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  1. Yep, the antics of those junior army officers with elements of the SIS you refer to seem to have been conveniently forgotten. Actually it’s a shame some enterprising member of the 4th Estate or academic doesn’t delve into that a little deeper now that a few clogs have popped.
    Although they didn’t get their way, a decade or so later another method of keeping the plebs in line came along, and is still with us in the form of a religious neo-liberal cult.
    A couple of things tickled my fancy this past week if only because of the stupidity of it all – the society we’ve created for ourselves through things like the bullshittery of trickle down, greed and the self over community wellbeing- and all the mantras and spin that goes with it.

    The first was the Buchanan/Manning discussion where “Business Models” are applied to the security intelligence sphere. [ TDB links to it. ]

    And the second was Kim Hill’s interview with Mark Carney who seems to have had a partial epiphany.
    Hard to take him completely seriously but he did point out that what started out being “markets as the natural leveller” morphed into “the market is ALWAYS right (correct)”, and he does now appear to recognise the need for degrees of regulation.

    Secondly Mark Carney’s interview with Kim Hill where
    “markets as the natural leveller” morphed into “the market is ALWAYS right (correct)”
    [ Ex Bank of England Governor Mark Carney: building a human-values based economy
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/saturday/audio/2018789295/ex-bank-of-england-governor-mark-carney-building-a-human-values-based-economy ]

    Is this neoliberal approach appropriate when it comes to security intelligence, or administrative agencies “serving” a population – msd, OT, corrections, health, education, immigration, etc. AND the commissions and the various ombudsmen.
    Clearly not. Operating these institutions as though they are a “business” ensures failure.

    1. Okay so we and I mean us here at TDB have to know everything we can about these guys so we can exert control over them.

      We need to know who’s security they’re concerned about.

      The main issue here is that security and intelligence services are operating in the dark fir there own reasons in support of National Party member Job applications and for corporations such as Peter Teil and we need to know.

  2. ‘In 1973, the democratically-elected socialist government of Chile was overthrown by the Chilean armed forces, and the country’s Marxist president, Salvador Allende, gunned down in his presidential palace.’

    Never forget that the overturning of socialist governments -or even governments committed to self-determination- has always been a prime objective of the US, which has essentially been a covert fascist state since the 1870s. It was the fascistic US that instigated the downfall of the Allende government, and American warplanes rules the skies of Chile, dropping bombs on the presidential palace at will, whilst pro-fascist agitators, sponsored by the CIA disrupted daily life.

    Even now, having been badly mauled in Iraq, Afghanistan and Syria, the US still poses the greatest threat to NZ national security, far greater than any ‘lone wolf’ or so called terrorist group. The US maintains its hegemony via both military terrorism and financial terrorism.

    The good news is, the US is going down the gurgler almost as fast as bathwater. The bad news is, our political class are firmly locked into denial of reality (as with almost everything else of significance) and are totally unprepared for the conditions that will prevail fairly soon. So it will be then that we will see the true nature of the Adern government.

    1. Totally agree.
      And Chile was one of 40-50 such e.g’s in the USA history. A colonial Fascist power who’s control of media (and the narrative) has been so incredible, that 90+% of the (aligned i.e. controlled) world thinks the USA is the good guy.
      See the ‘economic hitman’ book. I IMHO saw ShonkeyJohnkey as the USA’s puppet here in NZ, following the books ‘ideas’.

  3. It was the Muldoon era that saw bombing of the Trades Hall in Wellington and the death of Ernie Abbott.
    These things have always struck me as noteworthy about that terrorist act.
    Police believe it was planted by a disgruntled unionist they have never managed to convict despite the police and Security Intelligence Services heavy surveillance of the Trade Union movement and individuals in it.
    The bomb was expertly made with a mercury switch that would detonate it when somebody moved. The person who made it used a timer to safely carry the bomb to the building and leave it where it was certain to be picked up and therefore explode. It used high quality explosive.
    So a disgruntled trade unionist with expert bomb making skills and access to high explosive( da-de-da-de-da the plot thickens inspector Plod – Yes cuntstable that definitely narrows the number of suspects).
    The day the bomb was planted the place was packed with senior union officials. Pat Kelly the father of Helen Kelly saw the suitcase bomb and the only reason he did not pick it up was he already had his hands full.
    Had the bomb exploded at that time it would have undoubtedly had more victims.

