Friday’s historic climate change march puts the National Party, ACT, NZ First, Hosking, Garner, Kiwiblog and every other climate denier & minimiser on the wrong side of history – tremble at our fury – there is no going back after this climate protest.
This is what democracy looks like.
This is what democracy sounds like.
The fear of 3.5% of NZ taking to the streets amongst the Right is as understandable as it is impotent.
Right wing trolls on Twitter have attacked the percentage as meaningless…
…unfortunately for this right wing Troll, 3.5% IS the magic number…
The 3.5% rule: How a small minority can change the world
Nonviolent protests are twice as likely to succeed as armed conflicts – and those engaging a threshold of 3.5% of the population have never failed to bring about change.
…and hard right Troll, Judith Collins has been quick to denigrate the protestors by claiming climate change is a hoax…
…Like the way Kauri contractors grow out of cutting oil pipelines Judith?
The fear from the older generation who have a culturally vested reason to deny climate change is understandable because the end of old white boomers running things is rapidly approaching.
As Bernard Hickey has pointed out many times, 2023 is the first election when Gen X, Gen Y and Millennials will numerically outnumber Boomers, and the millisecond we have the democratic majority at the ballot box, their boomer privilege ends.
Climate change is as much a class issue as it is a generation war, and the fear many felt as 170 000 took to the streets this week is well placed. The Hoskings, the Garners, the Judiths – do all you may because once we have that democratic majority, we will end your denial.
The radical changes to the political, cultural and economic system are coming whether the National Party deniers like it or not.
My personal favourite sign from the march?
This one.
By 2023, we will have the numerical numbers at the ballot box and we will no longer have to pander to climate denial boomer interests.
You have been warned.
As long as China does nothing (which is responsible for well over 25% of all global CO2 emissions with India rapidly rising – 300 million Indians don’t even have electricity), this is a total waste of time. Keep in mind New Zealand represents just 0.1% of greenhouse gas emissions and the whole planet breathes the same air. Anything we do (e.g. cutting cow numbers) will simply be off-shored to somewhere else (e.g. Argentina, the U.S., Canada, Poland etc) while global demand remains the same. If global demand can be somehow lowered, then the market will automatically adjust regardless of what NZ does or doesn’t do. New Zealand climate screamers just aren’t thinking this through – we have exactly zero influence over other nations, so at best we’ll be shooting ourselves in the foot by doing “the right thing” causing needless local impoverishment while achieving nothing of global consequence.
Nitrium your climate denial keeps us all amused, I’ve enjoyed how it’s developed over the years as the weight of evidence keeps piling up atet you are wrong. Early Nitrium just screamed it was all a hoax, but you are smart enough to appreciate that infowars style of denial doesn’t work, so Minimiser Nitrium plays the ‘we are too small to matter’ card. Where this falls down however is your failure to appreciate that catastrophic climate change will be damaging those other countries at rates far worse than us, because NZ effectively becomes one of the few places where a temperate climate to grow things resides. Our move to a sustainable system is required because the hegemonic global superstructure will collapse. That what makes the change more than virtue signalling, it will become a matter of survival.
😉 – I really do appreciate your platform Martyn (not being facetious – I’m very much a socialist wrt to pretty much anything except Climate Change). An additional point: I still have yet to hear anyone acknowledge that anything other than forced population control will ultimately mitigate the looming climate “doomsday”.
While I can not comment on Nitrium’s history, I think there is some depressing truth in what Nitrium has posted.
For every one of us here in NZ, there is close to 300 people in China. Add a similar amount for India. That’s a lot people eating, breathing, consuming and defecating. And breeding. Unless we are all to commit to change, there is a sense of being hopelessly insignificant if other countries don’t follow.
And isn’t growth viewed as the way forward for countries like India and China? They want to have some of the life that we enjoy. Will they listen when we tell them they can’t have it?
The human population hit 3 billion in the sixties. As of today we have added close to another 5 billion on top of that. In 60 years. Not only more people, but also a lot more fatter, hungrier bastards. There is that insignificant feeling again.
