You fight Shane Jones by ignoring him, not giving him oxygen

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Minister Shane Jones floats plans of an NZ First anti-immigration policy ahead of the election

Senior New Zealand First Minister Shane Jones is teasing details of an anti-immigration election promise, as his war of words with the Indian migrant community ramps up.

The outspoken MP and Minister of Regional Economic Development said he will be pitching a policy plan to his MP colleagues this weekend which would involve “campaigning unstintingly next year on a population policy”.

“In the last five years, we have added nigh on half a million people to our population,” he told RNZ.

Sigh – by screaming racist, activists have walked right into Shane Jones trap. This bloke banter routine with the ill judged backlash has just ensured NZ First are guaranteed to get over the 5% threshold.

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Most NZers will feel that there isn’t anything wrong with enforcing Immigration rules that stipulate a person lives with someone before they are married to prove the relationship is real so will see attacks on Jones as a lack of gratitude towards the host country rather than proof positive he dons Klan robes.

Personally I think Immigration NZ should take into account arranged marriages, but by accusing Jones of being  racist, it’s empowered him to insert himself directly into the fertile Immigration voting pool where no one else dares to tread.

It’ll be difficult for NZ First to stay under double digits if Jones is allowed to play the falsely accused victim.

Sigh.

You fight Shane Jones by ignoring him, not feeding him news oxygen.

 

35 COMMENTS

  1. 1000+ migrants per week is eminently sustainable, Wokester, and will not lead to the dissolution of society in any way, shape or form…

    • Trouble is one migrant usually brings four others as family members so we need to control ‘per head’ count not “Migrant” number.

    • Indeed (sarcasm intended). So lets address the problems that are causing it. Do away with ONE bullshitting ‘agent’ (as opposed to genuine immigration lawyer or his employees he/she overseea), linked to some shoddy tertiary institution or labour hire firm, and you do away with half a dozen or many more rorting a completely stupid system designed to exploit.
      Don’t penalise its victims – that’s tantamount to pretty- legalised trafficking and encourages the idea that people are merely economic units serving a neoliberal agenda.
      There hasn’t been proper oversight in a while, whether its oversight of tertiary education ( “speak to our Comms people” – NZQA), of shoddy agents (IAA), or labour exploitaion (LI), and INZ has proven itself to be quite useless. Worsened by a mega Munstry whose primary focus (and culture) is towards promoting an economic growth agenda – stupid outdated ANSCO skill shortage lists et al.
      Just like other agencies, the trick is to under-resource, staff it with a contingent of ex-copper, ‘we-know-best’, ‘respect-my-authority’ enforcers, and with high staff turnover as a result. Thankfully, they might now be getting the message – but possibly way too late.
      And if that’s woke – so be it

      • Awesome OWT. Immigrant bashers are just another arm of the neoliberal narrative which always requires a class of people to hate on and blame so as to distract from focusing on the real destroyers who are the billionaire class. It is impossible to be of this class and at the same time have concern for humanity beyond whats in it for themelves. The likes of savenz and cleangreen are happily doing the work for these people. From the always excellent Craig Murray

        “For a decade Nigel Farage has been flung into our living rooms continually by the BBC. Even when UKIP barely registered a blip in the opinion polls, he was a regular on Question Time and the other news, current affairs and politics programme. Farage’s celebrity was a BBC creation. He served an important purpose. At a time when the wealth gap was growing exponentially, and working conditions and real incomes of ordinary people were deteriorating sharply, Farage helped amplify the Establishment message that the cause of these problems was not the burgeoning class of billionaires sucking up the world’s resources, but rather the poor immigrants also scratching to make a living.

        Having undermined the prospects of a left wing reaction to massively increasing inequality, Farage has now served his purpose.”

        On this site we have savenz and cleangreen vomiting vitriol every time the issue of immigrants comes up. They pretend concern for ordinary nzers but with this kind of hatred directed at a whole class of people (collective punishment anybody?) I wouldn’t trust them with my dog.
        The system has been set up to provide a desperate class of people to do whatever is on offer. And we live in that system and benefit from others misery and savenz reckons we should just hate on these people. Citing all the newspaper articles about various crimes is just ridiculous. Most people would realise that poor and desperate people are always over represented in crime statistics. Using these would be the sames as saying Palestinians are all criminals because they fill Israeli jails. You just gotta be sucking on some serious shit to every day post examples of immigrants breaking the law and think this makes them some kind of criminal class. But Savenz just goes happily along in that neo liberal way.

        https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2019/10/the-incredible-disappearing-farage-and-other-electoral-oddities/

        • I see you have deliberately compartmentalized several different issues to suit your peculiar style of logic. Fact is, we were never asked about mass immigration , nor were the effects on our infrastructure ever mentioned, – it was less than surreptitiously put on us whether we had objections or not.

