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  1. If you do a short course in epidemiology I reckon you could be our next Director General of Health.

    1. I’m sorry but this is ridiculous.

      The “experts” and the “science” don’t tell us what goal we should pursue, don’t tell us which values we should prioritise, don’t us how to balance the myriad economic and social costs of lockdown with potential health risk of Covid. Siouxsie Wiles has a “guide” to disinformation that says a red flag is information which “emphasises your personal choice and freedoms over acting for the collective good”.

      Get that straight, classical Liberal or Conservative values are literally synonymous with “disinformation” according to our “experts”. That is not epidemiology, that is straight up political advocacy.

      I am terrified by the subservience and future of our democracy.

      1. Gordon, I like the cut and thrust. I am no big fan of subservience. I would be happier to accept your argument if for not being puzzled by the inverted commas. Are you suggesting that Siouxsie Wiles actually has in her possession a “guide” to disinformation that says a red flag is information which (quote) “emphasises your personal choice and freedoms over acting for the collective good”. Can you provide that source? Is she on public record as saying that?

        In reference to the “guide” I suspect you are speaking figuratively, a metaphorical reference to the supposedly Liberal/ Conservative values she (and all other like-minded folk) represents. Must be. And the subsequent use of quotation marks without evidence is surely a rhetorical device to support your own counter narrative.

  2. 100% Ross!

    What we’re seeing is a creeping fascism all in the name of “what’s best for us”

    Ardern has suspended Parliament on the pretext that it might spread the virus but in reality, the shutting down of dissenting views is what it’s really all about.

    “Those who give up liberty for security deserve neither.” Ben Franklin

    1. Within a few days I’ve heard or read of the PM/Labour as “creeping fascism” and alternatively as creeping “Communism”. I wish the nay-sayers would make up their minds or better still, understand the definition of what they’re saying/writing.
      And one ‘week’ when Parliament doesn’t sit is “giving up liberty” or touted as a “one-party dictatorship”?
      Parliament sits for 90 days a year (or 275 3-day weeks – they should be so lucky). So they miss three days of sitting which they may make up anyway.
      Lockdown clearly gives some people who probably should know better, far too much time to overthink- falsely and hysterically!

  3. Usually you have sensible ideas however you have wandered onto the dark side with this article. The freedom argument is often used to protest against any restrictions although the only freedom being removed is the choice to increase your risk of getting sick or possibly die along with stopping the possibility of spreading the disease to other people. The other restrictions are only temporary although overseas travel is obviously a harder subject to fix. You finish with valid questions about smaller shops trading though so it has some redeeming parts.

    1. His point is freedom is rarely lost in a massive, public coup with fascist jackboots (although it can happen). It happens by boiling the frog.

      Temporary? It’s been 18 months that the right to return to NZ has been ground to nothing. Elimination will require forever snap lockdowns, surveillance, and locked borders.

      And power is addictive. Narrative control is addictive. Parliamenrary control is addictive. Jacinda Ardern has a growing taste for this (“one source of truth” and increasingly NZ is becoming a society of snoops, everyone ready to inform on each other like East Germany – for woke infractions, for possible lockdown infractions.

      A democracy requires an informed, critical citizenry. Not a fearful, overly-compliant population. The idea the Government – particularly in the face of its previous decline in polls – will just give up this power is beyond naive.

  4. If we have an economic depression and many small businesses are forced to close we shrug our shoulders and mutter “c’est la vie”. How is this situation any different? The object of lockdowns is to limit economic activity to that which is essential. Butchers’ shops and bottle stores are hardly “essential” if their functions can be handled by supermarkets.

  5. Look, these arguments seem to overlook the obvious. We need to stop people interacting with other people. Without passing between people the virus will burn out. The only way it will stay alive is to jump to another person. So lockdowns aren’t some authoritarian state powerplay, with jackbooted Jacinda consolidating power and preparing to create a political dynasty…except in Ross’s head. They’re a commonsense health response to eliminate the virus and get us back to our normal way of life. The way of life we’ve successfully been leading for a good 6 months since the Valantines outbreak. If Ross wonders why most people aren’t challenging this, I would suggest it’s because most people can see the common sense in this approach.

