It’s fine to pick holes in someone’s arguments and point out inconsistencies in their logic but it’s another thing to use your own cherry-picked bits of history to try to undermine a valid narrative.
Chris Trotter’s piece attacking Pere Huriwai-Seger seems to be an attempt to excuse the reality of Israel as a settler colonial state which is at the heart of the presentation.
Trotter claims it is “historical nonsense – and malicious nonsense at that” to suggest that New Zealand has “long supported the colonisation of Palestine”.
The context in which this is presented can be challenged but it is a simple fact that New Zealand has “long supported the colonisation of Palestine”.
We have always supported “Israel’s right to exist” despite Israel being a racist, apartheid state. (It is now recognised as such by every major human rights group in the world including Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch. The largest and most respected human rights group in Israel, B’Tselem describes Israel as “A regime of Jewish supremacy from the Jordan River to the Mediterranean Sea: This is apartheid” And indeed it is!)
For 75 years New Zealand has given lip-service to the Palestinian struggle for freedom but has never challenged the colonisation of Palestine by European Zionist Jews under the British League of Nations mandate. It has never held Israel to account for its 75-year military occupation of Palestine.
Israel was established in the best traditions of colonisation. Encourage immigration of your superior European colonists, build up numbers till you are numerically, politically and militarily strong enough then attack the indigenous population and drive them off the land. Indigenous people the world over have experienced this process.
For Palestinians, being driven off their land was the “Nakba” (catastrophe in Arabic) whereby from late 1947 to early 1949 heavily armed Israeli militias attacked Palestinians towns, villages and rural communities across vast swathes of southern and central Palestine and drove them at gunpoint, with numerous massacres, either west into Gaza or east into the west bank of the Jordan River. That’s why we have 2.3 million Palestinians still effectively trapped in the world’s largest open-air prison. That’s why Palestinians are the largest refugee population in the world today. These Palestinians can look out through Israel’s security fence and see their ancestral land – but Israel says they will never be allowed to return, despite this being their right under international law.
All of this is told in meticulous historical detail by Israeli historian Ilan Pappe in his critically acclaimed book “The ethnic cleansing of Palestine”.
Pappe details how Israeli spies wrote reports about every Palestinian village – noting how many people, who the leaders were, names of anyone who had supported the Arab uprising against Jewish immigration in the late 1930s. This information was provided to the militias as they went about their ethnic cleansing across Palestine. The Israeli military called it “Plan Dalet”. It was deliberate, systematic, utterly brutal and cruel (You can watch the 2022 film “Tantura” about a massacre in the small Palestinian fishing village of Tantura during the Nakba)
(Incidentally but importantly this ethnic cleansing continues today as the Israeli settler movement, with backing from the Israeli military, carries our raids and pogroms against Palestinian villages and rural communities and drives people off their land. The western world is silent – perhaps it’s because the victims have the wrong eye colour)
Arab countries attacked Israel in May 1948 because of these atrocities which were reported across the Arab world but dirty deals were done, as they are today, and the Arab leadership betrayed Palestine.
From past pieces I know Chris Trotter is sceptical that “sins were committed” during the Nakba.
I wholeheartedly recommend this book to him. We all need to be prepared to have our understandings challenged.
I was also surprised Chris Trotter did not mention the Balfour declaration or the Sykes Picot agreement – both of which preceded Britain’s League of Nations mandate.
In these two pieces of classic European imperialism Britain assured European Zionist Jews it would facilitate the establishment of a Jewish state in Palestine (no consultation with the indigenous Palestinians of course) and agreed with France how they would carve up the “old man of Europe” – the Ottoman Empire which was then on its last legs.
It was in Britain’s imperial interests to have a beachhead in the oil-rich Arab world and that beachhead would be Israel, a decision made well before the League of Nations mandate which Britain used to facilitate the expansion of its imperial power through the colonisation of Palestine.
I worry that Chris Trotter has spent too much time with the anti-Palestinian racists who dominate the so-called Free Speech Union. Free speech is absolutely critical but for many in the FSU free speech stops when someone speaks out for accountabilities for Israel. At that point false smears of anti-semitism are tossed around like confetti in efforts to stifle and suppress free speech about the Palestinian struggle for human rights.
It is entirely understandable that Arab Muslims and jews want to kill each other.
Why New Zealanders want to buy into this shit fight is baffling.
You think we should look the other way when Israel is Committing Genocide in the Israeli Concentration Camp that is Gaza. . . I disagree. My Moral Compass won’t let me.