          No ones hating on or blaming anyone. We simply do not wish to see this ongoing out of control of mass immigration continue. That’s what you get when you just arrogantly ignore and fail to consult a population, – a backlash. Not against any one individual , – but a political backlash none the same.

          And this latest is a symptom of that. I have several relatives who are either married to Chinese or Indian spouses. And even they say immigration has gone overboard.

          How many times does it have to be spelt out that it was PRECISELY BECAUSE of neo liberalism and their desire for a cheap pool of non unionized workers, – workers who will work for below the standard rate and drag wages down , that people are becoming resentful.

          How many times do you have to be reminded that our health and education systems are groaning under the weight of all these new arrivals, – to say nothing of the chronic housing shortages… while we have schools and hospitals that are dilapidated, state housing that is falling down around our ears… large unemployment figures for our OWN young people, – yet we continue to import people by the tanker load.

          Instead of ranting on about Nigel Farage, why not come clean and be honest about the fact that ALL of the above is a direct consequence of three decades of failed neo liberal experimentation and globalism in this country.

          INCLUDING out of control immigration !!!

          Or does it just make you feel better to assume the false moral high ground and go on your bender and accuse others of being useful idiots for neo liberals when you cant even recognize neo liberalism and its symptoms and effects yourself?

          Pah !

          • And you can continue to ignore the fact that immigrants are NOT the reason all our services are groaning under the weight of underinvestment. Not sure the exact population of NZ but believe it is still under 5 million. Still an eminently manageable number. We choose to under invest in health and educarion because we consider things like submarine hunting airplanes to be more important. Or tax cuts for the rich or corporate welfare to the likes of the aluminium smelter. Hating on immigrants or ending immigration wont mean more money spent on these. If you believe this then you dont understand neoliberalism. Its a religion that doesnt respond to logic.

  2. howdie Castro ,

    we have 40,000 people homeless , kiwi build not happening ,14000 waiting for emergency housing , infrastucture gridlock . and you say its sustainable to jam some more in do you ?

    we cant even house the people we have got .common sense would tell me that until we are able to ,

    all immigration beyond our commitment to those in dire need should stop .

    when we are sorted then we could look at bringing in more immigrants .or not .

    • Hola Compadre,

      You may want to re-read my comment, and see the sarcasm; allow me to spell it out for you: the neo-colonial immigration levels in No Zealand are going to lead to the breakdown of civil society (and the economy) and probably civil war…

    • Immigrants are brought in to do low paid work that nzers can’t or wont do. This is an example of market forces being God until said market forces might cost the capitalist some extra money. Then they stamp their feet and rant on about lazy nzers and fruit rotting on trees or unmilked cows until some poli does something.
      You will find that Shane Jones will be front of the queue when it comes to supplying cheap migrant labour to these feet stompers but also front of queue when making sure that none of the conditions of housing or family or community that we would demand are supplied. If the fruit was left to rot until conditions and pay attracted labour we woud not need migrants and resources such as land would be put to uses that did attract workers. Or are market forces, like Gods only invoked when they are on your side?

      • You mean immigrants like Gary Lin, who started a property empire with 200K from Daddy? People like that? Kiwis wold do most of those jobs if the property market were affordable…

  3. Turn it around and have an expat kiwi standing on a street corner in Mumbai or Delhi crying about how their immigration rights aren’t being upheld. A billion Indians would laugh in their face.

    • Not sure what your point is here… We are supposed to treat people according to how some idiot thinks he would be treared by them?

  4. Agree with all the comments above:

    ….and ‘Arranged Marriages'( who does this benefit exactly in patriarchal societies?
    …not the women or the girls who have no power but are traded and exploited like cattle!…even abused and murdered)
    …this issue is certainly sorting the real feminists from the PRETENDERS

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12123831

    ….this is NOT what New Zealand women and feminists have fought for long and hard all these years when they have fought for their rights and to make New Zealand an egalitarian society.

