Journalists are in a tizzy that Grant Robertson has created some ‘wriggle’ room by lifting the amount the Government will allow itself to go into debt…
Grant Robertson blurs the line on his debt target
Depending on your political stripes, the Government has either signalled it will borrow billions more, or it has confirmed it will stick to its spending rules.
Thursday’s pre-Budget statement does not abandon its debt promises, but does signal a shift which opens the door to the Government being comfortable with considerably more borrowing.
In Opposition, at a time when the parties faced questions about whether they were responsible managers of taxpayers’ money, Labour and the Green Party committed to Budget Responsibility Rules.
…and the politicians are quick to pat themselves on the back…
…how desperate have we on the Left become when this bullshit nothing announcement is greeted with cheers.
What the Government are actually saying is that they MIGHT fund public services better in 2023.
That’s what we are all cheering is it?
FFS.
Those NZers living in cars, those NZers trapped by a dysfunctional mental health system, those NZers locked out of home ownership, the working poor and beneficiaries will be thrilled that Grant Robertson is thinking of doing something for them in 4 years time.
YAY.
This announcement isn’t a ‘first great step’, it’s actually hopping backwards!
The Daily Blog and New Zealand Public Television will screen The People’s Budget Sunday 2nd June 8pm hosted by Bryan Bruce and featuring Rod Oram, Sue Bradford, Russel Norman, Efeso Collins, Professor Jane Kelsey, Dr Lance O’Sullivan and Julia Whaipooti to debate whether or not neoliberal economics can build a wellbeing budget.
And the rich rejoice, all they have to pay on income is no more than 33 percent, one of the lowest in OECD countries.
See here:
https://stats.oecd.org/index.aspx?DataSetCode=TABLE_I7
NZ Inc remains to be firmly in the GRIP of neoliberal economic and fiscal policy, the change of government had only a chameleon effect.
Corporations rejoice. They pay next to no tax in some instances.
Some individuals also, to be honest.
Pathetic beyond belief — the self-congratulation of delaying even thinking about any real action on relieving the worst of the underclass for four years. It would never occur to them that they’re only cementing in glaring inequality in our society. I’m betting that Robertson-Ardern will rethink their very vague thoughts come 2023, which is an election year. Can you imagine such self-imagined idealists even thinking something so radical when they will be called out by their neoliberal masters at exactly the wrong point in their sterling careers?
Considering the Minister’s comments, adopting a range of between 15 percent and 25 percent opposed to the current set target of 20% does suggest that despite all the stated crisis (housing, education, health, etc) in the current economic climate (which they deem as good) the Government will most likely move to further reduce debt.
Considering how our biggest export is now profits from NZ we have to wonder why our corporate income tax rate has changed from from 48% in the 1980’s to 28% on 1 October 2010.
And no interest in revisiting that from what I can see from the tax working group and how the double taxation agreements and trade deals work with globalism.
AKA with so many countries from Australia, to China to Hong Kong, Singapore etc mean that people can be resident in and out of NZ and using our social services like health care and super, but paying their taxes elsewhere the majority of their lives.
Or pay their taxes else where, but retire in NZ and get free health care and benefits straight away, and free super after 10 years.
NZ is so generous to the world’s middle classes coming here, but less generous to it’s own poor or middle class that through various taxes such as student loans ( one of the highest interest rates in the world in the 1990’s) and GST and council rates have managed to greatly but stealthily increase taxes while pretending income taxes are very low.
Like housing many of our problems are ‘demand’ driven, like housing and social welfare and there is zero interest in stemming demand from government or even articulating what they plan to do about it, (in fact they seem to be contemplating increasing it, aka letting in aged parents from migrants get residency so they will qualify for free health care, aged care and super).
This is the new idea of how foreign corporates can solve ‘housing’ aka taxpayers pay corporations like compass (an OZ company) to have our poor in social housing with shared facilities and by the sounds of it, no access to the tenancy tribunal.
(Note no braying by renters unite, the woke or government on this type of housing rort, unlike how they blame NZ landlords who seem to provide a lot more aka stand alone housing).
