Dear Kiwis – we are going to have to have a word about all the NZers we are locking out with MIQ

By
Martyn Bradbury
-
46
1833

Let’s be brutally honest, with Omicron rampaging around the planet, there is no way in hell we are loosening up the MIQ process, if anything it will get tougher.

The political damage that a Omicron leak from MIQ would cause is election losing.

Polls tell us that a solid majority of Kiwis still want a hard border where nothing comes in so the cries of those locked out will find only sympathy in Stuff columns.

But we have to talk about our diaspora because their justified rage at being locked out of their home needs to be discussed.

It’s tough because there’s an anger from domestic kiwis at the traveling class flitting overseas in the middle of a pandemic and little empathy for migrant workers who can’t bring in their families.

From those locked out of MIQ, there is nothing but anguish and a burning hatred of us smug hermits locked away safely in our kingdom .

This diaspora rage is going to have political ramifications which brings us to a tough problem. You can only vote if you have been in NZ once in the last 3 years but with the travel restrictions that will mean many overseas kiwis won’t have been able to get into the country.

Is it fair to strip a NZer of their voting rights if we lock them out of the country?

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This question becomes harder to answer knowing their rage will be voiced with the Party who promises to throw open the border!

So, should we allow Kiwis trapped overseas the right to vote knowing they will vote for whichever Party promises them entry which possibly puts the rest of us at risk?

There are no easy answers in the smug hermit kingdom.

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46 COMMENTS

    • Expats contribute precisely nothing to this country, the longer they are gone the less they can complain. In fact the longer they’re away the more liability they are to this country should they return!

      • So do think the same about gangs, because they contribute nothing to society?

        Hell you could make an argument that beneficiaries only leach of the work force as well? Where’s their contribution?

        • The biggest ‘leaches’ are the banks ,,, the corporations ,,, and the tax havens and loophole tax laws.

          Its a bit mental to talk about balancing govt budgets when we are being swindled and hemorrhaging Billions. https://www.michaelwest.com.au/revealed-australias-top-40-tax-dodgers-for-2021/

          A few years ago here in NZ, the four Aussie banks along with some creative/bent accountants stiffed NZ around 2.2 BILLION in taxes due from their profit gouging.

          To put this in perspective this one example of bankers and accountants fraud equates to 100 years worth of Benefit fraud which stood at 22 million dollars worth in the year of the 2.2 Billion bank robbery [ robbery by the banks].

          BG’s a bit of a dishonest wanker when it comes to socialism and beneficiary’s ,,,,

          I bet he’ll take and feel entitled to his pension ,,,, and privitisation/user pays for things like the police force or fire brigades is as stupid as it sounds.

          Maybe BG’s to stupid to admit he benefits from the socialist / non-Capitalist parts of our society ?.

          He probably looks up to the mega leeches while bitching about the victims of structural unemployment ,,,,

          Because I bet he’ll take his pension ,,,

          • Well why shouldn’t I, I’ve paid for it with the taxes I’ve paid every year? I’m a nett tax provider, not a nett tax liability, so giving me back just some of what I’ve provided hardly makes me selfish. A selfish person is those who give nothing at all, and still expect to be given everything.

            Perhaps the govt could allow me to keep more of my money (that I earned they didn’t) and I could set up my own pension scheme.

            I see massive govt wasteful spending like spending millions on changing the names of ministries, flags or blowing $50 million on bike bridges that were never going to happen in a million years.

            Sorry but I get up at 5 every morning, work 40-50 hours a week and I have no issue providing for those who have fallen on hard times, paying for health and education, but there’s a limited to my generosity.

            • eeee an when I were a lad it were all fields round here…

              I’ve spotted NZs first official ‘gammon’ and I claim my 5 pounds

        • When you say beneficiaries Bg does that include pensioners (the biggest beneficiary group in NZ) or are you being discriminative. Not all beneficiaries are bludgers. And what about those of us that get fuck all for our taxes cause of all the racism in our country and the one size fits all bullshit.

      • i feel sorry for sad people like you Xray. Bitter and twisted because you have never done anything with your life and now live in a crime ridden dump.

