And it begins, exactly as I warned it would…
A High Court judge has ordered the parents of a baby boy who needs life-saving heart surgery to stop blocking doctors from carrying out the operation.
Tonight Justice Ian Gault made an emergency order after the baby’s parents allegedly told the doctors trying to prepare the baby for surgery tomorrow morning; “You touch our child and we will press criminal charges against you”.
The judge said Te Toka Tumai-Auckland Health sought an urgent court order clarifying “that the police are entitled to use reasonable force to remove Baby W from the parents and/or remove the parents in order to facilitate the steps necessary prior to Baby W’s surgery, including taking him to surgery when it occurs”.
…this is what I warned against!
The antivaxx movement have been desperate to find a cause since the restrictions came off, they tried to bond with Groundswell to keep the activism alive and are trying to find a new cause to rally around.
This issue framed as the nightmare scenario of Cindy’s Nazis injecting medical experiments into babies against the parents consent will go down as well as an Incel slam poet at a feminist folk song festival.
Within the antivaxx, Qanon, Sovereign Sherif, white supremacy fraternity, this issue will be the existential threat of evil they’ve convinced themselves Jacinda represents.
Fear grifter Liz Gun is right beside these parents and will be live streaming everything.
Especially the uplift.
I don’t think we are appreciating how much this has the potential to erupt into violent radicalisation.
The speed with which this has seen trial and immediate legal rights passed to uplift the sick baby will surprise and infuriate these antivaxx communities in a way that could easily spill over into political violence.
The nightmare scenario of a live streamed uplift as the Police literally drag an infant out of its parents arms and all the emotional turmoil that radicalises with has enormous risk attached to it, especially as these parents have now appeared on violent conspiracy channel, Infowars.
I know we shouldn’t be pandering to these lunatics wishes, and yes it opens the door for more of these fruitcakes pulling these stunts, but if we accommodated these parents, we could avoid the propaganda coup we are be handing the dangerous fringes at a time when their movement has lost momentum and purpose.
If you can’t see the danger of Liz Gunn live-streaming an emotionally volatile infant uplift from screaming parents arms because we shouldn’t budge on giving them what they want with unvaccinated blood, then perhaps its you who has become inflexible on this issue.
Give these parents what they want with the unvaccinated blood, get that baby the operation it urgently needs and avoid a propaganda coup for the fringe feral right that has the possibility of exploding into political violence.
If that live streamed footage of the baby being ripped from their parents arms happens, all bets are off at how crazy this suddenly becomes.
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A classic slippery slope scenario, but this is no academic exercise–it is life or death for a defenceless child who could possibly live a reasonable life with the required medical intervention. Or be dead very soon.
If these parents however well meaning, in their deluded way outside of the scientific consensus, were permitted to thwart the blood donor, collection and testing system hospitals could soon descend into chaos. Some would want blood only from “x” ethnic or religious group or other donor. Blood and platelets are supplied on type after safety checks which do not involve magical thinking.
I see no evidence of this. The main concern of the parents seems to be about the experimental Pfizer mRNA vaccine.
There are plenty of people in NZ who didn’t take the Pfizer jab but have otherwise been vaccinated- I, for one, wasn’t going to use a product produced by a company run by the likes of Albert Bourla, an evil man who has endorsed the genocide of the Palestinian people, but I have no problem taking the normal vaccines produced by companies that don’t support genocide.
“I see no evidence of this.”
It appears that that is not normally an impediment to you reaching your conclusions.
Blood is blood. To allow this demand for so-called unvaccinated blood would undermine the while scientific basis of our covid response. There is a huge principle at stake here and the health system knows it must win this test case or face chaos. Only around 4.1 million first jabs have been given so there are a staggering 1 million ” pure bloods” out there. This is a fight neither the health service or the government want.
Totally disagree with you Martyn. At some point society must say ‘no’ to misinformed extremism in any form; at what point would you be prepared to say ‘enough, stop this nonsense’.
If you accept rubbish as evidence you will get a lot more of it in the future.
Peter you sound like someone with a sensible outlook on this mess .
I wonder why Sue Grey has had a complaint before the mediation board for 18 month with nothing done . Her insane message gets heard because of her trusted position. She is also vocal about 5 G and it’s effect on people .
