SACK ALL KIWIRAIL MANAGEMENT NOW!

By
Martyn Bradbury
-
68
14924
NZ Last Grandpa doing his usual blah blah blah

NO WAY!!!!!

NZ firms Fletchers and Downer ‘fuming’ as $371m Govt KiwiRail contract goes overseas

Construction companies Fletcher and Downer are reportedly “fuming” after a $371 million Government rail contract has been awarded to overseas companies – costing the Kiwi firms hundreds of local jobs.

Three sources within the companies have told the Herald on Sunday they were unsuccessful in their joint bid for the Papakura to Pukekohe rail electrification contract in South Auckland.

It is understood the KiwiRail contract has been awarded to a joint bid from Chinese-owned firm John Holland and South African-owned McConnell Dowell.

The competing New Zealand and overseas tenders were reportedly “very, very close” but cost played a determining factor.

At a time of immense job loses, at a time of immense challenges to our infrastructure, at a time of so called ‘kindness’, the scum of Kiwirail management have turned their backs on NZ companies doing the urgently needed upgrades to a bloody Chinese and South African company!

That’s it – sack the lot of them! Quisling traitorous scum shouldn’t be part of decision making that sees NZ jobs destroyed for Chinese and South African ones and if the scum board of KiwiRail can’t get their heads around that, then their bloody heads should roll!

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The Government CAN NOT be allowed to get away with this. Why the hell are we spending hundreds of millions on upgrades but then handing those upgrades to overseas firms?

Oh and look who is the Minister for State Owned Enterprises? Why it’s Wee Winnie Peters, who talks NZ First but in reality it’s NZ Last because he hasn’t in 3 years changed any legislation demanding State Owned Enterprises look at ensuring NZ jobs benefit from Government procurement…

Minister for State Owned Enterprises, Winston Peters, would not be drawn on the wisdom of the KiwiRail electrification contract going overseas, but pointed out the unsuccessful firms could still win another $315m Auckland rail project soon.

“KiwiRail cannot be influenced by ministers in their tender process, and must follow government procurement rules, which at this time do not allow them to discriminate against foreign-owned companies,” Peters said.

…Oh Wee Winnie Peters talks a big game, but when the hundred million dollar contracts are up for grabs he’s no where to be seen.

If this is the politics of kindness, which is the exact same politics of ‘do-it-cheaply-screw- the-local-job-market’, then the politics of kindness is a sick joke.

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68 COMMENTS

  1. Surely these firms must be made to use New Zealand labour? Do not allow another wave of immigrant workers.

  2. Agreed, an appalling decision. Where’s the commitment to rebuilding our economy? Ideally our railways should be re-nationalized, but I can’t see that being a priority for this govt.

  3. Did you really expect anything different?
    Railing against neo-liberalism (pardon the …), but quite happy to occupy its bed sheets in any sort of 3some his retail politician BFF thinks. (Maybe Shane thinks The Chinese and South Africans might be better at getting ‘a few bros off the couch’ and into a few slave-like jobs).
    Oh NZ First – how you have fallen – not that you were that great to begin with except for a few with principles.

  4. KiwiRail chief operating officer of capital projects David Gordon is being very slippery in his replies. What exactly are; “non-price attributes”? Hopefully they include some quality control, as I recall previous Chinese supplied carriages had to be extensively strengthened before being fit for purpose.

    “We have not concluded negotiations with any party for this contract, but can confirm we are in discussions with a preferred supplier,” Gordon said.
    …”We can confirm that the weighting applied for the contract, and disclosed to bidders at the outset of the process, was 70 per cent for non-price attributes and 30 per cent for price,” Gordon said.

    {From NZH link in OP}

    So if negotiations have not yet been concluded, then there is still time for public pressure to influence the decision. Protest action may not even have to be socially distanced after Wednesday.

    • David Gordon is a slippery customer to work with.

      Gisborne rail Action Group” in Gisborne knows all about his under-handed approach to hiding behind the company structure.

      When he put out the (EOI) ‘expressions of interest’ to lease the damged rail link between Gisborne and Wairoa; David Gordon ignored the bids of several interested group operators and associated groups, and he then selected a “rail bike’ operator!!!!!!!

      Many believe it was so he could stop any other rail freight/passenger operators to get any operations on that line.
      Some today are calling for his sacking and replacement with a rail friendly manager.

      Mike Williams sits on the Kiwi Rail board and must stand up for our NZ Workers here.

      Mike must also call for Greg Miller and David Gordon to step down from management as they are anti-rail it appears.

    • As with the give away contract under key and his importer mates, to supply rail rolling stock, key oversaw it go to the Chinese and as a result we lost the Hillside rail workshops so lowering the NZ capability.
      Any contract that can be done in NZ should be as it will build up our resilience, capability, follow up maintenance and workforce training and experience.

      NZ Rail is Govt owned and therefore is a Govt responsibility in a wider setting.

      Winny has deep back pockets and his party needs donors.