      • contribute nothing??? How about all that fucking interest on those student loans????? And there there is the skills gained overseas unavailable here they bring back to NZ along with their hard earned cash . Kiwis leave because it pays to do so. If you are a born and bred Kiwi you have a right to vote and influence what happens here !

  3. Empathy for those offshore before COVID arrived–and even those who travelled from NZ in 2020, but for anyone who went overseas after Delta arrived sod ’em. It is interesting the number of people that do say “close the border”.

    Natzos are well off on this one.

  5. Fuck’em. They’ll bitch and moan about MIQ or the food or something else when they get here. Then after a holiday they’ll bitch and moan about the government and how oppressed they feel in lil ole NZ and how its not how it use to be so that’s why they’ve decided to fuck off again… bla bla bla.

    But, they’ll say that they’ll return when things are better.

    Fuck’em off until full service returns to some kinda normal.

    • I have a friend who went to Australia to visit her daughter when the borders were open earlier last year but she got stuck there, she has not been able to get a miq spot & is considering an offer via sea transport (that’s all I know) which is not an ideal situation. I like the idea of closed borders however there needs to be a better understanding of people’s needs & having money would not be top of my list for reasons to travel.

  6. Omicron WILL enter and the only thing that will then halt its spread through most of the population will be an omicron specific vaccination. Until then high vaccination uptake with current types is the best tool to reduce harm.
    Everyday the border holds the better prepared we can be. It won’t hold forever.
    Expat friends and family can simply learn the value of patience and reflect on how human beings coped with global separation before air travel.

    • why do they want to come ‘home’? ‘human interest’ stories aside is it that NZ is seen as a safe haven from covid, a safety their unfettered return will destroy…thus self defeating

  8. Immigration, MIQ and other bits and pieces sure is a potential election loser. That, along with a Minister that continues to Faff around in each of his portfolios.
    I saw a comment yesterday (from Gillian Evans I think) that gave me the impression that because we’re not as bad as Austraya, all is tickety boo. There are those in INZ that would like things to be just like our Tasman neighbours.
    Fuck what a shambles.
    I’m still trying to figure out why expat Koiwois who’ve been out of the country for several years and have contributed SFA to this lil ‘ole nation that punches above its weight seem to think they have a better right to people we’ve brought in to wipe geriatric bums and staff our hospitals (oft times under false pretences).

    Not even sure why those expat Koiwois maintain the right to vote after one or two election cycles when it has become clear their preference is to live offshore – UNTIL of course when things go tits up and they suddenly want to seek shelter in what they see as their ‘birthright’

  9. I don’t give a rats arse if a person is a kiwi or a Martian when it comes to allowing Omicron into NZ.

    They still don’t know how Delta leaked out into the community back in July. It’s absolutely inevitable Omicron will also leak into the community. I sincerely believe it already has. In most cases the symptoms are mild so a positive case may not even be aware they have it. Then you have the other side of the coin where the positive case may know he has it but during a hot kiwi summer has zero interest in going back into lockdown after months of home detention last year.

    NZ has a big problem right now. Trust in the “system” is falling. Add that to people being well and truly over Covid and it’s implications, you just know the all important compliance is going to be a huge issue. We can’t afford that dynamic with a variant 8 x more transmissible than Delta.

    I point the finger of blame straight at the revered Dr Ashley Bloomfield. He knew there was zero apatite in NZ for further Covid restrictions. He knew NZ and especially Auckland paid a high price in 2021. He is also fully aware the more cases that arrive at our border the greater risk is of yet another community outbreak. Despite these facts, Bloomfield authorized exemptions for people heading to NZ having to get a negative pre departure test from a staggering 105 countries. Those people could book flights, book MIQ etc etc but getting a pre departure test was in the too hard basket for them. He’s recently had a U Turn on that but in the mean time hundreds of positive cases have been arriving at our border. Our population is 5 million yet we only had 25 positive cases in NZ today yet there were 43 positive cases at the border. Almost all will be Omicron. WTAF ?

    Kiwis here had a very tough year in 2021 but Bloomfield has shown more consideration for those offshore than the kiwis that have been fighting the battle here and are 100% sick of it all.