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018695582/social-housing-complex-tenants-feel-bullied-by-operator
I think this is smart move given people are becoming impatient and want to see change now even though the damage was done over the last decade. I listened to Simon Wilson on RNZ yesterday and i believe he summed everything up beautifully talking about slow and incremental changes happening under the coalition. But I also believe our coalition government deserves to be awarded another term so they can carry out their agenda of positive change. Once the coalition secure another term they can be much more bolder, take some risks and invest heavily in educating NZers. The best investment we can make is in our NZ people (education) At the moment we seem to be playing it safe and its wearing thin with some who are sick of waiting and others who are just shit stirring.
Funny you say this Michelle, me thinks the same way exactly. I pray Labour will slowly come thru the malaise left behind by National party austerity cutbacks and heal the wounds infecting Aotearoa. Yes, yes we all know it’s very slow progress towards our utopia and is that even possible given the mauling of 35 yrs neo lib? Progress is being made, not fast enough but like you say, playing it safe is probably quite prudent given the severe conservatism of many a voter. Best to be making slow progress than changing into reverse gear as the Natz will surely do. Keep the hope everyone.
Same approach we have seen to climate change. Nothing surprises me at this point.
What climate change? that is what the last govt said and they also said quote ‘there is no housing crisis’ now they are singing from a different song sheet in opposition saying they will do this and that when they had 3 elected terms to do whatever they liked and they did just that and that is why we are in such a fucken mess.
I wouldn’t call it desperate i would call it a smart move however they should have left themselves room anyway they need to read the mood of the people but maybe Robertson who seems to be doing a good job is doing just that.
ps. i just joined the labour party never been a member before but im keen to rark them up
Once again it is the neo lib elephant in the room that is still running rampant.
Government always for the few not the many.
There is no Corbyn , no Sanders and sorry Mr Tamaki no god !
The middle and poverty class are trapped with no escape in sight.
Jacinda will be getting those big corporate donations now to keep things exactly where they are now that she is a serious contender at forming the government next year or sooner.
Good target date, Labour! No one will care by then. Too busy just surviving.
Note ‘healthy homes’ only comes in for state housing and community housing 2 years after private landlords, nice one (sarcasm) considering it was the mouldy state of state and community housing that apparently is why it is needed.
So keep being cold and damp in that state and community house for the next 5 years is the answer apparently (the irony seems lost on the Greens, Labour and most social commenators, just like the asset sales aspect of Kiwibuild which has taken about 4 years to click for some) … and if the Natz come in before that, you are toast, (but not toasty).
By then state and community housing will probably be so rotten that the Natz and Rogernoms can give it away to their mates and use the ‘compass’ battery hen, housing model for NZ escalating social needs, and spend the tax money on their construction and finance mates new build social housing projects for the next 5 years.
Compliance timeframes
1 July 2021 – From this date, private landlords must ensure that their rental properties comply with HHS within 90 days of any new tenancy.
1 July 2021 – All boarding houses must comply with the HHS.
1 July 2023 – All Housing New Zealand and registered Community Housing Provider houses must comply with the HHS.
1 July 2024 – All rental homes must comply with the HHS.
What else do you expect from a mob led by an airhead who imagines socialism to be a paper you sit like at Uni, then tick off on your bucket list of things to do in order to convince the more gullible voters that she has their interests at heart rather than her career?
How many can really remember the details of that Art History 101 or the Semiotics of Looney Toons 1947 to 1966 paper that they did all those years ago?
Even ignoring the madness of the rapidly declining NZ First and the blue remnants in the Green parties contribution to this half arsed publicity seeking government, one is left with a feeling of disgust that the former party leader isn’t on trial for his role in the Pike River tragedy or that the organiser for the policeperson’s union who self publicised by insisting every copper have the ‘right’ to carry a gun holds a senior position in this motley collection of chancers, charlatans and outright c..ts.
When a gang of self interested no-hopers such as this is the least worst option, it is little wonder increasing numbers of citizens have no interest in voting at all.
As I have said repeatedly before the $NZD is a fiat currency meaning it isn’t valued against anything, certainly not gold and there is absolutely nothing to stop the government from printing up sufficient of it to build houses while employing young kiwis to do it, without getting anywhere near the point where the increase in money ‘out there’ becomes an inflation problem.
