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GUEST BLOG: Bryan Bruce – Jesus was a Leftie

By   /  June 12, 2019  /  39 Comments

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The assumption that to hold Christian values is to be a conservative is an absolute nonsense.

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I’ve just finished watching the TVOne News and their reporting of the result of a Colmar Brunton poll which asked the question :

“Would you consider voting for a party with Christian or conservative values at the 2020 General Election”

Frankly I’m appalled at that question.

The assumption that to hold Christian values is to be a conservative is an absolute nonsense.

In fact, I’d go as far as to say that I don’t see how you can be a practicing Christian and continue to vote for an economic system that gives to the rich and taxes the poor for their food. (Yes. I’m talking about the 15% GST on food again)

Nope.

I think Jesus was a Leftie – To hell with Capital Gains Tax “If you want to be perfect, go, sell what you have and give to the poor (Matthew 19:21)

On any reading of the Christian Scriptures ( whether you believe their content or not) it’s clear Jesus was considered a radical for his day. Not a conservative .. and having gathered a following (which the authorities found challenging) the Romans executed him.

But hey.. maybe some new Gospels have been discovered that I don’t know about.

Like the Gospel according to David (Seymour) in which Jesus apparently said ” Blessed are the Selfish,” or the one according to Simon (Bridges) in which Jesus advocated trickle down theory and you can have as many untaxed assets as you like.

Dear God- save me from pollsters.

Bryan Bruce is one of NZs most respected documentary makers and public intellectuals who has tirelessly exposed NZs neoliberal economic settings as the main cause for social issues.

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39 Comments

  1. michelle says:

    It should be all about policies

  2. Castro says:

    Your next piece is titled “Jesus was the Son of God”? lol

    • Im right says:

      Jesus was a Jew, don’t you lefties hate Jews and love the jew hating Muslims?

      • Pip says:

        Try not to be so offensive, I’m right. Hate is counter-productive, and it claws like a cancer at the haters.

        The Jewish people occupy a disproportionately high place as high achievers in many fields- which is a totally separate issue from modern Zionism.

        Ditto the historic high achievers in Islamic maths, science, and philosophy, who were world leaders when Europeans were still in the dark ages, and to suggest that contemporary Muslims hate Jews is glib and woefully simplistic.

        Were I one of today’s Muslims, and a hater, then I’d be directing my ire at the so-called Christian West, so have a think or two about that.

        • WILD KATIPO says:

          Meh , ….I dunno , ….before the collapse of Rome and its Grecian traditions of science , math’s and philosophy , the west seemed to reign supreme,… then again,… it was probably convergent development in the east and the west.

          We had the Chinese and the Indian subcontinent that was also advanced in these disciplines… I don’t think its right to single any one group out against the other.

          ——————————

          * Here’s what I reckon:

          1 / An Australian Aborigine or a Native American in prior times went out on the hunt for half an hour and fed his family for a week.

          2 / A typical westerner nowadays goes out to work for more than 60 hours to feed his family and stay above water.

          Who therefore,… was the most intelligent ?

      • Mike the Lefty says:

        You can hate anyone you like I’m Right, but don’t assume that everyone else shares your pathogenic bigotries

      • Draco T Bastard says:

        1. Jews and Muslims have actually got along quite well throughout history
        2. It’s not that I hate Jew2s as much as I hate their psychopathic belief that puts them above everyone else and which they then use to justify the atrocities that they commit

        • WILD KATIPO says:

          That’s Talmudic Zionism , Draco… we need to get over that.

          And learn to draw the difference .

          • Draco T Bastard says:

            I’ll ‘get over it’ when the rest of the Jews do something about them.

            • WILD KATIPO says:

              You cant do it like that, Draco… its too much to ask, most are like you , just family people living day to day. Your fight is with the unseen types who give massive donations to political party’s and groups… that use those same ‘day to day ‘ folk as cannon fodder.

    • John W says:

      Jesus, Horah and many other all reputedly born “immaculately”, later died an rose again and had similar connections with a mythical supernatural being.