  10. Clearly, most of you haven’t figured it out yet.
    We have a democracy that enables us to vote. ( Voting should be mandatory btw.)
    That democracy, our democracy, has neoliberal-capitalist innards.
    Do I need to explain why that’s a problem?
    I probably do.
    The problem is that in a capitalist oriented democracy everything’s about the money. Those with money want more of it and so they’ll tailor our politics to enable that while those many of us without much money will constantly strive to keep ahead of the ever escalating costs of living the rich throw at us. Supermarket duopolies are one of many examples of that. That’s why labour and national could be twins. They ARE in fact twins. They’re in fact exactly the same. roger douglas was labour’s minister of finance. Now he’s the flea biting seymour’s balls as ACT leader. seymour couldn’t lead a Lemming off a cliff. He merely panders to that cadre of old blur rinse crooks who’ve sold their souls for a boat in the marina.
    In a neoliberal-capitalist democracy everything’s still about the money but worse the rich have pirated your once were state built, ie taxes built assets for the security of all of us which were then sold off to make billionaires out of billionaires who now lord it over us as we try to run ever faster on the privatised treadmills they’ve forced us onto.
    And now? The neoliberal capitalists are so well dug in it’ll take warfare to return to before we were ripped off by rich, well educated crooks.
    Do the research? It’s bloody easy. Check out jonkys past? ACT’s douglas and quigley and their mates and associates? They’re just dodgy fucking scum bags.
    We poor bastards must stop hoping our politicians will do the right thing by us. It’s now a question of mind over matter. They don’t mind because we don’t matter.

  11. It is a fantasy we can keep Omicron out.
    Short of 100% closure of the borders, which is never going to happen, it will leak in.
    That being the case we need to get ready, which we are doing…. slowly.
    It is 90% less severe across the board than Delta – this is data is now being published in multiple reputable places. This does place this variant in the “marginally worse than flu category” – but it is still a novel virus in a vaccinated but previously unexposed population – that’s the danger here.
    A wave appears to last 8-10 weeks.
    The worst case scenario is Omicron arrives May / June and we have it added to winter illness. Winter almost collapses every hospital annually, regardless of the colour of .govt it has been thus for the 25 years I have been working in the health sector. It needs to arrive in Feb/Mar. So we need to get ready for it and we need to encourage boosters and we need to bolster GP and EDs. This isn’t a variant collapsing ICU anymore, it is a variant that collapses primary care and ED’s. The east coast Australia experience shows it is symptomatic, but largely well people who are swamping the system, they feel dreadful, but aren’t dying…. we will be the same, but we need to support that part of the system as best we can. The 20% absenteeism is the other elephant in the room, and it will cause chaos, but it hopefully will be short and sharp.
    We cannot keep this out and we need to work through a strategy for its arrival, not living in a fantasy that we can lock the borders. The worst case scenario is we are to successful and we end up delaying it to arrive in late Autumn.

  12. We have a world system that usually identifies you from the place in which you were born. That is one matter that this post is dealing with. It was considered a great move for NZs to be able to travel overseas, to reach overseas standards and develop their skills further, of just to explore the world. We cannot turn round now and growl at them like guard dogs. I went on my big OE in the 70’s and learned about the world and experienced some of it, not all continents. It seemed a logical progression as a citizen from what was then considered a developed nation.

    But I was still a Kiwi. Inia Te Wiata*, opera singer par excellence, or kapai, was once a freezing worker who took voice lessons to develop his talent. and was lauded overseas. NZs then were proud of NZ and didn’t view the country just as real estate for those wanting to enrich themselves by hocking it off to the highest bidder. Inia Te Wiata’s prowess in opera and other arts, including carving where his NZ connection and spirit resulted in a fine pouihi carved in the basement of NZ House in London in his ‘spare’ time. Surely this would have ensured him having priority to return? But then Kiwis should all have that opportunity, whether famous in the world or just in their own ‘back-yard’. If not now, then when? Name a near date for a new system. Part of the problem perhaps is that half the officials planning the MIQ and immigration will be imports with no childhood connection to this country as their place; with a commitment to our society. It’s a possibility, I don’t know the figures. And probably would be prevented from enquiring about the size of the invasion by various laws.
    *https://teara.govt.nz/en/biographies/5t12/te-wiata-inia-morehu-tauhia-watene-iarahi-waihurihia

    If NZs have been trying to get back for a while and keep missing out on MIQ, they should go onto a special list for which there is a quota. That can be expanded or narrowed as time goes on, but Kiwis born and bred should have a gate especially for them. They should have a wicket door; the present state appears to be instead, wicked.