Fine, just what you can achieve by taking sides is purely academic. It merely continues the status quo
It is, nevertheless, a fact, John, that very few colonised people had foreign armies leap to their defence, as the Egyptians, Jordanians and Syrians leapt to the defence of the Palestinians (or, more accurately, to the destruction of the Jews) in 1948. Nor were there many indigenous peoples who could count on the support of a superpower which, having armed the colonised’s neighbours to the teeth, sent them pouring across the borders to drive the colonisers into the sea.
Had the Maori such stalwart backers between 1840-1860, then I strongly suspect they would have no need of co-governance today!
Interesting line of History you are pushing. Maybe you could do some real research. Don’t let ignorance be your guide. Go here – https://lettersforpalestine.weebly.com/key-authors–books.html Try Benny Morris, a Jewish Historian, who documented the Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine. Note that more than 200,000 Palestinians had been driven from their homes and Lands Before the surrounding countries stepped in. What could you lose by research? Your “Blinkers”?
The responses seem to be “liar” or “we knew that 3 days ago.” We are all truly fucked.
With yet another example of strangled hyperbole and obscure references masquerading as informed comment, Chris Trotter has come a long way from leading the singing of “The Red Flag” at the launch of Jim Anderton’s New Labour Party. That he is now intoning “Land of hope and Glory” and “Jerusalem” is not only extraordinary but even more so since his chorus includes the ever-dreadful Gaby.
Far out. Best cartoon ever. Sez it all in a nutshell.
Too bad you can’t do one of Putin playing naive Western Liberals like a violin.
A real genocide is going on in Gaza. Meanwhile high powered team of highly paid lawyers hired by the Russian Federation, spent over 8 hours arguing before the UN Court of Justice that their client, the Russian Federation, shouldn’t have to produce any evidence to back up Russian Federation claims that Ukraine had been committing genocide against ethnic Russians or Russian speakers.
Ukraine takes itself to court
https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2023/10/08/guest-blog-patrick-odea-ukraine-takes-itself-to-court/
The allegation made by the Russian Federation that Ukraine had been committing genocide in the Dombas, was the excuse given for invading Ukraine. The real reason that Russia invaded Ukraine is that the Russian Federation is a murderous imperialist state. As nasty and vicious as the US the UK or France.
The same tactics used by the Zionists against Gaza City, the Russian Federation used against the Ukrainian city of Mariupol. The same accusations of being the new Nazis leveled at Hamas in the UN by Israel’s Foreign Minister Eli Cohen, echo the same accusations made against Ukraine by the Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov.
The same lies, the same mass murder,the same brutality, made all the easier for the Zionists in Gaza by the Western apologists for the very same atrocities tactics in Ukraine.
Yes of course, there are a minority of extremists in Gaza, just as there are in Ukraine. But this no excuse for the atrocities committed by the Zionists and the Russian imperialists. And as the UN Secretary General remarked of Gaza the existence and activities of these extremists doesn’t exist in a vacuum. But follows a long history of Zionist colonial repression. Just as the existence of neo-nazis in Ukraine doesn’t exist in a vacuum. But follows a long history of Russian colonialism and repression.
https://www.currentaffairs.org/2023/07/if-you-support-ukrainian-resistance-to-occupation-you-must-also-support-palestinian-resistance-to-occupation?
“….If the seizure and occupation of territory is wrong when Russia does it, it is wrong when Israel does it. Why does the U.S. support the resistance in one case and the occupiers in the other?”
Nathan J. Robinson
Activist Thunberg protests against Ukraine invasion outside Russian embassy in Stockholm
Reuters
February 26, 2022 5:57 AM GMT
‘Whoever identifies with Greta in any way in the future, in my view, is a terror supporter.’ Arye Sharuz Shalicar, spokesman for the Israeli army
https://www.politico.eu/article/greta-thunberg-calls-global-pro-palestinian-strike-gaza-genocide-israel-slam/
…..Thunberg said “the world needs to speak up and call for an immediate ceasefire, justice and freedom for Palestinians and all civilians affected,” as the Israel-Hamas war escalates and threatens to become a regional conflict.
Thunberg also shared on her Instagram account a post by a German-based pro-Palestinian account which says a “genocide” is happening in Gaza.
What you fail to understand Malcolm, is that the colonisation of the climate, and the colonisation of Palestine, and the colonisation of Ukraine, all come from the same place, a global economic system where expansion and takeover is not a choice but an economic imperative.