      • Free trade has cost NZ businesses dearly and when the new trains were built in China a number of years ago they were all under powered and cost NZ millions to repower them, So much for this pathetic government to make job’s job’s job’s
        Practice what you preach

  5. I understand what you are saying but hard to be a cheerleader for Fletchers or Downer. Blank cheques and shitty performance on projects has me on the fence on this one. MOW anyone?

    • I worked for MOW during the Tongariro power project and NOW did brilliant work and employed the best engineers I have ever seen, to qualify this since then I have worked all around the world and NOW should have been kept as the savior of our country, as building now is a shambles.

      So whoever got rid of MOW needs to be jailed.

      • MOW is a vital concept completing many hundreds of large projects with rigorously monitored, publicly accountable standards, throughout NZ that have stood the test of time as a standard measure.
        A core MOW needs to be set up and expanded as work undertaken growns, all in house without contracting out as the aim over time.

      • Ditto @ CG – as in working for MOW (VCC – Vogel Computer Centre – which handled engineering-oriented processing for a number of departments)
        I’d like to know what happened to all that intellectual property. Probably given away for a song

      • Bring back state owned Ministry of Works…anything else is bleeding taxpayer money ….and it is an absolute disgrace the contract is going to China

    • And Downers don’t exactly work on behalf of kiwis either given their preference of non kiwi staff.

    • Agreed. NZ companies have horrendous track records and do not deserve the contracts. I support China with their strong work ethic. The Chinese will have this done on time, on budget and without all the whining, whingeing and poor-me bullshit we get from NZ companies.

  6. Totally agree sixfootfour, uncle MOW built the infrastructure of this country dams powerhouses tunnel’s (some of which i worked on) which that scumbag douglas then hocked off to his buddies for cents on the thousand dollars. Now they are all looking to rape the “customers” (former owners us) to update / maintain the machinery ignored for so many years while they raked in the cash on assets owned by the people of this country. I also personally knew one of the temp workers who were employed at the woburn workshops to remove asbestos from chinese made rail carriages, and were issued with flimsy paper face masks???
    A comment on fletcher’s would not be complete without the many happy smiling recipients of there largess after the Canterbury earthquakes. (sarc)

  7. “If this is the politics of kindness, which is the exact same politics of ‘do-it-cheaply-screw- the-local-job-market’, then the politics of kindness is a sick joke ”
    Well Bomber once the smoke cleared on the covid 19 justified hysteria this government and its whole approach are laid bare again.
    I agree totally with six foot fours comments regarding Fletcher’s and Downers.
    NZF is a sham and only exists as a front for corrupt kiwi businesses to bury the laws they don’t like and provide people like Peters and Jones with a profile and the perks of office.
    Strange that Muller has left the back door key out for Winston and Shane after all those years saying he was not welcome at home.
    The politics of kindness was always going to ring hollow eventually when you look more closely at the current Labour party , its already blowing up in their faces just look at welfare and housing.

  8. Twas a sad day in Dunedin when Hillside Engineering was mothballed and Chinese Carriages replaced their excellent LOCAL work… Twas also a sad day when Fisher & Paykel pulled the plug on their Manufacturing Plant in Mosgiel & Caversham laying off hundreds more skilled Engineers and Production line LOCAL workers, in favour of Chinese cheap labour and inferior Steel.
    You’d think we would learn by our mistakes…

    • Hillside Engineering was a subsidiary of Kiwi Rail yet a Chinese outsider got the contract.
      Kiwirail sold off a part of hillside then decided to retain facilities to refurbish rolling stock.
      WHY WHY WHY was Hillside not retooled to build rolling stock.

      Follow where the money trail leads.
      Back handers are never new when it comes to contracts.

  9. Downer NZ is owned by Australian interests as well. I am picking that Fletcher’s is majority overseas owned, as the shareholders are hidden by nominee companies.

    McConnell Dowell was NZ owned before it was sold to South African interests in 2003, but has a good record in these sorts of projects, being involved in a lot of the Think Big stuff.

    The work would have gone to offshore interests anyway.

    • Exactly as you say.
      Neither Fletchers nor Downer could make any viable claim to be NZ companies other than via ‘listing ‘ on the NZX in addition to ASX , and only marginally more so than the successful bidders.
      The firesale of MOW to the then Kuwaiti owned Downer Corporation a generation ago heralded the complete demise of Public Works in this country.
      A revival of public works requires a PLAN , which , on evidence, seems to be wholly beyond the capabilities of this government and Parliament in it’s entirety.
      It’s not impossible , I’m sure the expertise is available around the globe and more than willing to translocate to Covid , Trump and neo-fascist free NZ .
      The public seem to be willing as well, the lack of commitment suggests that nothing short of a neo-lib witch hunt in the political , bureaucrat , technocrat & legal sectors will enable it to happen.

      • I agree bokenback;
        We need to restore all mechanical workshops in NZ again as we had back in the 1960’s so we can cope with large scale projects otherwise we will be shortchanged by “contractors from overseas who will leave substandard building project to fail’
        Bring back the railway and public works departments again or become another failed state.