  4. Just because these shooters act alone does not mean they are alone, you do not get radicalized alone, you do not get to a point where you can actually do this, to hell with the consequences, alone
    The problem is we tolerate the shit that leads down this path, in our midst so flying under the radar is not difficult.

  5. We are looking in completely the wrong place if we want to find the next Branton Tarrant or David Gray. Right wing ideology is a complete red herring, as evidenced when Tarrant quickly dropped his crusade after he spoke to his sister. Even a cursory profiling of these people reveals startling similarities;
    -complete loners with detachment from society and most importantly family
    -average to above intelligence with the ability to focus and plan. Obsessive type personality disorder.
    -grossly lacking empathy indicating sociopathic/psychopathic personality disorder
    Interestingly David Gray had been on a similar international sojourn as Tarrant.
    Both had been ostracised and bullied at school which presumably locks in resentment to society and unleashes the existing personality disorders. Simple to identify these children at school and put a program in place to help prevent this type of tragedy.

    1. Orbital panda: “Interestingly David Gray had been on a similar international sojourn as Tarrant.”

      I vividly remember the Aramoana shootings. I was working in ChCh at the time, knew people with connections to the area. I also remember the extensive coverage, of the shootings and of Gray himself.

      There was never any mention of his having been overseas. He wasn’t a right-wing radical or a white supremacist: he was an unemployed, misanthropic loner in his early 30s, with shaky mental health and a fascination for guns and military matters.

      If you have other evidence, please post it. I’d certainly be interested to see it.

  6. As society decays and people become more entitled and individualised there will be more terrorist attacks.

    It is happening around the world. Just like NZ is encouraging more criminals to come and reside in NZ – they are also setting up the future where various groups divided by race, religion and age, hate each other and compete against each other.

    NZ should be spending our time and resources on solving and rectifying our bicultural issues, instead of importing in as many problems as they can which take up extensive resources and media time.

    Migrants in NZ are encouraged to think of themselves as entitled victims and many of the terror attacks are from the children of migrants who are privileged and individualised. It is not clear if Tarrent thought of himself as a victim, but he did feel entitled enough and be given the opportunity by the NZ authorities to carry out his terror attack that he planned for 3 years.

    Paris terror attack: Girl admits to lying after her story led to teacher being beheaded on the street
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/paris-terror-attack-girl-admits-to-lying-after-her-story-led-to-teacher-being-beheaded-on-the-street/SRJ4VFWZE3VVIEKEHEPOS5F5W4/

    Woman beheaded in Nice church – three dead in France terror attack
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/woman-beheaded-in-nice-church-three-dead-in-france-terror-attack/NE6PFD7GDWVGBJXMTCPUVZGINE/

    In OZ

    2014 Sydney hostage crisis – Man Haron Monis, a lone gunman, held hostage ten customers and eight employees of a Lindt chocolate café located at Martin Place in Sydney, Australia. The Sydney siege lead to a 16-hour standoff, during which 3 gunshots were heard from inside over a period of time. The first two shots were fired in the general direction of fleeing hostages and were left unopposed by on scene police command, however police officers from the Tactical Operations Unit stormed the café after reports the third shot was the execution of hostage Tori Johnson. Hostage Katrina Dawson was killed by a ricocheted bullet fragment in the subsequent raid. Monis was also killed. Three other hostages and a police officer were injured by police gunfire during the raid.

    10 February 2015 Fairfield Raids – police in Sydney were tipped off two Islamic jihadists preparing terror attacks, arrested after observed purchasing weapons. They had already made a martyrdom video.[

    2015 Parramatta shooting – 15 year old Farhad Khalil Mohammad Jabar, an Iraqi-Kurd, shot dead Curtis Cheng, a civilian employee of the New South Wales Police, before being shot dead by a New South Wales Police special constable during a shootout.

    2016 Minto stabbing attack – A 22-year-old man inspired by Islamic State stabbed a man before being arrested and charged with attempted murder. He also inflicted minor injuries on a nearby shop owner.