      Appears to be a popular story line across several cultures and millennia.

      It works it seems judging by the followers and accumulated wealth and power centralised in churches and governments who rule using deference to the fear of the unknown.

      But this is the 21st century. Belief without testable evidence is blind faith, certainly not seeing the light in spite of all the hearsay writings given such reverence..

      • WILD KATIPO says:

        Erm… you seem to have gotten your wires crossed,… the ‘ Horah ‘ or ‘ Hora’ is a traditional Jewish dance.

        Perhaps you meant Horus,… which ,… if you care to study it in depth belongs to the Ancient Magical Mystery religions , part of which are enshrined in the Talmudic writings ( which have nothing to do at all with the Torah and in fact oppose it ).

        Essentially , Horus is a form of ‘Satan’… a serpentine member of the fallen angelic host who became, literally ,… ‘ fallen angels’. Not demons, – they were a secondary group and the prodigy called the Rephaim / Nephilim of the time of the Antediluvian era ( the Great Flood of Noah ) ,… and also after which King David fought ie : Goliath and his five brothers from the Philistine seafaring nation . In other words, the giants of antiquity of the Greeks, Romans and Sumerians.

        A good person to study is the superb Biblical scholar Gary Wayne . If you wish to learn more , I will provide you with this link :

        The Genesis 6 Conspiracy with Gary Wayne – YouTube
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfX-nnLC548

        He’s a lot like Chuck Missler but more specialized with this subject . Both men are kind of stodgy ( I love these gently spoken , stodgy and wise older guys ! ) , – but in absolute terms are real gems in just giving pearl after pearl of profound facts from Biblical text and archaeology that most of us would just not be privy to. Simply because we wouldn’t even know where to start to begin to find any of them !

        These learned guys ( like many scientists ) have dedicated their entire lives to these study’s and they are well worth a listen to. This is what they do.

  3. DOC HORRORDAY says:

    You old necromancer you, some book based cadaver ventriloquist debates is it? I prefer digging in the crates for the classics, like the Ark of the Covenant.

    If you really need to melt some Nazis you gotta hit them with that stone tablet action, unambiguous and simple. Hardcore Moses action. It’s got more cross curricular purchase

  4. jay11 says:

    Usury: abhorred in the ancient world:
    “The definitional approach to prohibiting usury centers on distinguishing which transactions constitute the lending of money for a profit.The best known example in the ancient world of this approach is Israel, which outlawed usury among Israelites but permitted it if the borrowers were foreigners”

    But nowadays we have a different form of socially destructive usury: Borrowing money with interest to monopolise housing to make very large capital gains on the backs of the “poor class’ ( Who can’t get their own house because of grossly inflated prices due to housing an essential social good being turned into a get rich casino) who are forced to rent your capital gain engine just to live enabled by the government who give rock bottom benefits to them just to survive and refuse to levy a realistic CGT tax at least 50% family home exempt. The vile curse of neoliberalism!

    The Government is the dog who is wagged by the tail by the F.I.R.E sector itself wagged by the property speculation for CGT gain bunch.

    Woe to a nation that allows this social blight and evil of GREED.
    https://scholarship.shu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?referer=https://www.google.com/&httpsredir=1&article=1600&context=student_scholarship

    • mikesh says:

      Interest should be non deductible for tax purposes, as it is in the case of a home owner’s mortgage interest. Making interest no deductible would make it expensive to borrow in order to make capital gains on property.

      Deductibility rests on what the IRD deems the borrower’s intention to have been; but, in my opinion, the use of “intention” as a basis for taxation practices leads to all sorts of anomalies. People should be taxed on what they do, not what they are deemed to have “intended”.

  5. Michal says:

    Great piece Bryan. Absolutely Christ was a radical lefty, he threw the money lenders out of the temple, he did not compromise his beliefs at anytime.

    The church is the main problem, not Christianity itself, its tenents are sound.

    The Christian faith should be front footing all the issues we have currently – primarily inequality.