      • “I’m sure the expertise is available around the globe and more than willing to translocate to Covid , Trump and neo-fascist free NZ”.

        I really like that idea Brokenback.
        We could actually leverage our current situation as a country to invite some folk and their families with the actual skills we require to come and help rebuild and reinvigorate our former valuable Public Services (like the MoW).
        Never has NZ been more attractive as a place to live, given current happenings overseas.
        But yes, a long overdue cull of the neoliberal parasites retarding all potential nationbuilding public-good exercises is required.

    • fletcher is really unstable the stubbies could lose everything if it collapses you really dont want tie your wagon to fletchers these days

  10. “KiwiRail cannot be influenced by ministers in their tender process, and must follow government procurement rules, which at this time do not allow them to discriminate against foreign-owned companies,” Peters said.
    This is probably true , but if so the structure that Kiwirail operates under has to be changed, or what is the point of it being government owned, and how on earth is any government going to ever look after the New Zealand economy.
    A very depressing story. So much for Peters claims of New Zealand coming out of the pandemic and the world economic crisis with a stronger more self sufficient economy.
    In the current moment in time with what is happening everywhere this I fear is a defining decision demonstrating what to expect in the future from this government (or any other) in terms of transformative government , reminiscent of the signing of the updated TPPA in derision of those of us who had hoped for a different path.
    D J S

    • DJS
      Yes of course rules in the best interests of NZ can be put in place long before they become needed.

  11. Letter to Kiwi Rail Chairman from the community.
    7/6/20
    Dear Brian Corban. – Chair of Kiwi Rail.
    Dear Brian;

    We are very concerned about the awarding of over $350.million dollars of taxpayer money to over-seas companies building our rail restoration today in NZ and shutting out NZ companies competing for the same work.

    We have little faith that overseas companies can be able to continue to carry out better engineering work than we have here due to the historic geological challenges we face here today.

    Secondly we feel that in the Covid 19 pandemic we need jobs for our own workers and have training of others when taking part of projects.

    I myself left my apprenticeship as a fully certified tradesman to work for Ministry of Works at the Tongariro power scheme in 1965; – and from working on this project this taught me valuable skills that were of value to our country afterwards as I began my own company.

    This shows the value of training up engineering staff for our future building projects, – so hiring overseas companies is a retrograde step backwards and not in our own public interests.

    We need you to also consider the replacement of several executives among your management team due to public knowledge of anger at their bad practices seen during the handling of awarding of work contacts.

    We are aware of public disappointment with two of your current executives on Kiwi’s management; and will enlarge further in this letter to you below.

    Today the NZ Herald has such a story of the contact awarded to overseas companies to carry out large building of our publicly owned railway around Auckland, and has sparked anger in the NZ Building industry.

    I refer to this article here;
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=12337516
    NZ Herald.
    BUSINESS
    “NZ firms Fletchers and Downer ‘fuming’ as $371m Govt KiwiRail contract goes overseas”

    On this day we also write to you about our east coast regions communities who have lived through 8yrs of hell without a rail service to Gisborne from Napier, which has now caused massive trucks clogging our narrow roads all over our regions that are firstly placing all road users at harm’s way and death.

    In summary; Our roads are constantly clogged with heavy trucks that make our community travel dangerous and sadly fatal to families.

    To demonstrate this we offer this to you; My wife and I are both over 70 plus retirees, and now we feel endangered every time we drive from Napier to Gisborne as the trucks almost always tailgate us forcing us to speed unsafely on the conditions of our roads now.

    All because we have no rail services any more, so the roads are clogged full of large double tandem trucks now that travel faster than before.

    Even inside all our suburbs in all our cities around Gisborne and HB suffer from the truck noise, vibrations, and pollution (including dangerous cancer causing tyre dust that is harmful to health and quality of life and sleep disruption that is harming all who live near all heavy truck routes.

    Rail was meant to balance the freight demand in NZ and has steel wheels so no tyre dust.

    Now without rail now this is being eroded by the massive increased truck freight now seen in NZ since rail freight around all provinces has been in decline during this century.

    We are requesting your support to make the Gisborne rail line operational again to balance the freight demand equal between rail and road again as we had during the 1960’s in our region of Gisborne and HB.

    We are aware of public disappointment with two of your current executives on Kiwi’s management; so we ask for Kiwi Rail to Being a good neighbour
    • specifically CEO Greg Miller and his asset manager David Gordon.
    • Both who have never offered or considered to meet our communities at any time before they have made their decisions that has now caused collectively many adverse effects to us all.
    • No consideration here by them for active consultation has caused friction within the community, and that has deeply hurt and affected our community, and shows of no consideration whatsoever for the health and wellbeing of our communities affected by their adverse actions.