Thanks Trevor. I sense that this whole thing has been choreographed by Gunn & Grey for their political agenda. The uplift video proves to me that the parents’ ‘support person’ is part of the ‘production team’. Attempts by the medical staff to assist obviously of no interest to the parents. That a baby’s health has been put at risk for a political agenda is obscene. There are many risks in medical procedures such as this; side effects from blood transfussion a minute part of them. We have a blood service the envy of many developed countries, that Gunn & Grey seek to undermine confidence in that service for their own political purposes should also be of concern.
Thanks Trevor. I sense that this whole thing has been choreographed by Gunn & Grey for their political agenda. The uplift video proves to me that the parents’ ‘support person’ is part of the ‘production team’. Attempts by the medical staff to assist obviously of no interest to the parents. That a baby’s health has been put at risk for a political agenda is obscene. There are many risks in medical procedures such as this; side effects from blood transfussion a minute one. We have a blood service the envy of many developed countries, that Gunn & Grey seek to undermine confidence in that service for their own political purposes should also be of concern.
The fact that they went to Alex ‘wanker’ Jones says all you need to know about these idiots. The man who said Sandy Hook was made up to make money. What a caring understanding nurturing type he is.
I feel for the medical staff having to put up with all of this. The added pressure on the surgeons is at a stage that they would be jusified in saying ‘I can’t do it’ – the parents and their cheerleaders will look for any complication to initiate further legal proceedings.
This sort of demand is unreasonable for the public health system. I think the parents lack an appreciation of the damage a precedent like this could do to the provision of care to others. If a person wants an elective or novel healthcare outside the scope of the public system I would suggest pay and go private. Set up a give a little page and they would have ample money from all those supporters around the world. The parents would receive millions of dollars. It does appear the baby is being used for grandstanding purposes.
I understood the timescale didn’t now allow time for sufficient direct donation blood products to be collected, and that 3/5 donors were ineligible for related reasons. Even if thats for a bunch of contingency scenarios NZ Blood Service can’t make a commitment to only use donor blood. This would undermine Martins suggested resolution, if its not possible.
Totally agree the court decision was wrong. The hospital administrators should have just informed the parents this is the procedure we can carry out to save your child. If that treatment is not acceptable please take your baby home.
Callous?
No, because we have a great grand daughter at the same age with a condition called fluid on the brain. She desperately needs urgent surgery to prevent brain damage due to fluid pressure and long term survival with a stunt placed in her head to relieve long term fluid buildup.
Yet Starship keep delaying the procedure for they don’t have a bed available.
The parents and supporters of the boy are holding not just the hospital to ransom but every child that needs urgent surgery RIGHT NOW.
A four day stay in hospital has now dragged out to three weeks meaning many desperate parents cannot get the procedures their kids require.
Selfish, selfish parents. Pity the court intervened (and never took into account the waiting list for other kids) for the simple answer should have been; This is the procedure. If not suitable, take you boy home and free up resources for those that need it most.
Gerrit, Although I agree with your sentiments regarding how the medical team could have responded “…If that treatment is not acceptable please take your baby home…” your sentiment does not make a logically valid argument to support the contention that the Court’s decision was wrong.
Sorry, should have said the matter should never have gone to court. Health NZ is between a rock and a hard place but the court action was not warranted. So yes the court had to decide once the matter was placed before it, but it should never have had to. The court decision was wrong by opening up an avenue for any person to hold up medical procedures (and extend waiting lists) until they get the right “blood” or “procedure”.
Health NZ should have backed the medical and hospital administrative staff and sent the boy home.
Gerrit, my thoughts are with you and the situation with your great granddaughter; also with the medical staff who have had to put up with this nonsense for 3 weeks.
I can only see the parents and protestors as ultra selfish. Many patients are sent home to die as no treatment is available; but in this case treatment is available, and has been for 3 weeks.
If these simpletons want bespoke surgery for themselves or their kin that doesn’t involve the horrors of using vaccinated blood for transfusions, there’s an easy solution. It’s called private medical care. They can pay for it themselves, or through donations from like-minded, flag waving compatriots.
The only real way to sort this out for this is if you want to get blood not issued by the blood service then you apply to a medical tribunal or ombudsman for dispensation to be decided on a case by case basis.
