Wood right on nurse restrictions:
Immigration Minister Michael Wood rejects he has only thin evidence to suggest nurses are more likely than doctors to switch jobs after gaining residence.
Immigration Minister Michael Wood is right to require migrant nurses coming to NZ are going to actually remain as nurses once they get here!
The process has been made easier to get here, but there is a global demand for nurses and the ones we get here we want t keep as nurses!
That’s just prudent, that’s not draconian or stupid!
What is most concerning decision makers right now is the bleak future consumers and producers are predicting DESPITE wages being high and unemployment low.
It hints that the last 14 years of central banks printing money to offset a global financial collapse in 2008 has built a hollow illusion of growth that collapses in upon itself the millisecond normal financial parameters are attempted.
The ocean of debt is about to find true gravity as interest rates are forced up in a desperate attempt to stop supply side inflation dynamics, which of course will only make the situation worse.
Right now nursing and hospitality are screaming to throw open the immigration flood gates to allow offshore labour to prop up their exploitation models.
Nursing requires cheaper offshore options and hospitality is built upon exploiting overseas backpackers.
If the Government cave into these demands, the unemployment rate will suddenly explode as multiple industries fall back on cheaper labour options and they sack kiwi workers for cheaper offshore options.
In 2019, 4million tourists visited NZ as part of our exploitative hyper tourism industry – those numbers will never come back while China’s zero covid policy stands and while new Covid variants sweep around the world.
Hospitality servicing hyper tourism is dead and if we are to make real progress on more teachers, nurses and Drs, we need to offer free education in return for bonding their service post graduation.
Little blames Union:
Health Minister Andrew Little has labelled the country’s largest nurses’ union as being ‘unprincipled’ and the impediment to a pay deal.
The minister, who has so far refused to call health workforce pressures a crisis, doubled down on comments he made publicly on Wednesday in which he described the New Zealand Nurses Organisation (NZNO) as “talking with a forked tongue”.
“They are blocking nurses getting a pay rise,” Little said in an interview on Thursday morning.
New Zealand is short 4000 nurses and unions representing healthcare workers and medical societies have urged the minister to label the situation a crisis.
Ghost anti mandate nurses numbers don’t stack up:
Hundreds of unvaccinated nurses across New Zealand want to return to the workforce to help a health system in “crisis”, but the Government continues to deny them.
Nurses for Freedom New Zealand founder Deborah Cunliffe said 700 nurses and health care assistants had joined the group in the past three weeks. Most of the members were unvaccinated, some had received two doses but didn’t want a booster, and others had become ill after being vaccinated, she said.
The bulk of the group’s members were ready, willing and able to return to the workforce, she said.
Increasingly having independent opinion in a mainstream media environment which mostly echo one another has become more important than ever, so if you value having an independent voice going into this pandemic and 2020 election – please donate here.
If you can’t contribute but want to help, please always feel free to share our blogs on social media.
The key word here is exploitation and the key point here is that Mr Little is protective of this exploitative dynamic. I say, time after time after time after time – who the F do you think government is working for?
When are we going to get it, are we ever going to get it, and even more so given that I am critiquing government, will this little tizzy ever see the light of day!
It raises questions if these people are in the right employment considering they’re health professionals and dont see the benefit of taking vaccines, goes against all the ethics and training they received.
There aren’t any health benefits of the mRNA vaccines
For the majority of NZ who took them, any putative benefits have worn off by now and there is some evidence that we are in negative efficacy territory now
andy, all the more reason to get the first jab if you haven’t already and to get boosters if you have…..protection at less than 100percent is better than nom protection.
that nurses for freedumb woman in also involved in other freedumb organisations obvious astroturf job, who funds her is the question.
Andy, I had my shot and boosters, I have had Covid, it was mild and lasted all of 2 weeks. New reports suggested a higher proportion of people who werent vaccinated were ending up in hospital. Up to you which direction you wish to take, but I would rather avoid the arse kicking thanks.
If anything Little should know given his background if the nurses union are being unprincipled. The nurses I work alongside are disgusted with their union as the union has gone back to Little with a ” no” decision having not sent it back to the nurses to vote on.
I call that unprincipled and Littbeing an ex union head is quite correct.
It is the members of the nurses union, aka the nurses themselves, that voted ‘no’ to A. Little’s proposition. Are you against democratic votes for union members just because it does not fit your narrative?