    Former executives of Kiwi Rail have met our groups since Kiwi Rail was setup in 2008, and fully respected our concerns, and always has attempted to mitigate any adverse effects to our communities, but in this change of leadership since Peter Reidy left in 2018, we have seen erosion of respect for the communities in regions that these Kiwi Rail Executives operate Kiwi Rail services currently and planning changes that will potentially affect us all.

    In summary; Brian;

    • Is to have you make the changes we outline here,
    • to have your Executives respect the communities they operate in during their positions as Kiwi Rail Management in operations and planning.
    • If they refuse then replace those executives we outlined above.
    • Importantly have them meet with all communities that are to be affected by any negative planning changes, that potentially will affect all residential and rural communities before making any changes.
    • Have a “community representation sub-committee group sit around your ‘round table’ during your planning changes to give community a voice to concerns during consideration of changes to Kiwi Rail operations.
    • This change in policy within Kiwi Rail will facilitate a smooth transition to a more harmonious relationship between communities and Kiwi Rail avoiding any nasty surprises in future with a “no surprise policy” in place, this we are convinced of.

    • Corban was part of the privatisation of NZ electricity. A proper scoundrel.

      It is all about destroying the Nation State and going for a World Government

  12. Maybe the reason that this contract was not let to Fletchers or Downers is that Kiwi Rail wanted the project completed in under 15 years.

    • …or under 20 years. Look how NZ companies have messed up Transmission Gully. If the Chinese had been building the road, we would have already been driving on it for a year!

  13. Just wait till the new cook strait ferries contract is announced, no doubt to be made in China from inferior steel, lead paint and asbestos.

  15. So where is your dear leader with her ‘captains call’?
    She has veto power over ANY ministers decision, or is Peter’s special and her excuse will be some bull shit about not being able to interfere/over rule another parties decision?
    Really is the Coalition of Losers, I only hope Greens and NZ 1st do not get to 5% this Sept.

    • Im right; – are you reading properly what happened to Kiwi Rail under National?s Government?????
      We would not have any rail if national would have gotten in AGAIN.
      No-one will vote more for national this year as their record on keeping our public assents is depression as they would have stripped all remaining assets the public had today so dream on.

    • ” She has veto power over ANY ministers decision ”
      No she doesn’t in a coalition governing arrangement , she has to negotiate and play to Winston’s ego and agenda and a couple of shots of whiskey on the ninth floor.
      And keep the Greens in a state of ignorance that their voice matters in policy formation.
      That is the realities of MMP

  16. Im right; – read this about your ‘National Party abysmal climate change history’
    Think again and vote for the Coalition Government to save our climate.

    POLITICS press release. Citizens Environmental Advocacy Centre. 4/6/20. CEAC Says -National Party Position On Climate Change Is Still Abysmal
    https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PO2006/S00039/ceac-says-national-party-position-on-climate-change-is-still-abysmal.htm

    Politics
    CEAC Says -National Party Position On Climate Change Is Still Abysmal
    Thursday, 4 June 2020, 2:21 pm
    Press Release: Citizens Environmental Advocacy Centre
    CEAC annual review of National Party climate change policy, makes miserable reading, and supports Government for elevating clean ‘Rail Transport’ over truck transport, for moving more freight onto rail, thereby keeping our CO2 ‘climate emissions’ at a far lower levels.
    Comparison between Government and opposition.
    Labour coalition policy is importantly keeping all our public highways /local roads safer by reducing road surface destruction trucks are causing immense road damages.- while forcing taxpayer costs to increase sharply paying for every day around our country, while Labour/NZ First have produced the new updated “National Rail strategy” which shows climate change leadership https://www.budget.govt.nz/budget/2019/wellbeing/transforming-economy/investing-in-rail.htm
    Contrast Labour/NZ First to National;
    National has vowed to scrap the RMA . https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/118223167/national-promises-to-repeal-and-replace-rma
    National Instead plan to build massive highways for more (dirty emissions of CO2 using truck freight. https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1912/S00153/national-to-deliver-on-housing-transport-and-infrastructure.htm
    National also are deliberately refusing to plan for rail freight, thereby are encouraging no rail freight to and from all provincial ports.
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/118223167/national-promises-to-repeal-and-replace-rma
    National promises to repeal and replace RMA, while Winston Peters and Phil Twyford as Minister of transport have been outlining the rail potential benefits in this new rail policy here; https://www.budget.govt.nz/budget/2019/wellbeing/transforming-economy/investing-in-rail.htm
    “Rail makes a vital contribution to urban public transport. Moving more freight by rail is economically efficient, and reduces carbon emissions as well as deaths and serious injuries on our roads.
    “Previous Governments have taken a hands-off approach and left rail in a state of managed decline.
    “That’s why we instigated the Future of Rail review to make sure we are taking a long-term, joined-up approach to rehabilitating rail.
    “Our New Zealand Rail Plan will outline the Government’s strategic vision and give a 10-year programme of indicative investments and benefits,”
    Phil Twyford says. KiwiRail will report on progress on implementing the Government’s vision for rail and further funding will be considered in Budget 2020.
    CEAC adds our support to Government for elevating clean ‘Rail Transport’ over truck transport, for moving more freight onto rail when considering the benefits; thereby keeping our CO2 ‘climate emissions’ at a far lower levels, potentially stabilising climate changing weather events, saving taxpayer spending, keeping all our public highways /local roads safer, reducing road surface destruction from trucks causing immense road/bridge surface damages, and saving taxpayer costs from rising from paying for every day on roads all around our country.