    2017 Queanbeyan stabbing attacks – On 7 April 2017, a pair of 15 and 16-year-old boys entered a service station in the small town of Queanbeyan in NSW and stabbed 29-year old Zeeshan Akbar of Pakistani descent and Zeeshan soon died at the scene. Three other men were also attacked and injured at the scene. The 16-year old’s mother had told police that she believed that her son had been radicalised in recent weeks and that he sympathised with Islamic State and had also posted concerning posts on Facebook.

    2017 Brighton siege – Yacqub Khayre shot dead a Chinese-Australian receptionist in a serviced apartment complex and took a prostitute hostage in Brighton, Victoria. Police officers were involved in gunfight with Khayre who was shot dead and three officers wounded. ISIL claimed responsibility for the attack and Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull described the incident as terrorism, however Victoria Police warned that there was no evidence to suggest he was acting on orders given from overseas. Khayre had previously been charged in relation to the Holsworthy Barracks terror plot but was acquitted in trial. He had recently been released on parole.

    9 February 2018 Momena Shoma, a Bangladeshi national, stabbed a 56-year-old man in the neck while he was asleep at his Callistemon Rise home in Mill Park, Victoria.[19] She has been charged with engaging in a terrorist act and it’s alleged she was inspired by terror group Islamic State.[20]

    2018 Melbourne stabbing attack Somali immigrant stabs 3 individuals, 1 deceased. Attacked police in Bourke Street, Melbourne CBD before being shot and killed by Victorian Police.

  7. Hmm seem to remember reading a book and watching a movie Smiths Dream/ Sleeping Dogs with a plot not to dis-similar to what Is being alluded to here.

  8. Does not bode well as NZ migrants seemingly have drug and mental health issues and inability to stay within NZ laws are encouraged to settle in NZ while any acts of aggression towards others is minimised in our courts – sounds like a time bomb for many more lone wolf attacks here!

    Tarrent understandably got the big headlines, but there seems to be a plethora of harmful behaviour towards others which is tolerated, minimised and rewarded in NZ. Is that really the type of society we want to settle in NZ?

    Seems like living in NZ and offending here, including killing others or fraudulent behaviour to allow others to kill others, is ‘a bit of a joke, best mocked during social media posts’.

    ‘Jail’ fame singer faces deportation for his role in cash for licences scam
    https://www.sbs.com.au/language/english/jail-fame-singer-faces-deportation-for-his-role-in-cash-for-licences-scam

    Family of Auckland hit and run victim Nathan Kraatskow want driver’s sentence appealed
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/109381438/family-of-auckland-hit-and-run-victim-nathan-kraatskow-want-drivers-sentence-appealed

    Man who stabbed stepfather given NZ residence because he has a mental illness
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/124405847/man-who-stabbed-stepfather-given-nz-residence-because-he-has-a-mental-illness

    Child abuser wins right to stay in New Zealand for humanitarian reasons
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/84891031/child-abuser-wins-right-to-stay-in-new-zealand-for-humanitarian-reasons

    Child abuse dad avoids deportation on humanitarian grounds to stay with family
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/76059417/

    Iain Lees-Galloway chose ‘lazy’ option granting residency to drink-driver – Simon Bridges
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/10/iain-lees-galloway-chose-lazy-option-granting-residency-to-drink-driver-simon-bridges.html

    New resident convicted of sex offending twice, won’t be deported
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11837608

    Judge’s difficult sentencing of a former refugee who won’t stop offending
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/111480343/judges-difficult-sentencing-of-a-refugee-who-wont-stop-offending

    Rapist wins case to be allowed to stay in NZ
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/327784/rapist-wins-case-to-be-allowed-to-stay-in-nz

    Drink-driver who overstayed for 19 years dodges deportation due to wife’s depression
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/300165188/drinkdriver-who-overstayed-for-19-years-dodges-deportation-due-to-wifes-depression

    Man allowed to stay in New Zealand after conning people out of thousands of dollars
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/438340/man-allowed-to-stay-in-new-zealand-after-conning-people-out-of-thousands-of-dollars

    1. A slow hand clap for your list of cases.

      Of course the list is meaningless unless you can back it up with (at very least statistical) evidence that these behaviours are more prevalent amongst the communities you seek to malign than amongst the general population.