    Jacinda Adern is no real feminist nor is she a working class New Zealander without a house …but some form of opportunist Wokie…probably influenced by the neo-pseudo ‘Greens’…bending over to appear super globalist cool and non racist ( they would prefer to be misogynist and undermine New Zealand women and girls and New Zealand egalitarian culture )

    It would seem that once politicians get voted in, the power and the excessive salaries goes to their heads and they lose all loyalty to the New Zealanders, especially women and girls, who voted them in and our New Zealand culture. The politicians blinded by their overseas travel and feted and hobnobbing with the international elite (who want NZ for sale) become bought globalists and chauvinists

    Unless NZF captures the lost votes …people are walking away from Labour and the Greens …and this coalition is a dead duck…and then GOD Save New Zealand!

  5. Agree with all the comments above:

    ….and ‘Arranged Marriages'( who does this benefit exactly in patriarchal societies?
    …not the women or the girls who have no power but are traded and exploited like cattle!…even abused and murdered)
    …this issue is certainly sorting the real feminists from the PRETENDERS

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12123831

    ….this is NOT what New Zealand women and feminists have fought for long and hard all these years when they have fought for their rights and to make New Zealand an egalitarian society.

    Jacinda Adern is no real feminist nor is she a working class New Zealander without a house …but some form of opportunist Wokie…probably influenced by the neo-pseudo ‘Greens’…bending over to appear super globalist cool and non racist ( they would prefer to be misogynist and undermine New Zealand women and girls and New Zealand egalitarian culture )

    It would seem that once politicians get voted in, the power and the excessive salaries goes to their heads and they lose all loyalty to the New Zealanders, especially women and girls, who voted them in and our New Zealand culture. The politicians blinded by their overseas travel and feted and hobnobbing with the international elite (who want NZ for sale) become bought globalists and chauvinists

    Unless NZF captures the lost votes …people are walking away from Labour and the Greens …and this coalition is a dead duck…and then GOD Save New Zealand!

  6. Imagine how wealthy the workers in this country would be if the population was still 3 million like 20 years ago. As more labour has been imported real wages have fallen. Who profits from immigration bosses and new arrivals willing to undercut residents existing standard of living.

    Seriously is it not too much to ask that new immigrants don’t bring their parents, to burden the health and welfare system.

    New Zealand culture is about couples in loving relationships. Arranged marriage is not a part of New Zealand culture so we have no need to accomodate such a custom. Arranged marriage with an overseas bride or groom is wide open to immigration abuse. There is nothing stopping someone who wants an arranged marriage to arrange to have an arranged marriage with someone who is already in New Zealand.

    A population cap of 5 million is an excellent policy for a sustainable environment. Why would anyone want to overpopulate these beautiful pacific islands. Having not too many people living here is one New Zealands greatest attributes. My overseas relatives were incredulaous to learn you can go to a beach in New Zealand and be the only person there. Lets keep it that way. Cap the tourist visitor numbers at 5 million too.

    • I think you might have things a bit arse about face. Imagine how wealthy we would be if we hadnt sold everything off to people whose only concern was making a quick buck. Imagine how wealthy we would have been if these same people in the pusuit of ever more profit and in the face of reluctance from the native population to work for a pittance at dull and dreary jobs had not concieved of importing migrant labour from countries where wages were even lower to jobs where they could only work for the employer who brought them in a situation reminiscent of slavery? Imagine how wealthy we would be if instead of hating on these people we had stood beside them and demanded that if you are going to bring in these people you must first build them houses to live in and give them the same conditions as we enjoy. And if then the people who bought up our country decided nah its not worth it to bring them in we would still be little old nz with 3million people. Immigrants were brought here by the slimeballs that bought our country. They destroyed it, not the immigrants. But all the slimeball wannabes just find it a whole lot more gratifying to blame immigrants for their inability to get into the slimeball class

  7. Ignore him? (and hope it goes away?)
    Have to disagree with you and Shane’s disciples on this.
    If Shane wanted a pissing competition, he’d have been better off directing his stream at the neo-liberal masters of the universe in the dysfunctional parts of our public service.
    Instead, he’s gone full Peter Dutton – even introducing the “queue jumper’ meme into the lexicon -as well as referring to people as ‘activists’ that don’t agree with his view of the world.
    And just like other battles (including your own well-earned win), best not get all hopey hopey changey changey in the expectation it all work out just fine and dandy of its own accord.
    Most of the gains he claims (such as the growth fund and reinvigorating rail) could and would have happened anyway by way of Uncle Winnie, and which coincidentally fit reasonably well with other coalition partners. (I seem to remember = for example – wanting to extend Kinleith to Taupo way way back, not to mention Northland)
    Like Trump, and Dutton and a growing number of others, exceptionalism and bloated egos are not really that pretty a sight to my mind even if they do play to what he perceives as his constituents.