  6. esoteric pineapples says:

    Most Christian fundamentalists aren’t Christians but non-Jewish followers of the Old Testament

    • D'Esterre says:

      Esoteric Pineapples: “Most Christian fundamentalists aren’t Christians but non-Jewish followers of the Old Testament.”

      I agree with you.

  7. Steve King says:

    Completely agree. It is beyond belief that most evangelicals align themselves with conservative power structures and policies that perpetuate inequality and exclusion of the already marginalised.

  8. Snow White says:

    Graham pedophile Capill – he was a Conservative Christian – call him back again then- Colin Craig – where are you Colin ? Brian Muslims are different from us Tamaki – On your bike Brian- Alfred Zionist oops Palestinians keep falling dead Ngaro – Cameron Christian politics are dirty Slater – Bill NZ’s young men are hopeless druggies so how about el cheapo immigrants English – Anybody who claims they should have control over women’s bodies.

    Shouldn’t have too much trouble rustling up a bunch of ” stout-hearted men who will fight for the right they adore.” So be it – aka – Amen.

  9. Mike the Lefty says:

    Absolutely right!
    I have been arguing this for years and years.
    When I look at these self-described “Christian” groups I’m not sure whether to laugh or cry at their antics and beliefs.
    “Christian” based political parties are almost invariably right-wing and concerned mostly with material gains and the other Christian values such as forgiving your enemies and peace on earth, etc. are either non-existant or take a back seat.
    Making wealth is the new Christianity of the age, not that these parties will actually admit it.
    At least the Exclusive Bretheren (who are not Christian) admit that their God tells them to make as much money as possible.
    REAL Christians do not rant, rage, curse their enemies and enrich themselves at the expense of others – REAL Christians are hard to recognize because they do things quietly and low key, whilst the bible bashing fake Christians make a lot of noise but actually do very little to help others outside their own small circles.
    You certainly could describe Jesus as the ultimate leftie rebel, and that must really bother the self-described Christian right so they deal with this contradiction by pretending it doesn’t exist and revising their own rules of Christianity.
    “Blessed are the peacemakers” becomes “Blessed are the cheesemakers”
    If there was a genuine left wing Christian values party I would very likely support and campaign for it because I respect what Jesus was trying to do. And yet, paradoxically, I don’t actually believe in God.
    I will be very interested in reading other contributions here.

  10. G.A.P. says:

    Thank you MIKE THE LEFTY for stating what i have believed for many years, but could not possibly have articulated so well.

  11. WILD KATIPO says:

    Haha… Jesus was a hippy, he raised people from the dead and rescued a woman about to be murdered because of adultery.He lambasted and mocked the sold out powers that be who were the lackeys of an overbearing emperor worshiping occupationist military force.

    He respected and recognized those who were the honest ones among those in the religious order , … that used the Temple as a money making enterprise , – while seeing them for what they were and flogging their arses and kicking over their money stalls when necessary. He favored and worked with laborers and working class people, healed them and gave them hope and told them that their Father in Heaven adored them despite the harshness of their lives on earth.

    And despite them trying to make him leader and King on earth to overturn the Roman occupation for their selfish reasons he kept his sights singly on the interdimensialism of the eternal.

    Even to the point of fulfilling ancient prophesy’s regarding his own death.

    The death foretold on a tree, a cross , for ungrateful and unenlightened humanity.

    Yeah Jesus was a hippy.

    And the toughest , most brutally honest and forgiving man that ever lived.

    I’m glad he was a long haired wandering radical hippy.

    Because this world would never have been the same if he wasn’t.

  12. Granted, Jesus of Nazareth was a radical preacher whose sympathies were entirely with the poor and who laid down a challenge to the powers-that-be in the world.
    And if the left claim him as one of their own, that is to be welcomed.
    But it is also true that the contemporary left has moved a long way from its Christian origins, and the right has not been slow to capitalize on that.