  9. Empathy is apparently learned? If this is the case then expect many more Tarrants in NZ because the increasing lack of empathy shown by the ma and pa investors shows us NZ is an empathetic void.

  10. The other thing to acknowledge is that terrorism has become big business, devoid from justice.

    When September 11 occurred it set of a plethora of war action to Afghanistan and Iraq, apparently costing trillions of dollars to the US that probably benefited certain interests the most, aka oil industry. It seemed to increase terrorism not stop it.

    The downfall of Britain and Brexit and the inability of international law to work, was initiated when Tony Blair allowed the UK to enter that war and Labour got bogged down with identity politics for the next decades (Jeremy Corbyn is a anti semite) while Rome burned and China took over their nuclear power and arguably Russian led propoganda helped Brexit create a divided EU .

    Most of the terrorists from September 11 were from Saudi Arabia but they remained allies to the US. Saudi Arabia also managed to assassinate Jamal Khashoggi, and also seem to have gotten away with that too. https://www.dw.com/en/us-intelligence-blames-saudi-prince-for-khashoggi-murder/a-56709047

    Government’s prevention of terrorism or their ability to combat propaganda (which in many cases is coming from the politicians budgets and big business) does not seem allied to justice outcomes, but the opposite.

    1. ‘Most of the terrorists from September 11 were from Saudi Arabia’

      If you dig a little deeper you will discover that the actual ‘terrorists’ were American -Bush, Cheney, Rice, Powell, Wolfowitz, Silverstein etc., and that the Saudis were just patsies.

      Afghanistan had nothing to do with any of it, but was on ‘the list for regime change’ generated by the project ‘New American Century’ for other reasons.

      The cosy relationship between the US Saudi Arabia (arms for oil) that had existed for decades turned a bit sour when the Saudis tried to knock out the US fracking sector by flooding the market with cheap-to-extract oil.

      That said, Saudi Arabia can still do much as it pleases -beheadings, jailing of journalists, repression of women, proxy wars etc. without anyone in the West even batting an eyelid.

      Funny how oil -and inanimate substance- talks so loudly.

  11. HMMMMM, as a fly on the wall in the junior army officers’ mess, it’s likely you’d have heard one say, “Well, look chaps – what we’re discussing is bloody serious and, so, wouldn’t it be simpler to just “pop” the son of a bitch, make it look natural. and see if the problem dies with him.” And lo and behold, that’s what happened, even though, if memory serves, a lone Gordon Dryden expressed some misgivings at the time. And then, holding onto that thought, when you add in the two or three charismatic leaders and thinkers we’ve lost “prematurely” since, who, had they lived, could have made a real difference, you begin to think. yes, maybe somebody should write a book. But, before you pick up the pen, forget “Sleeping Dogs” and think “House of Cards.”

  12. I’m tired of the “lone wolf” argument. He was a lone wolf in that he acted alone.

    BUT!

    This whole approach to political terrorism is modus operandi for the far right.

    The whole royal commission was absolute horse shit in covering his movements in Europe. Some of the countries he visited are ruled by right governments who actively support far right wing groups and terrorism (looking at you Serbia) so they are not exactly going to tell a left liberal government in the south pacific jack. Many of the other states are just hopeless, and couldn’t help even if they wanted to. He visited countries with strong well organized far right terrorist groups.

    They know what works – lone wolf terrorism, they know this will drum up support in liberal countries. Did he have training whilst overseas, probably not in specifics of caring out the act. But did he get the modus operandi spelt out loud and clear.

    As for the state being in the hands of authoritarian nuts willing to crush average folks at the drop of a hat – what rock have you been living under to think otherwise.

  13. In a mature democracy, like Norway or New Zealand, it is difficult to conceive of any other kind of terrorism except Lone Wolf terrorism. In the absence of deliberate violent oppression, of the sort currently on display in Myanmar, the chances of any ideological current forging a military unit of sufficient fanaticism and operational coherence to carry out a deadly terrorist attack are vanishingly small.

  14. “Only a government with both the numbers and the will to openly challenge the capitalist system could summon forth such a movement”.

    A reaction to the capitulation to Maori grievance/ethno nationalist demands would be a more likely scenario erhaps.

  15. Some fertile ground getting sown right here.
    Thank you Mr T, a return to your best form.

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