This is why these cheap vote whores have their self-imposed and 100% un-neccessary “budget responsibility rules’ it provides them with an excuse to do nothing, so they imagine the Herald won’t chastise them too heavily.
Now that’s downright stupid since even in the days of the right wing monetarist Lange government the Herald and the rest of the owned by the rich media castigated the Labour Govt mercilessly. This mob don’t even have the guts to take on the tories who run tvnz by giving a vid license to Radio New Zealand – weak wankers.
Now tell us what you REALLY think! (but no truer word spoken in disgust)
The question is. If they do decide to go on a spending spree. What guarantees that they’ll spend a majority of whatever amount they’ll draw-down on and spend it on what they’ve said that they would? We’ve been here before, ay? Or will we get the,”we’ve got a mandate to do …”
Yeah, so if the government pursues inflationary policy then people should be encouraged to take on more risks and if the government pursues deflationary policy then people should be less risky in how they spend money. My thing is that people should be taught that you can make money in both inflationary and deflationary environments and that’s it’s cool to move around the country and rent as new opportunities arise. And then with a decent 15% kiwi saver above people’s wages backstopping it, life should be so hard in New Zealand.
I swear I typed it out as “shouldn’t”
Let me get this straight, they blew the whole surplus they inherited on nothing special and some Shane Jones swagger projects. Housing? Forget it. Mental Health? Yeah no. What about wages in the public service, oh not going too well either.
To celebrate this, they’ll put you further into debt to enable more mismanagement and keep subsidizing their mysterious benefactors.
You end up paying extra debt on expenditure to global financial institutions sourcing their funds from the same offshore firms holding the proceeds of tax evasion which the pro scumbag political hustlers enable, which is where the funds should have come from in the first place.
Meanwhile they perma-jack the army etc.
See the hustle? It’s the ultimate crime. Usurpation, Obtaining Public Office under False Pretences, Conversion of Funds, Embezzlement, Fraud, Conspiracy. Throw a few more charges in. How many do you want?
…serious about the perspex cells… ^_^
Well Denny if they don’t spend they will be gone simple as that
I do appreciate you didn’t use capitals…but can you please stop referring to Labour as ‘the left’. I know they are technically ‘Left’ of ‘Right’, but lets just be honest and call them and their supporters ‘Centrists’.
Because that is what they are…and its Centrists who are in fact becoming desperate and bamboozled as their ideology hits the brick wall. The last thing ‘The Left’ need is to be tarred with the same brush..we have enough problems as it is, without having our reputations being dragged through the mud by our traitorous old friends.
What else do you expect from a mob led by an airhead who imagines socialism to be a paper you sit like at Uni, then tick off on your bucket list of things to do in order to convince the more gullible voters that she has their interests at heart rather than her career? How many can really remember the details of that Art History 101 or the Semiotics of Looney Toons 1947 to 1966 paper that they did all those years ago?
Even ignoring the madness of the rapidly declining NZ First and the blue remnants in the Green parties contribution to this half arsed publicity seeking government, one is left with a feeling of disgust that the former party leader isn’t on trial for his role in the Pike River tragedy or that the organiser for the policeperson’s union who self publicised by insisting every copper have the ‘right’ to carry a gun holds a senior position in this motley collection of chancers, charlatans and outright c..ts.
When a gang of self interested no-hopers such as this is the least worst option, it is little wonder increasing numbers of citizens have no interest in voting at all.
As I have said repetedly before the $NZD is a fiat currency meaning it isn’t valued against anything, certainly not gold and there is absolutely nothing to stop the government from printing up sufficient of it to build houses while employing young kiwis to do it, without getting anywhere near the point where the increase in money ‘out there’ becomes an inflation problem.
This is why these cheap vote whores have their self-imposed and 100% un-neccessary “budget responsibility rules’ it provides them with an excuse to do nothing, so they imagine the Herald won’t chastise them to heavily.
Now that’s downright stupid since even in the days of the right wing monetarist Lange government the Herald and the rest of the owned by the rich media castigated the Labour Govt mercilessly. This mob don’t even have the guts to take on the tories who run tvnz by giving a vid license to Radio New Zealand – weak wankers.
This is actually incorrect and is nothing more than ignorance spouted as wisdom.
