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  1. A comprehensive justification. It will not be answered with such even-handed argument, I suspect.
    Indeed, the Nazis murdered roughly 6 million Jews. It should perhaps be mentioned that they murdered roughly 7 million German citizens when you count up the Communists, Socialists, Homosexuals, Handicapped (do I have to say ‘Disabled’ instead?), Gypsies, etc.. The Nazis were a nasty fanatical lot. How many Slavs did they slaughter? No records were kept of Russian POWs gunned down at Dachau, if my memory of reading the articles in a room there are correct.
    Now Israel’s risk is that in Palestine it seems to be looking more like the Nazis than the hard-done-by Jewish race it used to be in Europe during the 1940s.
    The star of David after World War 2 was seen as a symbol of a poor, oppressed people. Modern Israel risks reversing that image, and making the Star of David not so different to the Swastika.

  2. Kia ora John,
    You make reference to Israel being set up up by UN charter.
    My understanding is that the partitioning of Palestine was recommended by UN General Assemly vote. The General Assembly does not have the legal mandate to partition, this could be done only by Security Council consent. No Security Council vote was ever taken.
    This means that the self titled state of Israel is legally illegitemate.
    Correct me if I am wrong.
    Peter

    1. You are wrong. Israel was created along with the Arab states by the League of Nations, before the UN was established. The land that the Ottoman Empire controlled was carved up and Israel was one of those parts. The UN, Article 80, accepts the League of Nations resolutions and treaties etc and so Israel is as legitimate as any of the Arab nations.
      Though, you are correct that the 1947 UN partition plan was just a suggestion (UN resolutions are not international laws). The Jews accepted the partition idea and the Arabs rejected the idea of sharing any part of the land with Jews.

      1. Heather,
        I was of the understanding that the League of Nations in their arrogant carving up of the Middle East created Palestine not Israel.

        1. The League of Nations created the Mandate of Palestine, which the British controlled, comprising modern-day Jordan and Israel. The British also took control of the Mandate of Mesopotamia, which became Iraq. There was also a Mandate of Syria and a Mandate of Lebanon, which the French controlled and included parts of modern-day Turkey.
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partition_of_the_Ottoman_Empire

          The part of the Mandate of Palestine that was not given to the Royal family of the Hashemites to create Jordan was renamed Israel in 1948 when the British ended its rule and independence was declared. The Mandate of Palestine was always intended to be a home for the Jews, recognising their indigeneity. And in the early 20th C, the Jews were known as “Palestinians” (eg the Jerusalem Post was originally the Palestine Post – a Zionist publication). http://jcpa.org/article/who-are-the-palestinians/

  3. Hi John,
    I see you’re calling for an end to New Zealand Superfund investments in Israel, closure of the Israeli embassy in Wellington and a boycott of Israeli goods. These are all worthy aims that I agree with, but I think you’ve missed one.

    The previous National government opened the country’s Working Holiday scheme to Israel. At present, New Zealand is giving young Israelis the right to live and work here after they’ve finished their 2 year compulsory military service (and unchecked harassment of Palestinian citizens). This should definitely be stopped.

    1. Leaders of the NZ Trade Union movement, which Mr Minto is involved in, curse Israel for alleged crimes and call for a boycott of Israelis, yet they are happy to host Indonesian delegates without even raising the actual crimes of Indonesia against West Papua. I’m sure many union members (that pay union fees) would be shocked by the anti-Israel sentiment of the leaders and of their gross hypocrisy.

      Similarly, no one is suggesting that China shouldn’t exist because they are actually putting Uighur Muslims into concentration camps and actually occupying Tibet; or that Turkey is illegitimate because it really occupies Cyprus, for example.

      Hi David

      I could take your diatribe apart sentence by sentence, but just a few facts.

      Minto has not worked for the trade union movement for many years. But to suggest that Indonesian unionists who came over did not discuss the human rights abuses of their own country is complete nonsense. Not everything gets into the media.

      He and many others have been involved in the West Papua rights movement in Aotearoa for many years along with numerous other human rights issues, I think you will find he is aware of all of the issues you mention. Do you think he should be doing everything – Morocco’s hold over Western Sahara, the plight of the Kurds.

      Our country does not speak out on many many issues for trade reasons and I am sure you are aware of that as well. Pathetic reason as I see it.

      Palestine will be one state in my lifetime I am sure.

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