No the nurses themselves were angered that they were not initially given the information to vote on. The union rejected the DHBs offer but never initially sent it back to the nurses to vote on. When the union delegates finally thought they had the best offer, then they returned to the nurses for ratification. Now they are holding out for it to be backdated to 3 years ago. Some figures suggesting back pay of $30,000. Your own narrative has got in the way of facts.
But blame Little as it adds to a great storyline.
Appreciate your input on it Bert.
Go the nurses union for trying to get an extra 30,000. It’s peanuts really and would be easily covered if Little et al hadn’t wasted so much money on health reform including millions on Earnst Young consultants
Does Little not realize how bad it looks that he as an ex union boss is dissing a union? It will be great ammunition for those who seek to abolish unions. And picking a fight with the union at a time like this
You are wrong: the final offer from A. Little, with less backpay than what was already agreed with the DHBs few months prior, was rejected by a poll to the nurses on 10/05/22.
For those who want the exact truth, please refer to this document from NZNO and not listen to the lies of Labour supporters: https://www.nzno.org.nz/Portals/0/Files/Documents/Activities/Media/2022-05-10-NZNO-Post-poll-media-FAQ.pdf
Quote from this document:
Around 40,000 nursing staff covered by the DHB Nursing claim were invited to participate in the poll that ran between April 30 and May 9, 2023 (typo).
What options were presented in the poll?
Participants were asked to choose their preferred of two options. Simply put:
Option 1 was that the Pay Equity Settlement be immediately taken to the Employment Relations Authority for a determination because it may be contrary to the Equal Pay Act.
Option 2 was that the proposed Pay Equity Settlement be put to covered employees for an online ratification ballot, even though it may be contrary to the Equal Pay Act.
What was the result of the poll?
Participants in the poll chose Option 1 by a very strong and clear majority.
NZNO followed its base by rejecting the MoH’s offer. That’s all. A. Little is a serial liar, he also lied to the GP community about the PSAAP negotiations, for example. He prefers throwing money into an useless, middle-management bureaucracy reform rather than in direct care. His track record with so much money invested is a shame.
You idiot, you confirmed everything I just said…
“However, following significant concern with the retrospective payments (back pay)
component of the proposed settlement, NZNO and PSA undertook a legal review of the Settlement.
The legal review found that this aspect of the proposed Nursing Pay Equity Settlement may be
contrary to the Equal Pay Act. Read that legal advice at:
https://www.nzno.org.nz/Portals/0/Files/Documents/Groups/Health%20Sectors/Pay%20Equity/202
2-04-14-NZNO-legal-advice.pdf
What was the problem with the retrospective payments (backpay) component
of the proposed settlement?
While most nurses were satisfied with the new base rates determined by the Pay Equity process,
they also understood that they had a contractual arrangement to receive back pay on the basis of
those base rates to 31 December 2019. This was agreed as part of the 2020 MECA which was settled
last year. 31 December 2019 which was the original date by which Pay Equity was to be settled.
Instead of full individualised back-pay the proposed settlement included a series of lump sum
payments totalling of $10,000 (pro-rata) per individual. Some nurses have calculated the difference
between this and what they would have received in the back pay promised as amounting to
significant amounts of money”
As Little quite rightly stated during a parliament setting there was NO provision in the MECCA anywhere for back payment, this was a misconception by the nurses union from previous National party negotiations.
When nurses tell me directly they were annoyed at their union representatives, I’ll take that any day, Tom Hunter I’d suggest you leave it to those in the know.
You are obviously anti Labour and Little akin to Tom Hunter aka …
I will attack anything the government does aka, Four two legs good, four legs bad.
As I said and this is to idot Tom Hunter and to use your own evidence…
“Why was the proposed Nursing Pay Equity settlement not presented to
NZNO/PSA members and other DHB nursing employees for ratification?”
“
I’ll take that any day, Tom Hunter I’d suggest
You’re arguing with “Tom Tom”, sweetie, not me.
Dear oh dear. Poor old Bertie was so unhinged by my critique of his silly Hyper partisanship earlier today that he can’t even maintain his focus on the guy he’s arguing with but sees me instead.
I don’t mind living rent-free in your head but there’s a lot of clutter and rubbish there that you really need to tidy up.
Reading your post has just added more clutter and rubbish sadly.
Your link confirms my original post, thank you, it renders your attack on me completely wrong.
Nothing in the MECCA states a provision for back pay that is a complete fallacy, why, because I have access to a copy!