  17. This is a crazy rant by Bomber who is not doing journalism a favour.

    Fact check :

    Downer also foreign owned

    Fletchers is foreign owned (by major offshore shareholders) it has to apply for OIO approval when purchasing land.

    So what’s the story then?

    Labour-Greens is pro communist- socialists. Bomber should be loving Chinese involvement.

  18. WTF!!!! Who is responsible for giving this contract? Find out and check his or her bank balance for rakeoffs and handouts and special deals and see if there are suddenly appearing pretty good assets and overseas visits to sign up etc. What a rip-off – we in NZ are being bled by civil servants and appointees to agencies who are mountebanks. It is time that we paid attention to it and for a real moral panic at this continuing outrage of dodgy spending that is impoverishing us. I’m not suffering from hyperbole, this really is the pits.

  19. The competing New Zealand and overseas tenders were reportedly “very, very close” but cost played a determining factor.
    Haha. We weren’t born yesterday. We know that tenders can be manipulated. We also know that many are one on lower cost, and then halfway through an unprecedented problem that could not have been foreseen appears and up goes the price, this type of thing comes from huge corporations that should have skilled people and programs that can envisage every problem. We know that some of our infrastructure has been built with shoddy steel that would no doubt have been vital to keeping the price down and responsible, reasonably honest NZ companies out of the running.

  20. Fuck fletchers and fuck downer.Serves you right you greedy worthless fuckers!
    They’re the enemy btw morons.
    Go the Chinese. You’ll do a better job for a third the price.

  21. downers is australian owned and fletchers is a shadow of the company it used to be and is on track to be another jbl it really shows the state of the new zealand building industry and comes down to bad management over the decades and unless it turned around new zealand will be dependent on foreign companies for large projects

  22. Why on earth would you have an ex trucking company CEO as head of kiwirail I guess Greg millar must have conned Winnie to be his best friend.

    I remember one of the first things Winston Peters wanted to do was sack the board at Kiwirail!!!

    • Greg Miller was the GM of Toll Tranzlink which owned the railways prior to re-nationalization of it back in 2009 so was well experienced with the railway operation and was under his management became a very successful arm of Toll Tranzlink’s transport network which was one of the reasons that Labour was prepared to pay almost double ($690 mil) over its valuation ($369 mil).

      Its also worth remembering that Toll never wanted to sell the railways network due to its performance but simply wasn’t prepared as a private company to pay exorbitant amounts to subsidize ideologically driven expansion on parts of the network which were not profitable, never had been profitable and would never be profitable in the near future. The government then face the choice of if if they wanted to pursue their ideologly they would need to purchase the network and take on those risks themselves which is what they did.

      The current situation however is exactly the choices that Toll would have faced and interestingly they have chosen to follow pretty much the same course as Toll would have made eg outsourcing off shore vs building rolling stock locally. Around 2007-2008 the cost of upgrade wagons in the Hillside facility was roughlly 2/3’s the cost of buying new rolling stock from overseas.

  23. Wake up you PC buggers. Fletchers is not worth a sympathy vote. Downers is Aussy owned and not so long ago fletchers was being mis-managed, falling over, late on some projects and going over budget on others.
    We need more local competitors than just these two companies.

    Kiwirail having there own wee problems not so long ago and the rail infrastructure on its knees right now needs to bleed every dollar it can out of these transport stimulus packages to try and resurrect our rail.

    And even I am doutbful we will see any real results such as old mothballed lines reopening and more intercity rail which by the look of state highway 1 north of Auckland we kind of need.

    Kiwirail is a business bottom line and to survive it needs to make these decisions based on whats best for itself.

    God us PC bubble wrapped kiwi buggers have turned into whining bastards.

    • Neoliberal government policy, has destroyed most local companies in NZ over the years. I have no sympathy for Fletchers they are a joke and their shareholders are not necessary NZer’s. They have an ‘accounting’ strategy which means they lost all their expertise for building a long time ago and just rely on numbers and coffee meetings to build. Can go wrong, like Sky City.

      Having Chinese and high corruption related contracts is dangerous, if we don’t want our buildings and bridges falling down like in other countries where they have corruption…. https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/world/2020/04/08/bridge-collapses-italy-newest-crumbling-infrastructure/111525908/ https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/07/china/china-coronavirus-hotel-collapse/index.html and overseas companies,

      The push for the cheapest is led by gormless NZ bureaucrats, who are gonna rip NZ off and then leave us with a disaster while promoting themselves.

