and early 20th centuries. But Trotter has taken against it with a vengeance, because he thinks presumably that class-based politics can solve all the problems faced by minorities. Not so. It is reasonable at ironing out economic differences, but that’s about it. And even then it has its limitations. Class-based politics can and will do nothing to restore Maori language and culture among other things. Partly because the very restoration of these things causes an adverse reaction amongst those who think we should have a ‘colourblind’ society.
    I must confess I find his comparisons with slaveowners and the American Civil War as bizarre. But I may go into that a little war when his column appears on his blog.

    1. Sorry for the confusion about “colour-blind” when I said everyone agrees, I meant non-racial policies are what people agree with (as opposed to the spurious “colour-blind” notion which seeks to deny disadvantage etc.).

    2. The sick people on MSN are the same river of filth that voted for Winston .I used to be on there a lot and witnessed there depravity during the pandemic .Some of them are sub human .

  7. Watch out Tim S that you don’t sink into mere sneer and smear. Martyn aims to have quick witted and wise comment and declamations here and succeeds most of the time. Having a go at roping the legs of Trotter and any free-ranging stags and bringing them down is the sport and work of a cowboy. Whether it is good or bad, the rodeo has received bad press with thumbs down lately in NZAO. You could try the lassoo and corral the largest antlers until having say twelve points are reached and then debate whether they are ‘royal’.

  8. oops. lost me at libertarian socialist – is that like nazi lite? asking for a friend.

    1. It means that you try to induce Jeffrey Epstein to move left by going to his sex parties.

      1. MK you dodge past the subject when you bring up J Epstein. I think that is solely US and UK – or has NZAO been involved? Could you not foment trouble for no good reason? Saying applies, ‘Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof’.

  9. what trotter fails to see is that Maori are not an homogenous mob as he imagines it to be except for one thing, cultural hegemony. maori accept it. but when the shoe is on the other foot – it’s carnage – so immature

    1. Immature you are right. The philosophers, which most of us have little truck with any of, know that we have trouble down the generations reaching any or passing on mature considerations.

  10. sorry tl:dr maori have accepted for so long and yet, here we are. most rational thinking people have too. it’s always Management that needs the shake up.

  11. Hilarious. The world would be a better place if the American Civil War had not ended with the successful formation by Lincoln of an American empire under the control of the money power. Just ask the people of the Philippines, Cuba, hundreds more REAL nations.

  12. Trotter was a fake from the get go, a fantasist, an egoist who carved out a comfortable niche as the mainstream media’s acceptable voice of the good old kiwi left, in the heady 1980s days of the neo liberal revolution. Acceptable so as to salve the dissolving souls and class memory of the liberal middle class who, sated from the 1981 orgy of virtue signalling could smell the money so close they could almost touch it.

    And in the destruction of the actual Left, in the void,
    Trotter, the running dog, tearing at and dragging those shreds of working class organisation, thinking and iconography to puff up his fake romance as The Voice of the Left.

    Only in the wake of 40 years of dumbing down could he ever have been taken for an intellectual, or thought leader. A not-even-careful analysis of his current tangled prose garners nothing but regret of the effort. He was and remains a parasite, trying to repeat his career-making scavenging off the still warm corpse of class politics, now by gnawing on the cold, dry bones of the settler colonial project.

    1. This bitterness expressed is an example of how factions develop and spend their energies despising those who divert from the their one true way. That dispute and dissension is a major reason why we are where we are today, which is crushed by technology and lack of love for humanity, each other. Instead we have ranting hard liners who will continue the unpleasant attitudes that we seem better at carrying through generations than the practices of civilised thoughtful respectful and positive-action behaviour.

      Let’s aim for a new-type secular State of Grace which is not one of perfection according to MY opinion.

  13. I used to comment at Bowalley, however during the pandemic Chris and some of his cohort became totally authoritarian. Chris is actually far from liberal, his understanding of individual rights versus compulsion is zero.

  14. On one level when Trotter suggests that we should be “colour blind” he is saying that we should have no racial bias. This is how most of us would interpret his metaphor. But on another level he is implying that we take on the disability of colour blindness, an obstinate refusal to see the aroha, beauty, vibrancy and colour of Maori living as Maori.
    There are those in the political establishment who feel threatened by Maoritanga, and not without reason. As well as serving as a cultural taonga independently of all other political systems or cultures, Maoritanga was the line of defence against colonialism, and remains the only real alternative to the complete triumph of neo-liberalism.
    Then there are those who have no such fears of Maoritanga, but who harbour a feeling that Maori have something that non-Maori are missing out on. The colour, the warmth, and the security of a collective whanau and hapu based culture of which non-Maori have been deprived. So the first group are working actively to arouse the second against Maori. In other words the ACT party is employing the politics of envy against directly against Maori and indirectly against Pakeha, because if their Treaty Principles project were to succeed Pakeha would lose even more than Maori.
    The Treaty Principles Bill in concert with the “colour blind” principle would have the effect of making Maori into mere nondescript citizens rather than Maori. A hundred years ago the idea of being a New Zealand citizen had appeal. So much so that some were prepared to give their lives to the defence of the empire. That is no longer the case. Citizenship in New Zealand has been devalued and degraded over the past forty years. It is no longer about a nation having a common goal and a commitment to a common good. Citizenship in neo-liberal colonialist New Zealand means “every man for himself and the devil take the hindmost”, the devil in this case being the forces of global capitalism.
    Is anyone going to trade rangatiratanga for this mess of pottage? I doubt it. Chris Trotter and ACT are on a hiding to nothing.

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