A country’s currency is always valued upon the products that the country can provide and there’s no such thing as too much as long as wages go up commensurate with the increase in money supply. The latter hasn’t been happening which is why we see increasing poverty.
And a Gold Standard doesn’t work because there simply isn’t enough gold available to support a growing economy which results in deflationary spiral and the collapse of the economy.
Of course, a fiat currency is required to be floating but how it floats is important as well. Our present system is determined by the subjective will of the speculators. That’s how our economy was attacked in 1987 resulting in the crash of that year.
How it should float is by trade weighting. The more we import the less value the currency should have on the forex.
That’s exactly what the government should be doing. So, why aren’t they?
The answer to that seems to be solely because if the did we’d so learn that we don’t need capitalists, that we don’t need savings and that we don’t need to charge interest. Once we realise all of that then we’d realise that we can get rid of the bludging of the capitalists.
Unfortunately, the government thinks its their job to protect that bludging.
You could attempt to engage in almost deflationary practices by withdrawing and destroying currency.
That said, electronic financial transactions are fairly easy to track. If you are on track to spend enough to cause inflation, some one way more wealthy or powerful or influencial than you will have discovered you, and will likely be taking steps to eliminate the problem.
Again, are you intentionally trying to destabilize the economy? If not, and if you aren’t going through pretty extensive means to hide your financial activity, your likely going to get found out in between a few hours and a few days, and the response is likely to be as quick.
If you are, you’d have to move really fast. Our current world is way better at tracking prices and transactions than it was before WWII.
Either you use the card so little that you barely impact inflation, or you use the card so much so fast to such a grand degree that your caught before you do much damage.
Unfortunately the first half of your post is the total tosh spouted by ninnies who imagine economics to be some sort of science when it is in fact more closely related the the skills employed by the court wizards of medieval times.
Floating curriencies are not valued against anything unless you consider rumour, gossip and inuenndo to be things of substance.
One has only to consider the state of both the kiwi and Oz dollars who have both been downward tracking in parallel with the pommie quid since the brexiters won their referendum.
There is no substantive reason for the downgrade of the Oz or the Kiwi since england hasn’t been either nation’s major trading partner for decades.
The forex markets ignore that essential who knows why, but one would strongly suspect the cause is the usual mixture of ignorance and indolence traders employ when dealing with currencies they consider lesser.
In a perfect world your response could be correct but we live in a far from perfect world where the variables bought to bear when considering the value of currencies are so unrelated to what you types call ‘the market’ that the process is more connected with superstition than rationality which makes me restate the bleeding obvious – fiat currencies are not valued against anything.
And iwi say, “That’s great news for iwi treaty settlements! Increase the quantum from a 1% payout to at least 80%!! Woo hooo!”
The NZ Labour Party is as cowardly and stupid as its UK equivalent. Please get Bill Mitchel in to set them on the right course with a proper understanding of State Finance through MMT. Fiscal Responsibility rules are an unnecessary straightjacket. It is quite shocking how little this Government has done. I am not surprised as St Jacinda of the Photoshoot is a protege of Tony Blair and of a similar outlook – minus the warmongering.
I wouldn’t count on the minus the warmongering thing at all. We need to remember that Helen Clark a PM with considerably more nous about the job than the current poseur, sent Aotearoa into Iraq and Afghanistan – sure she claimex to have put all sorts of caveats on their behaviour but that was nonsense as 1) the rest of the gang didn’t care ‘cos it’s not as if Aotearoa’s contribution could ever be a decider in terms of boots on the ground or tech, they are needed so that the emperor can say we support the empire’s criminality, and 2) when push came to shove it didn’t matter sfa as our SAS sociopaths slaughtered as many innocents per capita as any of the other butchers in the coalition of the killing did.
Agent Orange is in more sh1t than a Mangere duck this year as the corporate dems see the best way to destroy him without instituting citizen friendly policy settings, is by peering into his finances he is turning to his warmongers.
The warmongers he’s had to put in cabinet to guarantee those zionist dollars keep rolling in for next election, aren’t gonna be stopped from going to war with Iran or Venezuela maybe both.
If that happens, it will be like post 911, fence-sitters will not be permitted.
