‘The Crown is sovereign’, Prime Minister Christopher Luxon says
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has told Parliament he believes Māori ceded sovereignty to the Crown.
During Question Time, Green Co-Leader Chloe Swarbrick pushed him on the issue multiple times, asking “does the prime minister believe that Māori ceded sovereignty?”
Luxon responded saying “our position is the Crown is sovereign.”
Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters interjected, citing prominent former Māori MP Sir Apirana Ngata from 1922.
“Is it a fact that, 102 years ago in a major thesis, Sir Apirana Ngata set out the very circumstances of the Treaty, and he said that Māori ceded sovereignty.”
“As I said, our position is the Crown is sovereign,” repeated Luxon, “and also importantly the Treaty of Waitangi has protections in there for both Crown and Māori interests.”
Swarbrick repeated her question, “are we to take from that answer that the prime minister believes that Māori ceded sovereignty?”
Luxon then replied saying he did not know how he could be clearer in answer to the first question.
Swarbrick then asked Luxon directly when Māori ceded sovereignty.
Luxon responded saying the Treaty of Waitangi was the founding document of New Zealand and it had protection for both Māori and Crown interests.
“But as I said to you, the position is very clear, the Crown, Māori ceded sovereignty to the Crown.”
Swarbrick also referenced Waitangi Tribunal finding from 10 years ago that “the rangatira who signed Te Tiriti o Waitangi in February 1840 did not cede their sovereignty to Britain”.
Luxon is a NZ History denier.
Māori never needed sovereignty, the Crown took it.
The idea as Hobson’s Pledge pretends, that Hobson said ‘we are one people’ at the signing and that somehow means something is total bullshit.
Luxon, Brash and ACT are pushing a white settler redneck cracker version of our history.
The majority of Māori signed the Māori version which is different from the English version and we are signed up to UN declarations that state the Treaty signed in the indigenous language takes precedence.
The idea that 100 000 Māori were agreeing to sign over sovereignty to a mere 2000 settlers beggars belief.
Yes, every settlement signed states the Crown has sovereignty but the fact remains there are still many who haven’t.
That’s why the Treaty Principles were so important. It was an acknowledgement that Māori hadn’t ceded sovereignty and an attempt to build a structure of mutual obligation for the Crown and Māori to work together, that’s why the intellectual strength of a Principles Referendum is such bullshit.
We are a nation of redneck cracker settlers who refuse point blank to understand their own history because they are terrified what that makes them consider in the present.
We should be a better people than this, sadly we allow our ignorance to manipulate us.
So what are the principles of the treaty of waitangi?
Bit late to the party HF google it might help?
But the Google response will have been written by progressives in academia, and activists throughout government.
Henry Filth – I too, would like to know this…as would many people.
Many Maori have rejected the Principles due to their ancestors signing the Treaty, not the Principles.
Henry, the 5 principles are
Tino Rangatiratanga.
Patuitanga.
Mana Taurite.
Whakamarumarutia.
Kowhiringa.
There are no principles. The Treaty is written. Thats it
Michael Scott – Thank you
Peter – thank you and yet it is still lost on some.
Read TRICK OR TREATY BY SIR DOUGLAS GRAHAM .THE FORMER NATIONAL PARTY MP .In it at the back is the treaty for dummies .
Winston citing ‘Apirana Ngata” is very problematic one! Apirana Ngata was a politician not a historian and Ngata had supported policies against Maori like promoting fighting in both world wars and support for the “Tohunga Suppression Act” specifically targeting the prophet “Rua Kenana” who was pardon 2019 and had his mana and prestige restored. The historian who were resourced for telling our country history was James Cowan a NZ born pakeha who spoke Maori fluently and interviewed some of the soldiers from both sides of the NZ wars. James Cowan made contentious claims when depicting NZ history for example “Tainui were responsible for being invaded” when evidence dug up by more modern competent historians found that to be highly unlikely.
Luxon-co are just mimicking nostalgic sentiments from the past devoid of facts and evidence and cracker jack settlers just lap it up because it gives them comfort in their ignorance
https://www.parliament.nz/en/pb/bills-and-laws/bills-digests/document/52PLLaw26011/rua-k%C4%93nana-pardon-bill-2019-bills-digest-2601
https://newsroom.co.nz/2022/02/02/waitangi-week-the-pakeha-wars/
Your criticism of A.T. Ngata is some what harsh.