  13. stu2 says:

    Good post, Brian; keep pursuing this line of thinking. Obviously, the political environment Jesus had to deal with involved his country being occupied by the Roman empire. Things such as “left” and “right” democratic politics were unknown – it was more a case of coping under Roman might. Nevertheless, Jesus clearly stood in the Jewish prophetic line of teaching regarding social responsibility to ensure all in society were able to live and participate equitably.

    Today, this may reasonably be translated into a section of the voting public who would support a more progressive tax regime combined with reasonably conservative positions on moral issues.

    Fiscally progressive and morally cautious – that’s the target market for any party of “Christian conservative values”, but it will only gain wide enough appeal if the egos and political ineptitude of Brian Tamaki, Colin Craig etc are absent.

    • roblogic says:

      “Christian conservative values” is an American heresy that worships power and wealth and military violence.

      2 Timothy 3:1-5 (MSG) was prophetically accurate of the current US president:

      Don’t be naive. There are difficult times ahead. As the end approaches, people are going to be self-absorbed, money-hungry, self-promoting, stuck-up, profane, contemptuous of parents, crude, coarse, dog-eat-dog, unbending, slanderers, impulsively wild, savage, cynical, treacherous, ruthless, bloated windbags, addicted to lust, and allergic to God. They’ll make a show of religion, but behind the scenes they’re animals. Stay clear of these people.

      • Draco T Bastard says:

        Christian Conservatives use going to church as a camouflage for their immoral actions. It’s ‘see, I go to church and so I must be good’ while they engage in immoral actions. Just need to look at our own Bill English and his rort of parliament’s housing allowance to see that.

  14. sumsuch says:

    So true, Bryan. But the last 2 millenia it provided the spirit that allowed pure muscle. Ideals.

    A divided self that strengthened and softened power. Italy and Germany read the empires before them by the bones of their ends and mislaid the marrow.

  15. Chris says:

    “Would you consider voting for a party with Christian or conservative values at the 2020 General Election”

    That’s easy, Christian. I’m not too keen on what those conservatives are trying to do.

  16. WILD KATIPO says:

    Truth is , the reality of the Gospels are an outrage to the legalist’s, an affront to the academics, and a direct challenge to those who wish to hold power.

    Jesus said anyone who would wish to be a leader must first be a servant, and the simplicity of the message of Gods love and forgiveness is something that even a child can perceive, thus putting paid to the haughty academic notions of good works to earn a place in the hereafter,…in fact the righteousness of the Pharisees was condemned as being ‘whitewashed tombs full of dead mans bones’ by Jesus.

    He taught that the small amount given by the poor widow meant infinitely more to God than the much announced large Temple donations delivered with fanfare by the Pharisees…because she was doing it from pure motives. And they were only wanting men’s favour.

    You start to get a picture of the exact inverse of humankind’s arrogant pride here ,… and conversely , just like the smallest unit , the atom and the colossal amount of power within,… we see this universe as being not the frightful power of the collapsing supernova,… but of the still quiet voice…

    Its so easy to override that voice,.. we do it all too often…

    ——————————

    1 Kings 19:11-13 New King James Version (NKJV)

    God’s Revelation to Elijah

    11 Then He said, “Go out, and stand on the mountain before the Lord.” And behold, the Lord passed by, and a great and strong wind tore into the mountains and broke the rocks in pieces before the Lord, but the Lord was not in the wind; and after the wind an earthquake, but the Lord was not in the earthquake; 12 and after the earthquake a fire, but the Lord was not in the fire; and after the fire [a]a still small voice.

    13 So it was, when Elijah heard it, that he wrapped his face in his mantle and went out and stood in the entrance of the cave. Suddenly a voice came to him, and said, “What are you doing here, Elijah?”

    ——————————-

  17. Richard Christie says:

    It’s best not to go down the rabbit hole of the “No True Scotsman” logical fallacy.

    Knowing that religion poisons everything simply covers the issue..

    LOGICAL FALLACY: No True Scotsman:

    https://www.logicalfallacies.info/presumption/no-true-scotsman/

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