There are few things we can get global consensus on, Robert Redford’s good looks is one. But look at how long Palestine has been left to fester. We dispute borders, fishing zones and nuclear weapon limits. We argue over our gods, bloodlines and sexuality. We fight over pretty much everything. Forget a global consensus on climate change, we won’t get a national consensus.
I hope the optimism of people who want positive change is rewarded. But, I have a feeling that it is more realistic to prepare for climate change than expect it to be prevented.
No one has any time for this bullshit
The developed Western world’s emissions both in absolute terms and in terms of per capita outstrip that of Chinese and Indians.
If you consider cumulative damage there is no context.
Sorry. But Westerners have eaten most of the food at the banquet. Bout time they, including New Zealanders, reduce their consumption and allow Africans and Asians their fair share.
No reason why a kiwi thinks he can fly around the world, the world is his fucken oyster, while coloured people are just there to be props and part of the scenery.
Fuck that.
Which is my point. Kiwis aren’t going to stop flying around the world. And non-Western nations are not going accept that they have to miss out.
Our impact on the planet is likely to get worse.
Amazing that Judith Collins in her realms of hypocrisy and arrogance demeans 3.5% of the population whilst at the same time forgetting those 3.5% are future voters at future general elections.
Hypocrites like Judith Collins, Mike Hosking and so many others are living on toilet-free Planet Key. They don’t have a clue as to how people feel. They “Assume” they know how NZers feel but the reality of the matter is they don’t know and don’t care. As long as THEY(Collins, Bridges, Bennett, Brownless, Hosking…etc.etc.etc.)remain in the News cameravision for their OWN self promotion they don’t care about anyone else but themselves. They are a totally selfish and also unpredictable(lets call them unstable)part of society that has created a mess and will naturally blame everyone else but themselves for the mess.
I am a baby boomer and know this planet is in trouble. Something needs to be done NOW for the future generations on this planet to live and thrive on. Not destroy parts of it over a period of time because those living now(the selfish and unstable ones)are more obsessed for money for themselves this instant and NOW.
Lets face it but if Judith Collins in leader of the National Party(if it still exists in 2023)she will be courting the 3.5% of the population she recently disparaged for votes.
Don’t get too hung up on 3.5% of the population being too big to ignore and having to be pandered to.
Firearms license holders make up more than 5% percent of the population but the tyranny of the majority and this government decided to effectively exclude them from law changes effecting them and punish them.
Both main parties do it, I’m sure the Nats when back in power will studiously ignore climate change just like JC is signalling here.
Democracy is certainly absolutely nothing like Ju-Darth and her beloved racist Chinese dictatorship, that’s for damn sure 😉
What you and Martyn ate saying is that it is only democracy when people agree with YOU. You are as bad as the extreme right fuckwits.
In the end it dosnt matter if people agree or not. The only thing that matters is are we correct. Bomber was literally the only one saying Albour was going to win the last election. And he’s made many calls like that, and of course loads of trolls, including people on the left say oh Martyn is terrible, he’s the worst, he’s sold out to the right or he’s a socialists all in the same week brother. And Martyn just keeps getting shit correct. It’s that simple.
Oh dear , so naive. Prey tell, where does anyone start?, with themselves.
Judith Collins is horrible.period.
I’ve not followed the climate strike in detail but I’m curious as to who organised it. I can see various references to individual student organisers, but who coordinated between schools and businesses, which Organisations?
As someone who is trying hard not to be a cynic (too late!) I note many climate change initiatives are part of the globalisation agenda.
I’d like a much more balanced approach to lowering emissions, blaming agriculture for its proportion of emissions without accounting for carbon sequestering in grass and soil is misleading.
Plus:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/voices/2019/07/25/vegetarianism-climate-change-meat-vegan-livestock-column/1804090001/
“We’re often told that going vegetarian is the biggest thing that any of us could do, with headlines telling us: “Cut your carbon footprint in half by going vegetarian.” Statements like that are misleading for two reasons.
First, that cut isn’t to our entire emissions — just those from food. That means Four-fifths of emissions are ignored, according to an analysis of emission from the European Union, which means the impact is actually five-times lower.