They ought to have set this up immediately to review this situation (and allowed the nut cases to have the current ruling quietly overturned.) Then you tighten the grounds for dispensation going forward. No one is served by the child dying, or Govt./ justice/ medical authorities trust compromised by pulling a child away from its parents.
Sorry Martyn, but appeasement with the far right never works.
It just emboldens them.
I doubt most pro-vaxxers are on board with this sort of blatant government overreach. This stunt was done just to prove a point (and it’s a pretty tenuous one imo), when accommodating their wishes was obviously the path of least resistance and would not have caused any additional harm to the baby. This government will continue to self-immolate. All the opposition has to do is sit back and watch it burn to the ground.
Someone start a give a little fundraising page so they can go private and have any type of blood they want – including non-lizard people blood.
Private hospital is the solution here.
I demand non-smoker blood, because, you know, cancer and stuff.
This is like the Mormon blood transfusion shit all over again. Kick the feral parents out and operate.
Too late.
If Sue Grey is acting for them then we know it’s fucked up. It’s already too late to stop this being a cause celeb for the lunatic fringe. There is no such thing as vaccinated or unvaccinated blood. They need to be ridiculed and shot down not appeased.
Can we give the parents what they wish, freedom to make choice? We as the state offer good medical procedure and they turn it down. We are already overstretched medically and can’t help many needy children in a timely fashion. The antivaxxers turned down good procedure, this is similar.
The government can’t do anything right here. Getting blood from other people who haven’t been vaccinated may mean that the child receives ‘bad’ blood containing nasties, and that the operation is more problematic than already, an unnecessary added risk. If it is not successful the government and medical profession will be in the wrong rather than the extra complexities enforced by the parents.
Why should the state be so insistent on stepping in and taking over? The government doesn’t actually care too much as the revelations about Lake Alice have revealed. Also now unwillingness to have a decent objective watchdog in a Childrens Commissioner with the right background and values. Forcing medication on this child is just the authoritarian state with no real values, just prating, wanting to make the citizens comply when their own wishes are for something different.
It’s time to step back and stop this baby snatching which shows that the citizen parents are despised. Don’t do it government, and the law, you harm people’s rights while you meddle with people’s lives in the staunch way you adopt. Let the parents take responsibility in withholding the baby from the proper medical procedures. It is their right.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/480419/blood-donor-case-baby-s-surgery-takes-place-at-starship
All those adult people out there needing surgery with many years of life left before them and needing to work at their job to keep themselves or their family. And you need an operation to help you out of your tribulations. you have been gazumped by another – the state doesn’t rate your needs top priority. Who cares about you? Who will inveigle themselves for you into the heart of a computing politician or Top Manager assessing polls and power.
Martyn, not as simple as finding same blood type un vaxxed person for blood donations. You and Gunn and other lunatics aren’t giving us the sciences behi9nd this. How about getting a blood transfusion expert in to write an article on the sciences. DONT GIVE IN TO LUNATICS GRAY & GUNN.
Give the parents “their” rights. The poor child dies (or otherwise) Either way their cause is doomed as the qanon crazies scatter like the cockroaches they are. For those here calling for courts to intervene. It is exactly what the cockroaches want to keep them relevant.
Aimee Milne makes valid points: https://www.newsroom.co.nz/my-blood-is-your-blood
In my view, if you use a free service, be thankful. If you don’t like the service or blood the free service provide, it is your choice to go to a private service provider. I am sure Southern Cross would be happy to accommodate their requests.
Sorry by law no blood can be donored except through the nz blood service.
https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/300761425/rival-blood-bank-set-up-in-wake-of-baby-donor-case-would-be-breaking-law?
Sick of you peddlers misinformation peddlers trying to palm off these anti-vax conspiracy freaks to the right and dropping in buzzwords about white supremacy.
I went back and watched news clips of the protests at parliament and tinorangatiratanga flags outnumbered Trump flags 6:1. There was a massive contingent of Māori and pacific island people there, and that’s been the case for every protest this year including Groundswell.
Stop the misinformation campaign.
Sorry by law no blood can be donored except through the nz blood service.
https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/health/300761425/rival-blood-bank-set-up-in-wake-of-baby-donor-case-would-be-breaking-law?
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