I absolutely guarantee airhead Ardern will dream up an excuse to pivot and send in killers from kiwiland. Definitely into Iran and maybe even into Venezuela or no more Vogue covers for Jacinda plus all sorts of sanctions on kiwi products.
She cannot stand up to the TVNZ board sharpies, let alone an aroused orange orangutan.
If it wasn’t for the fact a big mob of decent Iranians will be slaughtered, I would cheer for this final fling of a decayed empire, because it will reveal all the hypocritical kiwis who claim to be peaceniks as in fact rank opportunists quite prepared to trade the lives of decent hardworking Iranians, for the right to sell mass produced animal protein to a mob of rich but stupid bourgeois european & english arseholes.
I would like to note that we should be profoundly grateful that we have two parties that contest for government so fiercely when so little divides them.
Whereas in some countries such as India with Congress so profoundly superceded by the BJP/Hindu nationalists (based around a simplistic strong man veneer that makes SCoMO seem sophisticated) there is no alternative – despite clear incompetence (monetisation nonsense and the introduction if sales taxation), rising unemployment, farm poverty, glacial progress at modernisationation of infrastructure (that would make one consider the communists). And in others opposition is unwelcome and circumscribed. Here at least it is encouraged, but provided it does not get too ambitious to do good. It is allowed to keep the pivileged and complacent honest but only if it does not aspire to do that much – it will of course be told told off when it makes an effort.
Did I read all that somewhere else, or am I going mad? THe Standard maybe?
Btw, the BJP win was no surprise to me, nor the ScoMo win.
I’m desperately hoping that the same circumstances don’t mean a near miss, or a win even, for Labour in 2020.
It’s becoming increasingly evident that many in Labour (and Greens) just aren’t really getting it.
Hopefully @Michelle’s new signup might make a difference. I no longer have the energy to push shit uphill – there are better places to do it where it’d actually make a difference
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8ijmXxivbg
Its proof that the Left are buying into the RWNJs idea of how the economy works. Unfortunately, that idea is based around the concept that we need rich people and that rich people should be placed upon pedestals and made richer.
This, of course, doesn’t work and only increases poverty while decreasing the availability of necessary resources and services with the inevitable collapse of society which comes about from using an unsustainable economic system.
The solution is to bring all money creation back to the government. Debt-less government spending then becomes the sole driver of the economy rather than interest bearing debt that only rewards the private banks.
Make some of that government spending a UBI and we have a solid basis for the driver of the economy that will never fluctuate in a ‘business cycle.’
Money is pretty real to me, Drako. Money, If I need to Kill or Imprison someone money can deal with most of that. For those that it effectively can’t, well, I’ll just have to deal with that in other ways now won’t I?
If the government keeps on with their neoliberal ways to ‘solve the housing crisis’ using business to do it, then NZ will need massive amounts of debt due to the massive fees and costs it takes under neoliberalism to house social needs.
According to this article as well as the tenants having to pay an income related rent, the government also has topped up $3.3 million in extra payments to Compass social housing.
From my calculations that means approx $1666 per week per 1 bedroom unit without a kitchen, (55 units @ 3.3 million for 3 years) per week from the NZ taxpayers and the tenants don’t have access to the tenancy tribunal so they have taken away their rights …
https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/social-housing-tenants-in-south-auckland-feel-like-second-class-citizens
Good one Labour and Greens and those wokies that support this model! (sarcasm).
Does not work socially or economically! It is spreading as part of Kiwibuild but the looks of it.
This is from 2017, so not sure who is running the Tamaki social housing now
Two Australian firms shortlisted for Auckland housing project
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/201851379/two-australian-firms-shortlisted-for-auckland-housing-project
Social housing seems to equal big bills for NZ taxpayers, more social problems for tenants!
And I’m not even sure they own the housing, so is NZ really paying thousands a week per unit for poorer standards from middle man because they don’t trust housing NZ that returns a profit?
Starting to sound like Grenfell in the UK!
“In the council housing sector, these changes came together in a drive towards removing housing from local government ownership and control. Council housing was handed over to newly created quasi-private bodies, such as arms-length management organisations and tenant management organisations, or transferred en masse to housing associations. This was justified by claims that management of social housing would improve, bureaucracy would be done away with, and responsiveness to tenants would increase.”