I let everyone see your bad faith. I put a source, it is very clear my source backs up my affirmations, you speak about ‘misconceptions’, but an agreement is an agreement. And the MoH betrayed the nurses by not applying the previous agreement in the MECCA. Of course, nurses will not discard a previous agreement on back pay just because they had a new proposition from A. Little not including this backpay. Little tried to give with one hand what he was stealing with the other hand and got caught. He is stupid, absolutely stupid, loses his shit in all interviews he gets even with complacent MSM, he is a disgrace and has become by far one of the worst ministers of the current government, whether you like it or not.
And you miss the main point, probably on purpose with your political tribalism (I am definitely not part of this, I should be a typical Labour voter but they are disgusting me): the poll conducted by NZNO was impressively in favour of NOT signing the agreement. We don’t give a shit about your colleagues, this is not a representative sample. And if your colleagues and yourself want to create a new pro-Labour-whatever-the-moral-and-financial-cost union, then be my guest. But so far, I have not heard anything of this sort. You are in total minority, Bert. Wake up and stop the political tribalism.
Yours is just a gob full of rhetoric and in fact you are tribal. So give it a rest, you know nothing about me and are actually a bore. Nothing you have posted is consequential and to use your own words I don’t give a shit about your innuendo, there is a rock for you to crawl back under somewhere.
As for my colleagues, they are a massive representation and I hope they turn a blind eye, when you need them one day.
Shorter Bert:
I will defend anything this government does, aka, Four legs good, two legs bad
Idiot!
See the video of Little in this link, you righties we will be educated we Tommy Hunter..
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300637193/new-zealand-can-we-fix-it-not-unless-politicians-grow-up
Why can’t we train our own nurses and doctors? We are supposed to be an affluent society. And most of those trained healthcare workers who come to work here have been trained in countries who also need them and can ill afford to train them for us.
I know ours go to countries even wealthier than us so there is a general movement internationally from the countries most in need to those most in greed. We should not be part of either side of the equation. We should be training people from poorer countries to go back and look after people in their own country as well as enough to serve our own needs.
Nurses are paid at a level that reflects the fact that most choose to do the job for reasons far other than the pay. people feel they are truely helping their fellow citizens and they truly are. But it makes an incentive that offsets the need for the country to pay them anything like what they are worth to society and that is exploited to the max by those who make the rules.
D J S
It’ seems just too damned hard doesn’t it? But by any reckoning, leaving it to a ministry now steeped in generations of underfunding and running our so called health care system with negative capacity, is not the answer.
Labour simply must think outside the dead end that is our health ministry to attract people to the medical professions. And fast!
Found this link about present Covid worldwide with Dr John L Campbell, UK. He is a Nurse-Teacher
and A & E experienced. Interesting. Infections surging and more than official reporting and seems reliable. Watch and check him out I suggest.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tvzbdcTft7g
Can anyone identify the difference degrees of risk of infection and transmission to others in the age of omicron?
1. between someone unvaccinated and never infected and those vaxxed (mandatory two doses then boster at 6 months).
2. someone recovered from past infection/infections and those vaxxed.
The key matter is risk of transmission to others. If all unvaccinated staff (limited numbers) had to be temperature tested (also screens for flu infection) and then RATS tested before starting work the risk might be lower than vaxxed staff.
The problem is SPC that unvaccinated nurses care for vulnerable people. These people are not only cared for but educated on how to prevent further illness. How can an unvaccinated nurse who doesn’t believe in the science expect their patients to be vaccinated when they themselves are not.
Queeny vaccinated people are just as capable of getting and spreading the virus as unvax so whats the difference?
XstraightXedgeX. Its been proven that its the unvaccinated who get sick and die at a higher rate than the vaccinated.
Queeny, it’s clearly a pandemic the vaccinated, they’re more likely to get covid than the unvaccinated. Dumbasses would rather be treated by someone covid positive than a covid negative pure blood.
It’s a pandemic of the unvaccinated, they’re more likely to die than the vaccinated. To argue is not only dumbass but moronic…
205 Covid patients died in Hong Kong yesterday (a city of 7.5m). Only 31 of them had received two doses of vaccine. Only ONE had received the third booster shot. Worst Covid death rate in the world. What a catastrophe. March 2022
Bert, ah yes the ever shifting goal posts. Remember when they told us you won’t get covid after the jab? CCP propaganda suits you. Meanwhile in NZ you’re more likely to catch covid, be hospitalised for covid if you’re vaccinated.
