I know, I know, I know!
How dare I compare 2 terrorists with each other! How horrible etc etc etc. Look, this is TDB, home of the Dirt Bag Left and everyone is an adult so if such a comparison triggers you, fuck off to the Spin-off or Stuff.co.NZ, or RNZ or any other number of woke middle class media.
That said, I promise if you like what I wrote above, you won’t like what I have to say in comparing these two terrorists.
There is of course enormous difference.
The Muslim terrorist was preventable in every sense, the white supremacist terrorist could have been prevented if the security apparatus was doing its job.
In my mind, there should no surprise whatsoever that alienated and socially isolated Muslims in host western cultures turn to extremist propaganda online and radicalize.
Firstly, there’s plenty of legitimate reason to hate the West’s occupations in the middle east and our penchant for propping up authoritarian Muslim regimes when it serves our oil and geopolitical ends.
I hate the West’s foreign policy and I’m not even Muslim!
Secondly, if we don’t make those Muslims moving here feel welcome it is easy for them to become ostracized and radicalized.
There’s also something else about the ISIS terrorists experience here in NZ that also contributed to his radicalization. It is very apparent from what has been released into the public domain that his paranoia and suspicion of the State persecuting him and wanting to do him harm was actually completely legitimate.
How much of our behavior via the state actually contributed to his radicalization? We dare not answer that question because we don’t want to know the answer to that.
Refugees are fleeing the most damaged places in the world, providing them with safe haven isn’t enough. We have an obligation when we take refugees in to not only keep them safe but to help them heal the damage they’ve suffered.
We didn’t do that with the ISIS terrorist.
Please don’t mistake what I am saying here, I’m not justifying this mans violence but you understand it more when you add in the West’s obscene foreign policy, cultural alienation and the State’s own role in radicalizing him.
The ISIS terrorist was preventable.
To my mind the white supremacist terrorist has none of these justifications to fall back on. The Christchurch White Supremacist is the terrible conclusion of what identity politics leads to, white men seeing themselves as the victim.
Add this victimhood with an insane belief system that we are being replaced and you create a fake righteousness that justifies extreme violence. In the hands of a bitter white male with privilege issues, the end result can be an abomination.
The only way you could stop the White Supremacist terrorist would be to catch him out by the intelligence apparatus before him commits the acts.
So the Muslim terrorist was foreseeable and preventable, the White Supremacist terrorist has no justification other than the seething resentment of bitter white men angry at a broadening of society and their perceived loss of cultural power.
If we had spent money upfront in helping the refugee connect we could have avoided the Lynn Mall terror attach, the only way you will catch the White Supremacist terrorist is eternal vigilance by the authorities.
There is a difference here between these two and we need to acknowledge that if we are going to prevent these happening again.
The latest stats from Prisons show our corrupt, violent and overcrowded prison system is actually generating and creating extremist terrorists, maybe we should start there?
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You are assuming he could have been fixed Martyn. I don’t think that can be assumed. There are things that happen to people in an unnecessary war setting that make his head space completely understandable , and no amount of counselling or support is going to change.
Our best way of helping people like him might be to refuse to ever get sucked to America’s wars of “humanitarian intervention” again.
D J S
Yet he came from a part of the world which was not part of the USA’s theatre of operations. and I thought this was very relevant https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/126332093/the-makings-of-a-terrorist–and-the-people-who-tried-to-help-him
I guess I did pick up that he was Sri lankan Steve, but his inspiration came from ISIS apparently. I thought I heard he was here as a refugee but the article you referenced doesn’t confirm that . How did he come to still be here after arriving on a student visa a decade ago?
I stand corrected that he was not directly from a country ravaged by a U S war .
D J S
Oh great. Another one of those “let’s sit out entire conflicts.”
Sri Lanka and the drastic horrors of the Tamil Tigers conflict and what followed all probably plays a huge part in what caused this guy to go extreme Isil, but NZers’ ignorance of this will not stop them making grand judgements.
Yeah its nice to blame the past, before us, but the present is the time to heal the past, and as a country we probably failed and worsened his trauma.
Remember NZ has got the worst suicide stats for youth.
Even those English bobbies that migrated here around 2005 after a delegation went over and lured them here. 80% or so returned to the UK within a few years, because NZ sucked so hard for them.
Yeah. Sweden is currently experiencing a major gang problem attributed to dislocated young immigrant males.
The day of 9/11 I took a portable television into work and we had it going all day in the smoko room. From time to time our group of ordinary okay sort of people talked about what the Muslim world found objectionable about the west. We had no trouble coming up with answers.
The following day, Wellington’s ‘Dominion’ newspaper, edited by some bloke, ran an editorial, asking why would they do this. I couldn’t believe my eyes.
Well if we were running counter terror operations by ethnic lines Saudi Arabia would have been first to get invaded because a the 9/11 people were Saudi. But Whitehouse logic says oil good.
Another difference is how we look to explain the actions of Samsudeen and Tarrant.
With Samsudeen, we look for causes that led to his mindset and behavior. He almost gets framed as a victim. Not so with Tarrant. His backstory is less to the front, we look to erase him. In our tolerance, we focus on his race, his whiteness.