And please Malcolm don’t you dare claim, that the Russian Federation is not a kleptocratic expansionist state ruled in the interest of a corrupt billionaire oligarch class, as predatory and murderous as any other capitalist imperialist state. When you know in your gut that it is.
So stop making excuses for them.
Malcolm you are on the wrong side of history over Ukraine. Your support for Russian imperialism is damaging the cause of the Palestinian people. By spitting on the resistance of the Ukrainian people to Russian imperialist aggression, you are spitting on all indigenous people fighting for self determination and freedom from colonialist and imperialist oppression.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PgmKygmkqSA
It’s hard to criticise the Israeli military without being labelled antisemitic .My wifes Grand father who was Jewish was betrayed to the Gestapo and sent to Auschwitz death camp.My late mother in law had to walk with a limp all her life because she had to do slave labour as she was half Jewish .My wife and I are appalled at at the indiscriminate bombing of civilian targets in Gaza .My wife works with traumatized refugee children in Munich and has seen what conflict dose to children .I am a tour guide in Munich NZ citizen and take people too where the 1938 peace agreement was signed by Hitler Mussolini the British and French Prime ministers to divide Czechoslovakia with out inviting Czechoslovakia to the conference which had such a bad impact on my late mother in law’s family who lived in Prague .I draw parallels to 1948 when the British decided to.devide Palestine and create Israel with out considering the negative impact on Palestinians that would lead to conflict dehumanisation from then to .the present.Of course that dose not excuse what Hamas did on October 8 to Israeli civilians including children .But its dose not justify bombing innocent civilians in Gaza .I have.been writing to the NZ Primeminister elect and outgoing Primeminister and smaller parties to call for a cease fire .Peter Marra NZ citizen Master of International Development Munich Germany
Peter I hope that as a tour guide your knowledge of European history exceeds your knowledge of the Middle East. Your “parallels” are more than a little askew. You might note the the United Nations voted to partition the region then known as Palestine in 1947 and both Palestinians Jews and Palestinian Arabs stood to gain statehood as a result. The Jews accepted their portion, voted to call their land Israel and have developed a prosperous and progressive society, one which takes in many of the persecuted Christian, women, gay and trans people from Gaza and the West Bank. The Arab Palestinians however, rejected their partitioned share, joined with surrounding Arab countries to annihilate the fledgling Israel and have conducted war, intifada and terror attacks on Israel ever since. Moreover, despite being the recipient of billions of dollars from western charitable aid, criminal activity and Iran’s pay for slay policy, under the treacherous al-Husseini, Arafat, Hamas and the useful idiot Abbas they have whinged and whined non-stop to the international community.
Maybe you need also write to the NZ Prime Minister elect and outgoing Prime Minister and smaller parties and urge them to condemn the Hamas tactic of using their population as human shields.
Ann E. (Master of History. NZ citizen currently residing in Frankfurt.)
Great last para –
Free speech is absolutely critical but for many in the FSU free speech stops when someone speaks out for accountabilities for Israel. At that point false smears of anti-semitism are tossed around like confetti in efforts to stifle and suppress free speech about the Palestinian struggle for human rights.
as we all know if you fly a Palestinian flag you support Hamas according to David Cumin.
I’ve never really understood why a portion of Germany wasn’t carved off for European Jews to live in, after all the Brits. did look at Uganda and Argentina and other places for the Jews to live in. But given that the Germans caused the appalling atrocities – the holocaust – shouldn’t they have to pay and not the Palestinians!
Check your history. The land that is Israel was Jewish before the Romans then Ottoman Empire overran it .This is why it was handed BACK to the Jews after WW2. The Palestinians are the colonisers.
https://jcpa.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/TimeLine.pdf
Check your history. The land that is Israel was Jewish before the Romans then Ottoman Empire overran it .This is why it was handed BACK to the Jews after WW2. The Palestinians are the colonisers.
https://jcpa.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/TimeLine.pdf
Chris Trotter has lost all credibility in trying to defend the indefensible – particularly because his ‘arguments’ have no basis in fact. Perhaps the old adage needs extending:
“Anyone who is not a socialist at age 20 has no heart. Anyone who is still a socialist at age 40 has no head.”
“Anyone who is not fighting fascism at any age has no heart, head OR soul.”
I guess it hard for coloniser to admit others are coloniser to.
Yes, CT is a Māori basher I have read some of his stuff and he speaks like a true coloniser let’s see if our newly elected PM the 8-million-dollar man (how much they paid to help him get elected) has any balls to stand up to this sort of rhetoric.