But whatever, keep melting down chap.
My god Off white which strain are you talking about? No one has ever said the vaccine was as effective against Omiicron. Get a grip
Alternative facts suit you OFF Trump.
“Meanwhile in NZ you’re more likely to catch covid, be hospitalised for covid if you’re vaccinated.”
Probably because the largest population of N.Z. is vaccinated Einstein, although the hospitalisation if your vaccinated is just you having a laugh. Thank fuck your no where near medicine.
Bert, thanks for proving my point. It’s as though the jab makes no difference. Imagine my surprise.
You don’t have a point just “alternative facts” like the earth is flat, don’t believe the science.
Imagine my surprise.
Dr Off White, no I stopped laughing at Off White.
The difference is how much of an arse kicking Covid gives you.
Whether your immune system has an idea what Covid looks like before you get Covid compared to experiencing it for the first time with a full blown dose.
Science is a collection of observations. There is not a scientist alive or dead who will agree with any type of observation because it could be wrong because observations can be wrong for a number of reasons, one reason being is particals cam exist in to points at the same time or not at all. That is why science ignores observations and looks only at data.
In other words, claiming that 100% vaccination rate is the only way is like saying the that the temperature of planet earth is 100⁰. Live just don’t work like that so 90% Vax will do. Get over it.
Firstly who is Paparoa?
Secondly Who would think a former union boss would kick the nurses union.
Where is the evidence that the union doesn’t want money to go to the new nurses?
Paparoa are antfa/anarchists/lefiwing keyboard warriors
says straight, rightard in pizza stained t-shirt from his mums basement
ps it’s antifa and leftwing…not a typo nazi I make enough but 2 in a 7 word sentence gotta be pushing the record.
Are they to justify the Qanon/anarchists/rightwing keyboard warriors?
I think my typing is of an adult level.
Martyn keeps saying the Nurses and hospitality and the right, want to throw open the immigration doors. He’s possibly right but I don’t see it as having to work that way. If this situation had been thought through months ago these health workers could have been fast tracked to NZ over six months on a temporary basis. So long as these workers stayed in the health business over our winter that’s fine by me. Those who are against this temporary flexibility of the immigration protocol are cutting off their noses in spite of their faces. The world we live in requires our governments to be quick on their feet and willing to use temporary solutions. The governments long term solutions might be ok, but the short term solutions aren’t in my opinion.
Andrew Little is behaving like a National Party MP by blaming Unions for their faults
Or Nathan Little is actually correct in saying that the union bosses u-turned on what they had agreed to. I have not actually seen this refuted. As Bert has pointed out the facts are actually worth looking at. I think Little is an odd individual but that doesn’t make him wrong if that facts are what they are.
I trust the nurses more than Andrew Little…how about you Wheel?
The nurses are at loggerheads with their own union Nathan which puts trust firmly in Littles court. It would pay for you to do more research rather than a prejudiced belief.
Guess the day of reckoning has arrived for the NZ free healthcare system. Years/decades of underfunding and running it without the ability to do business as usual, (waiting lists anyone?), but then expect it to stand up the moment something slightly off script came along was never going to work. And I include the measles outbreak that occurred before covid in that.
Option 1 – Fund it properly. No more rich mans tax cuts, eh National? Pay medical staff the international going rate, because NZ is a very very expensive place to live, even by international standards, and those people can otherwise get on a plane and wave, bye bye. Fund Pharmac properly or get rid of it. And build the infrastructure we deserve rather than the constant broken she’ll be right system!
Option2 – The US system of health care, or hybrid of, and I only make that suggestion because I can’t help but think this is where Labour are taking us because their incompetence in healthcare can’t be on purpose, surely?
Whatever it is needs to be THE number one priority because the Director of Health begging citizens to wear masks to stop the full implosion of the health system is akin to the Captain of the Titanic asking his passengers to bail a bit more water out!
No wearing masks is something we can do to protect ourselves, its actually called self responsibility
What has that this do with our stuffed health system and its systemic underfunding?
Its to do with trying to stay out of hospital.
Yes X-ray and in order to do this, stop wasting money on consultants, comms, re-structures and mental health commissions.
Pay the staff and pay them well. Give the nurses this $30,000 back pay. The junket that the MPs including mallard went on would have added to the pot, as would the “job” labour created for Louisa Wall to get rid of her. Earnst Young cost millions oh and let’s see it cost $300,000 to open transmission gully. Do we know how much Matariki cost the govt? Or even the slide at parliament. Stop wasting money labour.