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jun/20/grenfell-fire-housing-policy-social-housing-tenants
This ‘middle man’ model is also spreading in the ACC ‘home care’ sector where ACC pays a social provider the money to ‘administer’ the care.
Unfortunately this means that a growing proportion of care givers are untrained, don’t turn up, do poor work and when clients complain, then it is a 1 hour wait on the phone to the provider (like Compass they do not want any ‘paper trail’ like emails or txts).
It is not a very cost effective way, or encouraging thorough work practises in that sector, because often the client is bed bound and is unable to monitor the car efforts anyway.
Care workers do not have to stay the length of time they are paid for by ACC, just ‘do the job’ and leave, and quite frankly if some one is injured or infirm, then who is to know if they are doing the job at all?
From the people I know who use home care, many of the providers are not doing a good job, care workers work less hours than they are paid for, and it is hard to complain because it is set up to take 1 hour to complain and then they don’t do anything anyway!
They are also talking about cutting down the services further in that sector!
That sector would be perfect for students, part time workers like parents with kids at school or beneficiaries due to the piecemeal nature of it, but due to punitive abatements for student allowances and benefits then those workers lose too much money off their benefits and allowances because they are not able to earn very much money.
And then the sector is braying they can’t get people and need to import more low waged workers into NZ for NZ taxpayers to support and top up their wages as they work here!
Geez, the finance minister is a mental case. 2022! I remember him affirming (and having to) his Left credentials at the pub political programme on TV. We were right about him–without money being for the people doesn’t matter.
A democratist should never say ‘prudent’. Can do it like Walter Nash, but saying it curdles the core force of the movement for the people.
The biggest problem is Labour can’t be trusted not to borrow billions and piss it all up against a wall.
They are already looking to borrow billions more despite having planted fuck all trees and having built fuck all houses.
They are incompetent beyond imagination.
Better to have Labour obliterated in 2020 so the next generation can rebuild and be a decent Labour government.
Well? If you don’t like it? What’re you going to do about it?
The NBR riche listers are in control. In total control. The NBR riche listers are those who see your kids go hungry, they put the homeless in the streets, they’re fine about parents and their kids living in cars, they’re more than happy to have riche yanks come here and $-fuck us without the kissing.
What you lovely, though a wee bit far too forgiving, must come to terms with is that we, us AO/NZ’ers, don’t have a government per se. Sure, we have windbags in suits and frocks but they’re not politicians by us and for us? You can see that, right? robertson isn’t a politician. He’s a guy who likes to fiddle with money. And that fiddling, the sense of power that gives him, is merely a thrill up his diddle. That is all. He doesn’t care about you or me. Seriously? He doesn’t care. What about him being fat and shiny while I’ve seen emaciated homeless people wearing jandles on dirty feet in winter is a clue to how less of a fuck he could give as to how much of a fuck he gives?? I’ve actually seen cold, hungry kids in damp old houses and all with snotty noses in bed with mum on the electric blanket because it’s the only heat they can afford and yet there’s robertson, shining like a polished little ornament and as much use too.
So? We have no gubbimint. That, is a fact. A FACT. A fact. They, them, those who purport to be our politicians, i.e. For us, by us, are in fact liars working for a select few NBR listed rich listers who enjoy watching us struggle because it gives them the justification for them saying amongst themselves over a sumptuous dinner with wines of the regions dahlings is “ All they have to do is work hard and save hard and they too can have what we have.” a logical fallacy to cover up their deviant, criminal and soulless machinations to take that which belonged to others and sequester it for themselves.
What. Are. You. Going. To.Do.About.It? That’s now the only question that needs to be answered. Wait another four years for robertson’s hollow promises? Another ten years to have flaky adern halve the number of kids living in poverty? Is that going to have the same outcome as the CGT lie? Our politicians need a very, very rude wake up call. What are you going to do about it? What are YOU going to do about it?
What would you do?
The streets, Countryboy. When the talk-shop doesn’t allow some people’s expression, then it’s the streets. Though the law goes on for ever without providing an outlet for people without money seeking justice. And by the streets I’m afraid to say white collar strikes. Versus France.
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