Ngata was a great man and did wonderful work for Maoridom in an era where Maori political representation was almost non existent in a country which had been conquered and subjugated and for a people who were now on the brink of extinction and in o position to bargain. Ngata had to simply survive in a White Government hell bent on turning this country into a New Britain in all ways physically politically socially culturally where things Maori were expected to disappear sooner rather than later. Ngata had to play obedient native while at the same time preserving as much Maoritanga as possible for a people in dire straits after all the horriic effects of the many invasions. Going along with the power brokers when you are in a powerless position requires “pragmatism” while you wait for better days. Like right now we survive the next 6 years of these vindictive right wing gangsters until the left wing win again in 2029. As Ngata did 100 years ago we do the same today. Right wing bad days left wing better days. So yes I believe Ngata played the best hand he could in the most difficult of circumstances.
konia: Apirana Ngata was a walking – talking encyclopedia of Maoritanga…brilliant servant of NZers.
Luxon = Clown
I would not call Luxon a denier. He is however evasive. Extraordinarily so. He simply cannot face the question of whether Maori ceded sovereignty or whether the regime which he serves seized sovereign power presumptuously and arbitrarily.
He is also confused, claiming that “the Crown is sovereign”. The Crown is not sovereign, not even within the Realm of New Zealand. The British monarch, King Charles III is sovereign and Head of State in the Realm.
The Crown is two things. First, it is “a traditional form of head adornment, or hat, worn by monarchs as a symbol of their power and dignity”. (It serves us well to remember the simple literal meaning of the word). Second, “the Crown” is a metonym standing for the monarchist state in its entirety – the monarch, his ministers, military and civil services, police and judiciary. In other words the monarch and all those elements of the state over which the monarch has titular authority and which he or she can directly control if and as required.
Christopher Luxon won’t tell you any of this. Perhaps because he suffers from a degree of ignorance about the issue. But the ignorance is wilful. If Luxon understands one thing, it is the danger that an honest and rigorous discussion about the “constitution of New Zealand” would pose to the continued survival of the colonialist regime.
Treaty principles actually only mean one thing…Power.
The Treaty can be summed simply.
in 1840 Maori numbered 75,000 whle the British numbered 2,000.
So Maori allowed the British in as immigrants.
Maori expected the British to intergrate with Maori acknowledging always that Maori were to
be accorded first peoples rights for ever.
This was understood and agreed to by the then heavily out numbered British.
“Yes Maori people we will respect your first Nations rights forever ” they promised.
But by 1855 the Maori population had halved with introduced diseases to under 40,000.
British numbers had by then soared to more than 200,000.
The British forgot about their “promises” then said “Maoris get the fuck off our land”
And so began the 30 year invasions and clearances of millions of acres of land
leading to the almost extinction of the Maori race and permanent destruction of language and culture.
Ever since the invaders have tried to turn Maori survivors into brown skin whites
like Winston Peters Shane Jones and David Seymour.
So in 2023 the majority whites once more voted in a right wing treaty denier Government.
Their intention to legitimise for ever the White invasion and to once and for all
erase all semblance of Maori rights to first Nations people status.
So the only principle is power.
In this case right wing White power.
Principles mean nothing when prejudice and power are involved.
If the intention was to extinguish the Maori race as you term it along with the permanent destruction of their language and culture, then it is hard to explain why, within a few generations, Maori and Pakeha intermarried to such an extent that pure blooded Maori ceases to exist. By marriage we must assume there was an awful lot of LOVE going on (and continues to go on). I can only make the assumption that there are people whose sole purpose is to drive a wedge between the mingling of peoples for some ideological reason. When you listen to some “Maori’ politicians it’s not hard to decipher what their purpose is and it is definitely not peace.
“Māori never needed sovereignty, the Crown took it.”
So, either way, the Crown is sovereign.
Maybe the 21st century is the time to move on?
off you go then back to old blighty then .Dont forget to take all the ferral weeds and animals with you such as the gorse and blackberry that have destroyed much land and forest .
Ahh so that’s it, a dictatorship, just roll over and let us tickle your tummy Andrew, there’s a good boy.
If Maori didn’t cede Sovereignty in the version they signed and they did in the English version then the contract is not valid as the 2 parties signed different documents
That means the British took Sovereignty by right of conquest, something Maori tribes had no problem with
No, Andrew. Tangata motu don’t recognize the British claim to sovereignty over Aotearoa, never have and never will. So at some point King Charles or his successors will be forced to relinquish all their claims over this land. That will have consequences for the government constituted under his authority, and for those who for whatever weird reasons want to impose a hereditary foreign monarch as head of state in New Zealand.
Or history shows that Māori knowingly shared mana. Sovereignty in fairness to Māori is an English concept.
Luxon is actually a reality denier. He believes the world was magicked into existence by an invisible fairy.
Luxon believes that God created all the matter and energy of the universe, and all the laws that govern it, from nothing in 7 days
That’s what I said, he believes an invisible fairy magicked everything (perhaps even the fairy itself) into existence.