The money must go on paying and resourcing the health system now!
Anker I don’t disagree on backdating Nurse but it was never negotiated and that is the issue, the nurses union is at fault, no question about it.
Just as ther wasn’t with the previous government.
You are right, none of this is by accident. The neoliberal penchant for defunding health in order to privatize more and more healthcare still runs strong throughout government.
The UK are about to rout their NHS…will we do they same? Call it option 3.
I can’t say I support this.
I mean, it seems to be based on the recognition that most of the ‘nurses’ being brought in aren’t, as some seem to think, registered nurses with several years of professional training and vocational experience, but nurse orderlies who’ve completed something like a half year program in making sure elderly people don’t get bedsores. I don’t think we even have any nursing programs that rapid, enrolled nurses have significantly more training, even the most minimal aged care diplomas here involve a full year’s training.
Does this work need doing? Yes. Could we train people to look after elderly people here? Yes… and it’s not like we’d have a five year lead time before we had more nurse orderlies passing out of our own half year programs. But, of course, we’d have to pay them decent money, and give those with the aptitude to go further opportunities to do so. Is it better for our nation to train our own carers and pay them properly, or simply import new bonded slaves every two years? I would argue the former.
“Labour” truly is false advertising as the party name isn’t it.
They desperately need to rename; some suggestions:
* Bureaucrats-r-us
* a twelve word sentence in Maori describing some sort of journey or the act of clasping a paddle that no one understands and is probably offensive.
*the Trojan Party (as in horse but the condom brand works too, theyre both full of cocks)
But clearly nothing remotely to do with helping workers as “Labour” are actually doing their best to make life harder for working people while building a huge incompetent unaccountable bureaucracy of woke useless human beings.
absolutely love it keep calm and carry on! You should join one of their coms teams.
Of course you agree Anker, your own narrative supports it.
I live in a small south island tourist town. We are crying out for staff in hospitality
If we open the borders to overseas labour, no one is going to get laid off
No but your town will become a low wage economy.
Migrants dont have a benefit system to fall back on. Tourism operators like migrants because they can pay them less, any kiwi that also wants to work in the sector has to accept the pay rate to be able to compete for those jobs, this drives down what that job is worth.
Previously we had to deal with the contracts act that drove down incomes, now employers use migrants.
The problem with NZ is everything is too expensive while incomes are just rubbish which is why so many head off overseas. Employers complain about lack of staff but still wont raise pay rates to try attract people to the roles, they just import people and pay them less, get what I mean?
And Rimmer wants to bring back the 90 day trial, he’s so far backward his suit looks like its from the 1920’s
*Irony Alert!
We don’t need nurses! Who needs nurses? They just fuck about making sick people feel better while offering unconditional love to complete strangers. They’re almost as useless as our farmers. All they do is grow food both domestically and for export to bring in foreign revenue with which we then buy the things we can’t manufacture ourselves.
We have to get real here and understand that true value lies in banking, lawyering, accountanting and real estating. They’re the real hero’s. They can have my baby. I can certainly have theirs even if that might make my eyes water. It might be a poo baby but hey! If value can be added to my shit I bet they’ll find a way to do it. A nice wee spot of secret lobbying, a few lines, a couple of desperate, poverty stricken, single-parent working girls and bingo, shit’s just got real. I hope my baby will look just like *christopher luxon, the God bothering Anti Christ who will be busily surrounding himself with compliant money-fetishist minions.
Tax the millionaires and billionaires above the cut-off $70 K many of them enjoy and saturate our nurses with proper money.
Before RNZ stopped the inconvenient graphs showing ministry of health covid stats the un jabbed we’re under represented in cases and hospitalisations. But, you know, censorship is a better argument than science. Trust the government and big pharma, said no critical thinker ever.
Thanks Off white, I was about to make the same point about the inconvenient graphs
Andy, all good. Some of us are actually prepared to look at the full spectrum of info. If only they’d be prepared to discuss all sides rather than just censor.
“under represented”
Only if you have a year 7 grasp on stats.
You guys can save your wisdom until you need health care .
You can school them up then.
Scotty, so removing data is a good idea then? Per 100 000, less cases and hospitalisations in the unjabbed. Happy to be schooled professor. As yet there’s no one willing to explain the inconveniences, easier to just remove them.
OW hypothesis versus science? Hmmmm.