    As for the Chicken Little cries of economic woe from lockdown – Same thing was screamed by every rightwinger last level 4 lockdown. Turns out our economy didn’t die, it came back stronger.

    And Ross, your complaints about Dr Bloomfield using maori occasionally are just plain baffling. If you’re jumping on that bandwagon then I feel you’re just searching for things to complain about.

  6. If people are not happy with NZ Covid policy, they can go off to OZ, China, UK, Russia, Middle East or anywhere else and brave their chances.

    Funny enough Labour has never been more popular than after a lockdown last time and business didn’t do too badly either judging by our record exports.

    Rather than adding more taxes, I’d like to see the government collecting some, from all the free loaders who made NZ home and think tax paying is optional. Should help pay off our Covid debt and be popular to boot! Might even drive some free loader out, to free up a house or two.

  7. A short sharp lockdown last year worked. We were back to normal economic activity minus tourism in a few weeks. We didn’t suffer the personal, community and substantial economic costs of death. True my butchers doing it hard but I’d take my freedom not to be at significant risk of death over her profit any day of the week. Not a lot of harm in seeing how a month of level 4 lockdown goes. Also, really enjoying a break from work and getting some stuff done around the house!

  8. Tread carefully, TK – ‘God is not mocked’, even with faint praise, whoever He/She/They is.

  9. Ross
    U R on a left wing blog
    U R not left wing
    I see this post on Muriel https://breakingviewsnz.blogspot.com/2021/08/ross-meurant-chaos-on-horizon.html
    I see your post in China https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/zkrBqCvrs3I9R8BpJXCREA
    I see a post on Don Brash bible https://www.hobsonspledge.nz/ross_meurant_apartheid_in_new_zealand
    I’m sorry to be the one to tell you, but your input is largely rejected on Bomber’s blog.
    I’m baffled how you got here.
    I’m pleased to read contrary opinions – let we become an empty talking shop like preaching to the converted and what really does that achieve?
    Do stay with us – even though I disagree with you.

  10. I honestly believed most NZders are happy with the elimination approach and that is why Labour did resoundingly well last election.

    I personally support it. NSW is a good example of how a piss weak lockdown drags on forever, with more cases, more deaths.

    I appreciate that we went hard and early. Our society has been both open and safe in between the lockdowns and this is the first level four in over a year

  11. …’Wear a mask or starve? Get a QR or stay locked out? Get a vaccination or be ostracised?’…

    —————

    THIS, has made me feel uneasy. The precedent being set,…the recognition by authority’s that NZ IS a compliant nation for the most part,…that we were NOT of the same make up of the original Australian populations who came through the school of hard knocks, but of the compliant steerage class, much of which inherited the English class mentality in which to conform, to keep ones head down, to fly under the radar,…meant survival…

    I have misgivings,… yet, I think , … in a rapidly evolving situation this govt has done its best, they have done well. It is almost too fast for any govt to realistically have adapted to in one or two years. They have done well. In viewing many seminars given by leading medico’s on the subject the consensus is clear: vaccines are the way to grant the golden ‘herd immunity’ we all desperately want.

    The globe cannot continue to do just the ‘lock down’ thing. We are only a small fraction of the globe but what goes on overseas affects us as well. And I believe we are a unique case living as we do as a set of islands surrounded by the sea. It is our natural fortress. But modern speed of travel can negate this. Thus our border controls…yet it is so easily penetrated by the long incubation period of this cursed virus.

    I believe we should keep on keeping on, however,…in tandem with ongoing vaccination programs. We are doing well. So far despite our detractors.

    HOWEVER,…this business of the crude Australian blunt force method of ‘no jab, no job’,… is alarming. It smacks of overreach and overbearing dictatorial heavy handed govt edicts. In fact , it sounds much like Edward III during the Black Death who tried to pass laws to force the peasants to stay on the land and accept wages and conditions that were pre the Black Death. ( Statute of Laborers in 1351). The peasants didn’t.