      NZ’s 20 year obsession with cheap bums on seats has destroyed most industry and expertise in NZ… now we have people everywhere who don’t know what they are doing, and the managers are the worst and just go for the cheapest option (with money changing hands on the side).

      We have the worst brain drain in the world and as our wages fall, it gets worse and worse.
      https://www.telegraph.co.uk/expat/expatnews/7973220/New-Zealand-brain-drain-worst-in-world.html

      Even the skilled migrant leave once, the family have permanent residency.

      A migrant friend who is an expert in construction has just left for Asian contacts…. financially all works because you get the wage from the labour, then the wife can then apply for social welfare for herself and the kids and mortgage support… you are better off splitting up in NZ on paper, than saying together, and you certainly can earn more overseas if you leave the country for work in most skilled industries.

      NZ replaces expert skills with laughable ‘essential’ skills like chefs, retail and burger workers and farm labourers… all known for their low wages and big union backing… and on the back of that, entire migrant families then come into NZ and access our social services and housing… after 2 years then they can get full welfare in most cases… and in many cases they qualify for full welfare like schooling and health carer for their children immediately.

      Meanwhile the bureaucrats and company executives are praising themselves for gutting their best workers and hiring cheap idiots in their place, while charging them out at the same rate. It works for a bit, then you go bankrupt or ask for more money to deliver something, then start again.

      Not just construction, everywhere from IT to social services… our elderly and disabled are being cared for by the cheapest anyone can find. Now bodies are turning in student halls, undiscovered by cleaning staff, education staff or anybody at the residency hall. While our IT is full of people who are inexperienced and unqualified and charged out at big rates…. and of course the resulting government IT scandals ensue, aka the police gun owners details being exposed, the fake ‘treasury hack’, WINZ details being available…. that’s just the ones they discover…

    • Realist
      The trouble is Realist that we thinkers search for what is realand care about our country and all of us people living here, spend a bit of time whining, and a lot of time thinking and discussing about how to do things better. That doesn’t make us bastards, I don’t know about you though.

  24. Many great comments above-and for once there is a clear cut answer-Sack the Kiwirail CEO and his minions, and establish a 21st century MOW.

    In the longer term the whole SOE model needs sacking also. Structural elements of neo liberalism such as the State Sector Act need to go. The State should not allow penetration of the people’s infrastructure by private capital.

  25. @ Greywarbler

    Yep, our wages are low, but no problem to profiteer on the side for many Bureaucrats….

    Former Auckland Council worker and businessman admit bribery scandal
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/premium/news/article.cfm?c_id=1504669&objectid=12311748

    Council manager guilty of majority of corruption charges
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11763594

    Witness: Truck driver’s licences for bribes – no need to turn up for test
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/108896521/man-who-took-bribes-for-drivers-licence-scam-takes-witness-stand

    Punjabi singer gets home detention for drivers’ licences bribes
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/365583/punjabi-singer-gets-home-detention-for-drivers-licences-bribes

    Bribes for driver licences: Deportation order issued for star witness
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/auckland/114283545/bribes-for-driver-licences-deportation-order-issued-for-star-witness-and-youtube-sensation

    And government donations and contracts…

    Chinese businessman Yikun Zhang’s donations go beyond Simon Bridges
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/107902444/auckland-and-southland-mayors-receive-handouts-from-chinese-businessman-yikun-zhang

    Southland mayor in China with ‘$100k donor’
    https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/southland/southland-mayor-china-100k-donor

    Foreign Affairs minister Murray McCully denies link between party donation and Niue contract
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/79029273/foreign-affairs-minister-murray-mccully-denies-link-between-party-donation-and-niue-contract?rm=m

    Saudi sheep deal: Govt accused of cover-up
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/election/2017/09/saudi-sheep-deal-govt-accused-of-cover-up.html

    Skycity to build a new convention centre
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skycity_Auckland

    Funny enough, as countries become more corrupt, you can’t get anything done, or it fails and buildings/bridges start falling down..

    • savenz
      A useful fount of information as always thanks.
      That point about corruption. It seems a tangled web, because in some cases if you ‘gift’ the right person you get near immediate action. And it can be like tipping, usually in advance. I liked the story about the NZ who went back to Italy after WW2 to do something for the locals who as partisans had hidden him from the Germans. They lived in a hilly area, and to get water had to walk up and down a steep path. He did negotiations with all concerned and water pipes from the spring came to the town square. But at the end the local administrator said hesitantly that all the people in the office expected the usual gratuity to add to their not high wages. It was expected and he himself would be blamed as ineffective if he didn’t provide it. As the NZr had used most of his money, they talked and came to an agreement that would be largely symbolic but acceptable and some bottles of wine sufficed. But when it is part of a system, a little bit of corruption, bribery, helps to move the project along.