Second, the more optimistic figures about how much of your emissions you can cut are based not just on a vegetarian diet, but on an entirely vegan one where we avoid every single animal product altogether.
A systematic peer-review of studies of going vegetarian shows that a non-meat diet will likely reduce an individual’s emissions by the equivalent of nearly 1,200 lbs carbon dioxide. For the average person in the industrialized world, that means an emissions cut of just 4.3%.”
“This still overstates the effect, because it ignores the well-established “rebound effect.” Vegetarian diets are slightly cheaper, and saved money will likely be spent on other goods and services that cause extra greenhouse gas emissions. In the U.S., vegetarians save at least $750 on their food budgets every year. That extra spending will cause more carbon dioxide emissions, cancelling about half the saved carbon emissions from going vegetarian.
It’s not you, it’s big business: You can’t save the climate by going vegan. Corporate polluters must be held accountable.
In a first world setting, the reality is that going entirely vegetarian for the rest of your life means you reduce your emissions by about 2%, according to a study of the environmental impact of Swedish vegetarians. ”
Get our long haul trucks on to rail, tax the hell out of air travel, don’t just bankrupt farmers for little reward.
Let’s assume for a moment that the most cataclysmic version of climate change is a real thing.
So what’s your plan?
Fortress Aotearoa, my brother,
What you do is “keepcalmcarryon”. In a balanced way without lashing out like Martyn and others here. Everyone including farmers need to be responsible. If all human initiated global warming stopped tomorrow the planet is going to keep warming anyway. We need to minimise the damage without destroying the economy. What a lot of those marchers won’t be thinking about is that we need a strong economy to make the changes necessary. Your not going to fight rising sea levels by shutting down farmers. You’re going to need their tax dollars to build infrastructure and the food they grow when it becomes unattainable off shore. We should be careful what we wish for.
The average tax paid by farm owners is less than $2000/year. According to IRD figures.
Just saying.
They can’t be the filthy rich leaches that Martyn And others make them out to be then.
He doesn’t. However just because farmers pay less tax than $2000 a year does not make them “poor’.
Your point. Or you are just struggling to find a problem with my comment.
New View? What’s new about your load of clap trap. That there is the old people talking ignorance and selfishness again and again forevermore. Wake up and get with the program. Go Martyn keep it up mate.
Interesting comment what ever it means. Oh you don’t like my comment but really don’t know why. Les get rid of all the old people. They’re ignorant and arrogant.? You must be young and sensible then? Twenty years ago none of these issues were big news because we didn’t understand the problem itself. That might show ignorance but not arrogance. You’re arrogant for condemning farmers and the older generation who got off their arses and actually worked for the money they earned. Oh I forgot they’re now getting all that super money they earned back in their retirement and pissing all the young people off. Yeah let’s get rid of the greedy old white people who wrecked the planet and leave all the young hard working people to fix it. !!!..
As financial torture sets in, its more than likely that younger people abandon expensive large cities for cheaper rural ones.
Rates went negative in the US so we have to pay people to lend money out.
People who committed all the fraud got bailed out. So we have to keep on punishing people who save money so we can give care and comfort to the people who screwed everything up.
And now these Whale Oil rejects New View ect ect think they have special insight and know something unique. You muppets know fuck all.
Get your facts right Sam. It’s those old people who didn’t have credit cards and paid cash for everything. My own father in-law bought a bag of cement a week cash until he had enough to concrete his driveway himself. Of course you’d be as industrious as that eh Sam. It’s not those old people that demand all the modern accessories and cell phones right now. It’s young people who can’t live their lives without this stuff. It’s the old people who saved every penny before they bought stuff. You call me a whale oil reject so I feel I can call you a no wind blow bag. What have you contributed to the country we live in Sam.?
The land, that’s what I contribute.
Before rates went negative saving was a legitimate way to itch out an income. Not any more.
Unless you trade in physical cash which is unlikely given 90% of all money is digital. Then by holding money in a bank, all you are going is servicing the finance industries ability to lend.