Agree ..
Wouldn’t surprise me if that tosser runs as an ACT candidate next election.
The genocide will not be televised
The 300 thousand strong Israeli military force massed on the border will not be entering Gaza, at least not until the aerial and artillery destruction of Gaza City and the extermination and expulsion of all the inhabitants of North Gaza is completed.
What to look for:
The US advising their ally Israel not to invade Gaza, (just yet). And Israel complying.
This move will be spun by the US and Israel as a humanitarian measure.
In fact it will be to allow the artillery and aerial bombardment of Gaza to reach a new crescendo of barbarity and mass murder.
This genocide will be not be broadcast by the media. If it is reported at all, the true enormity will be glossed over. And our media hacks will close ranks to sing the praises of IDF as the most humane army in history.
https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2023/10/23/world/politics/us-israel-delay-gaza-invasion/
……the advice to Israelis to hold off on the land war was being conveyed through Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin because the Pentagon is helping advise Israel on military actions, including the ground invasion…..
…..A diplomat from the Israeli Embassy in Washington denied that the U.S. government was advising Israelis to delay the ground invasion and said: “We have a close dialogue and consultations with the U.S. administration. The U.S. is not pressing Israel in regards to the ground operation.”
“The 300 thousand strong Israeli military force massed on the border will not be entering Gaza, at least not until the aerial and artillery destruction of Gaza City and the extermination and expulsion of all the inhabitants of North Gaza is completed.”
Just as I grimly predicted. The IDF has confirmed that they will not be entering Gaza until they have killed everyone they can with air strikes and artillery.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/middle-east/300996222/why-israels-ground-invasion-hasnt-happened–yet?cx_testId=3&cx_testVariant=cx_1&cx_artPos=2#cxrecs_s
There is a genocide going on and we just sit and watch.
In the 1940’s the Holocaust was conducted in secret, it wasn’t until after the liberation that the full horror was revealed to the world.
Today due to the internet and social media, we have a ringside seat.
Not just our leaders. None of us can say, ‘we didn’t know’.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/oct/24/israel-gaza-world-leaders-un-genocide-palestinians
I remain puzzled as to why Chris Trotter writes for this blog site. He has been anti Maori for years and years and years and year.
In the interests of free speech I put up this link which places Israelis in a better light than we usually see. The method seems to make it all clear but I doubt it tells the whole story so if there is something left out or a compromised statement I suggest that the time on the link is referred to and the differing and truer case is stated. Just saying that it is not correct won’t do to illuminate the darkness surrounding this situation.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7ByJb7QQ9U
It seems that in many controversial subjects such as this, people turn on others with different views and dispute their right to comment. their views, make critical statements about them. Their whole output may be an emotional diatribe about it.
Wars and regular fighting causing death and serious damage are sensitive matters and can’t be healed or solved, but can sometimes be understood. Also understood should be the amazingly bad things we all can do that is shocking to acknowledge. It doesn’t behove commenters to set up as puritanical actors or witch-hunters. Some objectivity is necessary to see the background to both sides in this supercharged matter. Jews have had whole families killed, factory style and that’s a schism in those people’s lives, and a lasting pain and anger to all connections, and to all who expect better standards in all humanity. However it seems there exists in all people a talent for self-deception and deviousness which needs to be faced with humility by each person, before a judgment can be passed with honesty and sadness.
Only a person who has passed through the gate of humility can ascend to the heights of the spirit. – Rudolf Steiner
“We are all flawed and creatures of our times. Is it fair to judge us by the unknown standards of the future?”
― Carl Sagan, The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark
“The 300 thousand strong Israeli military force massed on the border will not be entering Gaza, at least not until the aerial and artillery destruction of Gaza City and the extermination and expulsion of all the inhabitants of North Gaza is completed.”
Just as I grimly predicted. The IDF has confirmed that they will not be entering Gaza until they have killed everyone they can with air strikes and artillery.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/middle-east/300996222/why-israels-ground-invasion-hasnt-happened–yet?cx_testId=3&cx_testVariant=cx_1&cx_artPos=2#cxrecs_s
There is a genocide going on and we just sit and watch.
In the 1940’s the Holocaust was conducted in secret, it wasn’t until after the liberation that the full horror was revealed to the world.
Today due to the internet and social media, we have a ringside seat.
Not just our leaders. None of us can say, ‘we didn’t know’.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/oct/24/israel-gaza-world-leaders-un-genocide-palestinians
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