  26. BTW – if they took the wage subsidy they are supposed to keep the workers for 1 year.. so I hope the government asks for their wage subsidy back from companies that make people redundant as soon as the wage subsidy finishes…

    Coronavirus: Up to 1080 jobs on the line across The Warehouse, Noel Leeming and Warehouse Stationery
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/121752684/coronavirus-up-to-1080-jobs-on-the-line-across-the-warehouse-noel-leeming-and-warehouse-stationery

  27. Realist I could not have said it any better.
    Fletchers and Downers have been taking this country two steps forward and one step back for too long with there monopolize stranglehold & shoddy workmanship.
    There used to be an old clause in contracts “in a tradesman like manner”. They would not even know what it meant.
    If we had any good investigative journalist left in this country there is a story/ movie there for all to see.

  28. One more thing…
    fletchers has been dipping into our farmers pockets for years because that’s where our money comes from. Skimming off the cream aided and abetted by a cadre of bent minions in politics and hangers on within associate industries.
    hugh fletcher burrowed into under our skin decades ago to manipulate and manoeuvre our economy to best suit himself and his mates.
    sir hugh. The last fucker you’d want anywhere near a public infrastructure.
    Fletcher Challenge
    Main article: Fletcher Challenge
    “Fletcher played a major role in developing New Zealand industry as chief executive of Fletcher Challenge following in the footsteps of his father and grandfather Sir James Fletcher.
    Fletcher was a New Zealand Representative on the Trilateral Commission. In 2002, he was appointed to the board of the Reserve Bank of New Zealand. He was subsequently reappointed in 2007.[4] He is also Chair of the board of directors of IAG New Zealand and a board director of Fletcher Building and Vector Limited.[5] In August 2007 he was appointed to the board of Insurance Australia Group.[6] ”
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugh_Fletcher

    The only people who should be involved in the advancement and maintenance of our rail infrastructure is us.
    We, the citizens of AO/NZ. It was ours, it should returned to us and we must make sure no privateer gets their sticky little fingers on it ever again.
    One of the more maddening things for me on that level is to see where our railways used to run when out driving. But they were pulled up and disappeared.
    Mainfreight for example…? You’re doing all right though aye boys?
    And I’m sure, so are these smiling little fleas.
    https://www.natroad.co.nz/Category?Action=View&Category_id=98

  29. UN agenda 2030. Nz is a parliamentary dictatorship.

    How does that even make sense?. More funneling of funds offshore to remove the middle class. At a time like now that is huge!.

  30. MOW/genuine New Zealanders built most of our most important assets,then the filth that was the Labour government of 84 basically gave it away,then under the Clarke Labour government they brought assets back from their foreign mates at extortionate rates.

    Never mind Fletchers and Downer Edi,Fletchers played a large part in the corrupt Rogernomics fiasco,its tainted and should be nationalised as a punishment for its predatory behaviour.

    Dont forget Fletchers role in the Ihumatao land dispute either,anybody who supports this scandalous corporate needs to reflect on its history.

  31. I,am a anz first voter and a lot of my friends are as well.after reading about the rail tender going to the Chinese and SA companies plus all the money that has been distributed to keep workers in NZ with money to help with their expenses and the government trying to raise employment for the people that lost jobs a d I presume this tender would have employed at least a couple of hundred NZers.All I can say is that I’m glad we are having an election soon

  32. people need to do the research downers can’t deliver the project they dont have the experience or the right staff not in New Zealand they would have to bring over staff from oz and then we will have another T.G on our hands

  33. At the end of the day. Kiwirail is a business it MUST run like any business. In the real world of business “MONEY talks and bullshit walks.” That’s all there is to it.

  34. https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/nz-taxpayer-owned-farm-sold-chinese-upsets-fiordland-locals-v1?fbclid=IwAR3pEEyEHxlslhWThXoDxnJY-6yStV5Gq3QXGfAhdRMw1HY8V-yCgA9kHsY

    NZ taxpayer owned farm sold to Chinese, upsets Fiordland locals

    ANDREA VANCE, 1 NEWS POLITICAL REPORTER
    APR 28, 2017 • SOURCE: 1 NEWS
    The Government’s farmer Landcorp is selling a Fiordland station to a Chinese buyer.

    NZ taxpayer owned farm sold to Chinese upsets Fiordland localsPlay Video03:24
    A Kiwi buyer wanted the farm, near Te Anau, but Chinese buyer offered best price. Source: 1 NEWS
    ONE News has learned the overseas investor outbid a local farmer to buy Jericho station, about 40km from Te Anau.

    The Southland farmer had offered around $8.5 million for the sheep and beef operation, which is almost 1400ha.

    The Overseas Investment Office will now have to sign off the sale, because farmland is deemed “sensitive”.

    Landcorp chief executive Steve Carden confirmed the sale.

    “We have got a buyer from offshore who has put in the most attractive bid and that is the one we are pursuing at the moment,” he said.

    It’s the first time Landcorp has sold a farm to an overseas investor.