  13. Of course we allow Kiwis trapped overseas the right to vote. Preventing a citizen from voting by locking them out is horribly undemocratic – doubly so if the reason “Oh but they might vote against us” is in play.

  14. This from countryboy tells it like it is.
    In a neoliberal-capitalist democracy everything’s still about the money but worse the rich have pirated your once were state built, ie taxes built assets for the security of all of us which were then sold off to make billionaires out of billionaires who now lord it over us as we try to run ever faster on the privatised treadmills they’ve forced us onto.

    It’s worth taking copies of and print in font size 20 pinning or stapling all over the place so that people who have never had a clue, or read anything deeper than online trash can be confronted. ‘The truth- you can’t handle the truth.’ See if they are able to read the big and little words and understand their meaning.

    By the way too much cannabis can affect the brain responses to words; can be read but meaning doesn’t stay. Imagine what meth or the other household cleansers people take is doing.

  15. In former days our army would have been used to commandeer rugby grounds and public greens and the like to set up MIQ tent overflow centers, our air force would have been used to set up airlifts for our nationals locked out overseas [ if they wished to come home] under simple diplomatic relations with those country’s while our navy would have done what’s its always admirably done- disaster relief for those in crisis,- such as the people of Tonga currently. Its time we stopped being such a pack of wimps and rolled up our sleeves. That and increase the size and funding of our armed services. As well as change the law so those overseas can at least vote.

  16. This is the problem with political leadership driven by poll numbers: It’s not leading; it’s following.

    The best option for NZ is to let the relatively harmless Omicron enter NZ and so provide us with a measure of resistance to future variants now that we know the vaccines have essentially been defeated.

    I’m sure there is a cohort of 85+ year old boomers out there who would rather strangle NZ to death economically so they they can carry on a few years past their use-by date. This seems a patently selfish attitude to me (as a boomer myself). Omicron will get here eventually so let’s stop pissing about

    1. Scrap MIQ
    2. Let all the overseas kiwis in who have a viable place to isolate
    3. Allow home isolation
    4. Recommend oldies isolate themselves until most of it is over – they can surely sort out food delivery for a couple of months.
    5. Buy the new Pfizer therapeutic in bulk (Paxlovid) that reduces hospitalizations by over 85%

    But that would require leadership with balls

    • The reality is you can’t trust people to abide by the rules of home isolation. There are numerous examples of that. Which is why we have MIQ. However, to deal with returning New Zealanders (and selected migrants) we need more MIQ. Maybe 50% more.

      Thankfully, neither of the major political parties will follow your advice. National was lax about a disciplined approach initially, but they seem to have learnt a lesson of not following every populist whim (such as yours). In addition it would simply alienates about 70% of all voters.

  17. Omicron is far less lethal than Delta. Omicron is muscling out Delta to become the predominate Covid 19 strain in the world. make of that what you will. What follows next, is anyone’s guess.

  18. Only in an authoritarian police state do you take away a citizen’s right to vote under existing rules without a referendum. It won’t and shouldn’t happen. Those who believe the vote should be restricted to only those living here just reinforce JKs “hermit kingdom “ comments. It would be easier to stomach the MIQ shambles if the wiggles, DJs and other entertainers and sports teams weren’t given preference. Those who believe family of those living here don’t deserve to come back to see family regardless of the circumstances are selfish fuckwits. That doesn’t include travellers. The only reason the MIQ system is still there is the shambles that is our hospital status. If Australia is struggling we will be fucked when omicron gets out. The state of the health system has been neglected by National but also Labour and that’s no excuse to punish NZrs abroad. Let’s be kind even if we are mean by nature.

  19. FFS – Its gotta go around at some stage – stay locked up if you want to but I want to catch it like 100’s of millions have and move on already – 2 yrs of this nonsense is enough

    • Except the ones who deliberately caught it and died, do you want to be like them too? They moved on all right!

      And yet you call this nonsense.

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