Is there any contributing factors in his upbringing? Watching his father lose a battle with cancer and finding him after his suicide? Going through a family separation and watching his mother suffer domestic violence at the hands of her partner? Being bullied as a teen for being overweight and not very good at sport? Becoming socially isolated and living in an online world? Ongoing mental health problems? None of it matters.
We are told not to rush to judge a religion, the Sri Lankan community and refugees. And we shouldn’t. But others would use Tarrant as a stick to beat white New Zealand.
I have a theory that both the terrorists were short and felt angry about it and inherently inadequate.
We need to be kind to short people.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bfyS-S-IJs
Short people are paid less than tall people.
The Dutch knew what they were doing when they put growth hormone in the water, and went from being the shortest people in Europe to being the tallest people in the world, over a 40 year period.
However, many of the worlds greatest men have actually been short. Churchill, Mandela, Gandhi, the list is really tall I mean long…
Most Hollywood leading men used to be tall but in the latter decades they are all short, but Italians took over studios in LA and New York. However like jack russels, short people actually have more spark in front of the camera and tallness and gigantism makes facial features ugly, just look at some of our locks. It shortens lifespan too, short people and women usually live longer.
The comments in the below YouTube are gold if you want to explore the science and social angles on short guys. It really challenges our conceptions as we seldom include sizism alongside racism or sexism
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nH_T9fLd_Q
AND the word ‘racism’ has not appeared in any of these comments here, let alone sizist ideologies…. But this guy suffered sizism, racism, unattractive appearance, had chronic food intolerances that were never acknowledged but greatly affected his mood, digestion and sleep.
He chose suicide by cop, as well as angrily making a statement about his suffering and the lack emphatic care or acknowledgement of disability by his family or the global medical system.
On ‘top’ of all this, Tarrants astrology is super revealing in hindsight, but no DOB anywhere for Samsudeen? Many times the stars are crossed and people can be born under a bad sign. Add that to the mix and an unfortunate set of circumstances becomes intolerable.
There is one glaring thing that links both lots of terrorists. Basically they are incels who want to lord it over some female.
Thank you for coming to my talk
Today I finally got round to googling his name and finding out a bit about him, as I seldom watch or read any news or online commentary anymore.
My first 2 observations were that his hair was ultra dry [probably] due to undiagnosed food intolerance and he had a hidden subtle physical and mental disability of some kind, like Tarrant.
And I thought, instead of spending all that money on surveillance and inflaming him further, why not address his disabilities? and take him fishing?
Imagine a group of decent kiwi blokes taking him out on a boat for the day and catching some sun and fish? Maybe even a few beers or a halal joint together? Share some laughs and some love? Do it again a few weeks later, and again.
What about a bush walk in the Waitaks? A family dinner with a host assimilation minded kiwi family?
Show some love?
Just another big fuckup caused by the competitive and commercial patriarchy and the worlds male centric religions.
And the medical and legal system not actually wanting to heal a genetically and subsequently socially damaged person, but keep them sick to bleed money from them or the state.
These terrorists are made, forged day by day by a society that is mean and uncaring, sees you as a dollar sign, without love.
Medical prostitution or sex therapy? Cat cafe’s? Psilocybin therapy?
Maybe he had been given ssri in prison? That shit is responsible for so much social harm, and it aint never talked about ever.
Where was the love? The milk of human kindness promised by this government?
The neoliberals wanted bums on seats and plenty of bad people now reside in NZ. At the same time, a lot of people have left NZ because of the way neoliberalism works. Neoliberalism hate experts, neoliberalism hates professionals, neoliberals hate higher incomes for more people, neoliberals want a low wage economy full of uneducated labourers in farms and retail/food shops, who love consuming products.
At the same time, the woke joined the neoliberals and demanded that immigration be relaxed, the good character test essentially abolished or not checked over a long time, abolishing English language tests, normal assessment of entering NZ removed such as so much fraud with funds, not deporting people while having criteria to stay, that anybody can stay if they may suffer any harm in their own countries. AKA anybody who is mentally ill, unemployed, sick, a terrorist, gay, or any other reason like having children in NZ, means they get to become a permanent NZ citizen/resident and stay claim benefits here. Weirdly they don’t have a criteria about causing harm to people living in NZ as a means to deport people and cancel visas.
Woke refuse to change our border criteria closer to OZ, so that many can claim benefits in NZ, overseas people can plan terror attack here, while NZ doesn’t bother to investigate why they are here or remove them if they are causing harm to NZ. Samsudeen only lasted 1 month on his student course and then according to his parents, got radicalised by his neighbours in NZ.
In the UK, much of the radicalisation of terrorists is done by religious charities and through prison, and NZ makes it so easy… no doubt giving millions as we speak in funding to help those influencing the next terror attack or allowing the money to flow here from terrorists, to the same effect.
Is that you Donald?
What percentage of Auckland prisoners are migrants? Per capita, most are locals?
Research suggests that people tend to overestimate the relationship between immigration and criminality,[1][2][3] and that the media tends to erroneously depict immigrants as particularly crime-prone.[4] The academic literature provides mixed findings for the relationship between immigration and crime worldwide, but finds for the United States that immigration either has no impact on the crime rate or that it reduces the crime rate.[5][6][7][2][8][9][10] A meta-analysis of 51 studies from 1994–2014 on the relationship between immigration and crime in the United States found that overall immigration reduces crime, but the relationship is very weak.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_and_crime
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