  8. Nope, disagree with Matyn and agree with Jones on this one.

    We are a sovereign nation and guess what – we call the shots. If people do not like our culture or our laws they do no have to come here. Its pretty simple, really , other nations do the same to us. This issue is two – threefold,- one is concerning arranged marriages and our current laws, the other is the huge number immigrating to these shores. Yet another is the strain put on our infrastructure already after 3 decades of dilapidation caused by neo liberalism.

    A fourth can be argued in the degraded wages caused by neo liberalism and its ‘contract’ foundation , and the ensuing destruction of viable Trade Unions caused by Ruth Richardson and her legacy , – and the fact that many of these immigrants have no notion whatsoever of Trade Unionism.

    In light of 650,000 people ( a massive cut in population in a country of , at the time, 3000,000 ) permanently leaving NZ for Australia in the early 1990’s…

    It is not hard to see that the real motives of these globalist neo liberals was to import a constant source of immigrants from predominantly non Unionized nations to provide cheap workers ,- and not for any particular sense of egalitarian, or some humanistic utopia where we all hug each other , sing Kum Ba Yah , and swoon over the joys of multiculturalism.

    • Sorry but your hating and blaming on immigrants Is very much in line with globalist neoliberal strategy. Both immigrants AND hating on immigrants are a requirement just as both slavery AND hating on slaves used to be a requirement

      • No hate there Guv, – just your assumptions and liberal amounts of judgment’s of your own particular brand. And I think you’ve got your wires firmly crossed on this one if you don’t know what globalism and neo liberal ideology truly are.

        And like I said in another post ,- since WHEN was this country NOT multicultural?

        I think the difference that lies between you and me is that I believe in a nations sovereignty , its own laws , honest dialogue between the electorate and their elected officials , and observing and having respect for local custom , – and you don’t.

        You don’t go to communist China for example and kick up a storm as a recent immigrant and start demanding law changes to suit yourself , – especially if you know full well it is not common practice in the country you wish to settle in. Speak to some family members of the Falun Gong to see what treatment is dished out to them if they do. And they aren’t even immigrants.

        So why should any group who are immigrating here feel so entitled ? Do some immigrant’s view us as a soft touch? A soft cushion whereby once a critical mass has been reached they can now start agitating and going full in the face of the peoples of their adopted new country?

        The old saying’ When in Rome , do as the Romans do’…

        As Jones said, – if you don’t like it, don’t come here. There’s plenty of country’s to choose from.

        That’s pretty basic logic.

        And btw- when exactly were the NZ population consulted or even asked if they wanted all this out of control immigration?

        Answer : We weren’t. It was simply foisted upon us by arrogant political ideologues whose long term goal was to create a privatized Shang ri la whereby workers worked for slave wages and could be laid off , sacked or dismissed at will. A little bit like the slaves you accuse me of endorsing.

        And guess what ?, – those arrogant political ideologues were none other than the very neo liberals you seem to have no clue about. Try reading up about 1984 and the 4th Labour govt, then about the Bolger- led National govt.

        You just might learn something.

        • I think you miss the point. Probably deliberately. I’m not advocating for immigration and certainly not for more. I’m pointing out that the immigrants themselves are people that once here deserve to be treated as people. They dont need to become a subclass that gets the blame for every ill in the country. Shut the door sure. But the likes of Shane Jones wont do that because regional develooement requires cheap labour dont you know??

          • And no ones treating them as a sub class, ‘ dont you know?’… we are saying that some customs are not acceptable to our customs and are being used in many cases as a rort to gain citizenship, – secondly how can you say Jones and NZ First wont shut the door to cheap immigrant labour that undermines NZ citizens wages and condition?

            For one they are the junior partner in the coalition, therefore they cannot determine policys over and above Labour.

            Secondly , do you really seek to tell us that NZ First and its regional concerns want ever more cheap immigrant labour that will further impoverish Northland for example?

            Surely even you can see that would be shitting all over the very people they rely on to gain entry into parliament.

            I think your crusade for immigrants veers far too much towards the woke component of the ‘ Left’. Its not even realistic and deny’s the very issues that have been under your nose for… actually decades. So you think enabling immigrants in by the tankerload is OK and has nothing to do the malaise this country is now in, or you agree with the neo liberals that ‘ the more the merrier’ and all those cheap workers help to pay more taxes and deflect from the fact the corporate’s can pay less.. I see.