The finance sector can legally go in and take money from your bank account and give it to money lenders. That’s what negative rates are.
The game has changed. Have a look at your own bank account. Interest isn’t payed out anymore. Interest is deducted.
What about the Ginga’s!
The Ginga’s what exactly?
I wonder how many would have turned out of it wasn’t a school day? 😉
Don’t forget that the price of solar photovoltaics has tumbled by 99 per cent over the last forty years in real terms. I.e. an amount of solar electricity that cost $100 in the days of Nambassa costs $1 now, after correcting for inflation. That’s one reason the boomers couldn’t do a sustainable lifestyle, but we can do it now. Battery powered cars (and trucks, and tractors) have also become practical. And so on. So we can do this stuff: it is just getting the knowledge out there and forging the political will, which makes the protests all the more relevant.
You’re right, but you don’t go far enough to understand the problems that remain.
Australia is ahead of us in this regard, in that they have advanced far more with home solar than us (and they get more sunshine). The result is an unstable electric grid and it’s causing all sorts of problems. They don’t have the large capacity generators that can provide power at night and as yet no way of storing of electricity in the amounts required and in a cost effective manner. Germany has suffered from the same problem with their wind generation and have are now actually commissioning four new coal fired power stations: They’ve failed.
We’re a bit better off in this regard in that we can use pumped storage on our existing hydro stations. So we can reduce our carbon emissions a little for electricity generation and this would suit the ‘dry year’ scenario when we’re short of hydro capacity. Add some more geothermal and we could at least be getting close to 100% renewable on our electricity grid.
I would install solar panels tomorrow but for one thing: The power companies offer trivial money for power put back into the grid because that’s not the business they’re in. That’s a thing that needs looking at.
tell the govt the hurry up and lower the voting age the SNP in Scotland already has and there way ahead in climate policy as well
This is fast becoming a cultural and generational conflict.
Nothing will change until the neo liberal economic stranglehold is countered and abolished.
There will be no change until that fact is realised and understood.
These climate change protests are fine but are NOT addressing the real block wall that must be smashed through before anything meaningful can actually take place.
This is fast becoming a cultural and generational conflict.
Nothing will change until the neo liberal economic stranglehold is countered and abolished.
There will be no change until that fact is realised and understood.
These climate change protests are fine but are NOT addressing the real block wall that must be smashed through before anything meaningful can actually take place.
So good to see photo of Greta on the train with all the plastic food containers and drinking bottles scattered around.
The children of the world can finally see what a fake this whole world surrounding this kid is
So when is the CP-TPP supporting current government going to do something substantial about climate change? Strikes me they mostly on the same page here……
Media are a fortress of ignorance Brother.
I was marching among the young 700 walking down Emerson Street on Friday and was lifted up by the enthusiasm of the youth today.
In Chch people camped out overnight to be among the first through the door at the latest Doughnut shop. Some will join a crowd just because it is there. I am concerned for the mental wellbeing of these young people that are being sold the doomsday message. The real lesson they need to learn is that life is never certain and for people to survive they need to be adaptable to changing times.
Collins is denying climate change? Thought our Right was informed by reality, also known as social democracy, in which we all grew up. We think the Right of America, Oz and, most implicating, Northern Ireland are crackers. In the Anglo-Saxon arena, that just meant us and the UK believed in reality. Yep, sorry, Canada also has a mental Right.
Our Right is encouraged by the victories of fabulists other where. But, being NZers, I just don’t think they can lie like non-NZers. The choking will be obvious. They’ll have to come up with delusionaries like Scott Morrison or sociopaths like Trump. I’m sure such cheerful chappies could have great (momentary) success. But I’m still not sure Godzone can puke/shit up such. People without ideals and/or realism.
Passing by the comments at a quick trot… I’m sorry I didn’t gallop.
Just had my brother argue agin on the basis of his Bot 101. Plants need CO2 to grow. And I need oxygen and fuckloads of pork. But he’s a b.a.c., wedded to craziness constitutionally. Which makes me say God help us.
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