    The charismatic Edward III – English Monarchshttps://www.englishmonarchs.co.uk › plantagenet_7

    Drop Dead, Feudalism: How the Black Death Led to Peasants …https://clas.ucdenver.edu › sites › files › entry_147PDF

    Or, as Ross has put it,…regards the Jews in Europe, particularly in Poland and Germany,… ”When we had to wear the yellow star to be outside, we started to worry”. Now its a hard thing to ask to have freedom of choice in this age, even if that freedom of choice leads one to become a ‘super spreader’, an asymptomatic carrier and leads to the deaths of many,…aka Mary Mallon aka ‘Typhoid Mary ‘…

    Mary Mallon – Wikipediahttps://en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Mary_Mallon

    But here we have it, the curtailment of personal liberties versus the community good and consensus….of authoritarianism and loss of personal rights as opposed to liberty and the freedom to choose. But we are not in the formulae of earlier generations hundreds of years ago who grappled with these things unanswered, – we have the technology to utilize elimination,.. and, … in time, eradication of much of the severity of this virus. In the Americanized catch phrase of this govt, we can ‘do this’. I believe we can.

    If one study’s the parabolic curve of the Spanish Influenza,…one will see,… that the H1N1 RNA of the original virus did not go away, but, after a two year period of extreme virulence ( started off in 1918 as a ‘mild’ infection in Spring reaching its deadly stage in the Autumn ,and covering time from 1918- 1920),…then became incorporated into the 1950’s , 1967-8 , 1970s, 2009 SARS swine and avian flu pandemics later… becoming less virulent and deadly,…

    I hold hope that the same will happen with covid variants. I suspect it will. HOWEVER,…delta variant, like H1N1,… IS 1000 times the viral load of Alpha covid,… in other words, it is mimicking that same influenza virus patterns of 1918,…it is far more virulent, it is far more deadly,…despite the fact that they are two completely different things…

    I believe we will get on top of it. This is not the 14th century and we have ways to deal with this shitty situation.

    In the meantime, we must keep our cool, we must still question our govts and STILL call them into account. We must never succumb to the dumbed
    down notion of ‘govt knows best’. Oftentimes they don’t. And if they didn’t know best,- , they would not admit it. Any wide sweeping new powers a govt awards itself with MUST be questioned. We must NEVER let us enable them to become a latter day dictatorial monastic Edward 111.

    To do that would be to betray all those thousands of members of our Armed Services who fought for our freedoms against fascism in so many wars. So we must cut a balance in this fast moving situation, of giving the govt some slack and wriggle room, much like the generations of World War Two,…to commandeer and utilize,…whilst ALSO maintaining an eternal vigilance against unwarranted and unsought for powers,… to quote Dwight E Eisenhower in his brilliant farewell speech…

    Eisenhower’s “Military-Industrial Complex” Speech Origins and Significance
    https://youtu.be/Gg-jvHynP9Y?t=4

    But we must also bear in mind,… that once a vaccine and ‘herd immunity’ is finally gained, – that that was and IS, – as a decision of the people in consensus,…,… and NOT of an overbearing, autocratic decision over us by our elected representatives but by the powers we invested and bestowed upon them for a FINITE limited time.

    Tread very, very carefully and wisely , Labour ,.. do not set any autocratic precedents for yours or future govts that we do not like or we WILL most definitely punish you in the polls. We are not quite that ‘meek, compliant, timid and of ‘steerage class’ and not willing to ‘rise above our stations’,… that we will not depose you or any other govts we elect.

    Take heed.

  12. Dead right Ross

    Herald today:
    In one case, a Whangārei family had joint household bubbles in order to take care of a sick child.
    But the comings and goings at the address had attracted the attention of their neighbours.
    Gray said police were pleased the public were pro-active in looking out for their communities.
    “There’s no harm in people reporting potential Covid breaches to us as we’ll look into those things.”

    Spying on neighbours
    Next it will be for payments – like the Bow Street Runners of Olde England
    and like
    Back in the USSR.

  13. Must I go to jail for saying this? Maybe. But I think going to jail for the damage to humans perpetrated by the Red Squad would be more appropriate

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