            I think your main failing is ignorance of the fact and denial of the principle of’ clean up your own backyard first’. In this case BEFORE you open the floodgates for immigrants from poor regions to come here on false pretenses of a better lifestyle and higher wages , housing and education and then leaving them to be exploited unscrupulously.

            And in that manner, – you come across as someone who is fine with bogus degrees, fake jobs and visa’s that rely on ruthless bosses.

            So who really,… is the one who is anti immigrant now?

            • Is

              some customs are not acceptable to our customs and are being used in many cases as a rort to gain citizenship,

              some kind of gibberish? Who exactly is the “we”? You and nz first? Or you and your neighbour over the back fence.

              And its not the immigrants that lower the wages, its the people that cry an inabilIty to get anyone to do their menial underpaid work so pressure the likes of Shane Jones to be allowed to bring them in. You obviously havent noticed who picks fruit or looks after the veges in the glaring sun or milks the cows. In the regions too since theres not a lot of space for cows and orchards in an urban environment. They bring in the labour rubber stamped by Jones with the express purpose of keeping wages low. That seems to be hard to get through to you. Jones is in the pocket of big business. They are his masters and call the shots. If you think that when push comes to shove he will give a toss what you think then you are a little short on thinking faculties. All the likes of Shane Jones cares about is persuading the likes of you to consent to being governed in an ever more authoritarian manner. Oh and yes always very convenient being in a coalition government so you can claim oh but my hands were tied. Never mind. I might not have been able to shut the floodgates but oh boy did we really make those dirty immigrants lives hell!

              Yes, yes dear the woke side of the left. You know, they are the ones who say they’re on the left but dont agree with the things we say dear. Yes, we just call them wokies. Its a bit of a jokie but you see dear once we label them woke its like a little sign that says theyre not one of us dear.

              Sorry but youll struggle to find anywhere where I’ve said we should have tankerloads of immigrants or even container loads or small ferries.

              And in case you havent read what I wrote above, no I dont think they are to blame for ANY malaise we currently have in this country. Neoliberal austerity is to blame and the associated choices made with our country, our economy and our lives. Migrants didn’t sell our country into the hands of the Fays and Richwytes. They didnt make us hand over all our banking assets to the Australians so that 3 or 4 billion leaves the country every year. They didn’t make us pay for sub hunting aircraft to the tune of $1billion, that was your mates in nzfirst who now cry poverty. And migrants didnt make us commit to fiscal restraint or lower taxes for the rich and increase them on the poor. That was us. The nzers who you are soooo proud of we all just want to bust because we believed every promise made by snake oil salesmen. And now you just want to go on believing more from the likes of Shane in the pocket of big business Jones.
              Yes, we sure do need to clean up our own back yard before we go all out on trashing other cultures. First, how come nzers are so gullible to believe that big business has our interests at heart? Second, how is it that we can be so really proud of our system of arranging marriage when we have world leading domestic violence. We dont even think about it I spose must be it. Go out get drunk wind up in bed with someone sitting next to you and thats that. At least the other type of arranged marriage knows their names first and probably met their families. But no. Youre right. Our customs are so very precious and dear to us…

  9. Yes wild katipo your right we cannot tell those countries what to do they will give us the one finger salute as they have done for the free trade agreement in the process of trying to be signed. Yet we have them over here bleating cause our policy doesn’t suit their culture well too fucken bad the polices haven’t suited our Maori culture either and it taken 200 years for incremental change.

  10. Bomber there is not much i disagree with you on but this is one of them.

    I think Jones will see a lot of support for this and could be a turning point in coalition relationships.

    I think that Adern has made a mistake here and it may precipitate an earlier election than was planned.

    Watch this space.

  11. Auckland Indian Association president Narendra Bhana, said it was unbelievable Immigration NZ did not understand the cultural differences at play, and it felt like Indians were being punished. “It’s not like Kiwi culture where you live together for three, four or five years and then get married – it doesn’t work like that in India. I find this ridiculous considering Indian men/women come to NZ have relationships with New Zealanders and have children (without marriage living ” kiwi culture”). Some of the relationships don’t last long (probably due to arranged marriages already set up in India) Immigration NZ has systems if the criteria for partnership visa isn’t met; there are OTHER VISAS to consider.

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