    We want to make sure that we are giving local buyers every opportunity – Landcorp chief executive Steve Carden
    “I think over the course of the last 30 years we have sold 80 odd farms. Only once – this current situation – has it gone to an overseas buyer so it’s very, very rare that it happens…there aren’t always competitive local bids for our farms and we do need to look at overseas options if that is the case,” Mr Carden said.

    The state-owned enterprise has eight other sheep, beef and deer farms up for sale around the country as it looks to diversify its operations.

    Iwi have been offered first refusal on all of them.

    Mr Carden says Landcorp has to get the best deal for the taxpayer.

    “We want to make sure that we are giving local buyers every opportunity we can to make a competitive bid and we work with local buyers quite significantly on that to help them – but once the process is finished we need to make the best decision for the business.”

    And Federated Farmers agree.

    It should be able to be farmed by New Zealanders – Eugenie Sage, Green Party Primary Industries spokeswoman
    “Landcorp is a commercial operation so it has every right to sell a farm to whoever they want, but within the constraints of the Overseas Investment Office.”

    But the Green Party says only residents and citizens should be allowed to purchase farm land.

    Primary Industries spokeswoman Eugenie Sage said: “The result of our weak laws is this land – more than 1300 ha – is going to an offshore person. It should be able to be farmed by New Zealanders so that we maintain the basis of our primary industry in New Zealand ownership and we can get the benefits of that locally.”

    New Zealand

    So according to these clowns, sensitive and prime NZ farming land is in the best long term interests of the NZ taxpayer to be in the hands of Chinese owners. FFS, what happened to supporting Kiwi’s? The epitome of selling the goose that laid the golden egg.

    Treason =

    treason
    /ˈtriːz(ə)n/
    Learn to pronounce
    noun

    the action of betraying someone or something.
    plural noun: treasons
    “doubt is the ultimate treason against faith”
    Similar:
    treachery
    lese-majesty
    disloyalty
    betrayal

    • Weirdly most of the big wage subsidies also seem to be supporting overseas business interests like Silver Fern Farms, 50% Chinese owned, and Harvey Norman OZ owned….

      Air NZ which refused to refund it’s customers when they cancelled their flights for Covid, is typical of the NZ rip off system that expects their business to be outside consumer laws unlike other countries https://www.caa.co.uk/News/UK-Civil-Aviation-Authority-reviewing-airline-refunds/and funny enough Air NZ pays high wages to it’s executives (4.2 million to Luxon) who rip off their customers… while making huge redundancies of the people who seems to know what they are doing. (pilots, safety executives).

      Someone told me the Air NZ pilots were going on to become real estate agents apparently… well it seems more secure these days than actually being an expert in something real… so in a few months we can expect Air NZ management to be moaning about how they can’t get skilled staff in NZ… and demanding visas for overseas pilots at half the price.

      After all in our race to the bottom, airlines don’t have to worry about disappearing their passengers anymore, already happened… https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysia_Airlines_Flight_370 and corporations don’t have to worry about making planes that can fly correctly when the bean counters are more important than the engineers… and the regulators are easily duped https://qz.com/1776080/how-the-mcdonnell-douglas-boeing-merger-led-to-the-737-max-crisis/

      Personally when I heard Air NZ’s ex Walmart chief who doesn’t know much about airlines but does know about cheap products that kill it seems https://edition.cnn.com/2019/09/03/business/walmart-ends-handgun-ammo-sales/index.html, Ao no surprises when the first step was to make redundant the safety executive at Air NZ…

      well I’m not sure I’ll be flying Air NZ anyway….

      Bye, bye, Air NZ trusted brand and reputation!

      Maybe the new idea is Air NZ is a new Easy jet type running 1.5 billion people with Meth and Moneylaunderings between China and NZ with a drop off at Skycity… I’m sure it is a mouthwatering image to the shareholders who are addicted to that quick share market price rush, for the next well used brainyac exec idea… cheap, cheap, cheaper….

      and when it goes south, or even before that, expect the consumers and the government taxes to prop your business up!

      Bit like Fonterra, not too concerned when their business partners kill and injure babies overseas… all part of international business these days apparently… https://www.dairyreporter.com/Article/2014/06/20/Fonterra-never-checked-Sanlu-s-products-in-China-melamine-scare-Study In spite of being partners in the milk scandal, Fonterra management did not seem to care about the deaths and continued with more disastrous Chinese partnerships… https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/102441305/fonterra-half-year-loss-of-348m-after-beingmate-writedown-of-405m

      So not sure why citizens in NZ should pay taxes at all, at this rate? It used to go to our health care, schools and infrastructure that used to work, now it goes to overseas business and our infrastructure never gets built and then then doesn’t work properly… seriously didn’t the Roman’s build roads that lasted for a millennia…

      Hate to think what sort of lead/asbestos etc is now in our drain pipes… they already allow lead taps here in NZ with our cheap is best self regulation on imports https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/property/108409051/plumbers-call-on-govt-to-stop-tapware-with-unsafe-levels-of-lead, let the health system sort it out, once we take our profit, approaches to public safety….

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