ISAF Joint Command: “No civilians were injured or killed during this operation”
– ‘Numerous insurgents killed and weapons recovered’, news release 2010-08-CA-266, 23 August 2010, Kabul, Afghanistan.
New Zealand Defence Force: “Following the operation allegations of civilian casualties were made. These were investigated by a joint Afghan Ministry of Defence, Ministry of Interior and International Security Assistance Force assessment team, in accordance with ISAF procedures. The investigation concluded that the allegations of civilian casualties were unfounded”
– ‘NZ Defence Force operations in Bamiyan on 22 August 2010’, media release, 20 April 2011.
Defence minister Wayne Mapp: “That’s been investigated and proven to be false…. I am satisfied around that”
– Wayne Mapp asked about civilian casualties, Q+A, Television New Zealand, 24 April 2011.
John Key: “My understanding is that after a thorough review of the CDF [Chief of Defence Force] at the weekend, he is very confident that the New Zealand Defence Force version of events is correct…. They say there were insurgents that were killed, but that was it”
– John Key on TV3 Firstline, 1 July 2014.
The New Zealand Defence Force: “The NZDF stands by its statement made on 20 April 2011 [above] and will not be making further comment.”
– New Zealand Defence Force, statement to Maori Television Service, 30 June 2014.
Defence minister Jonathan Coleman: “What I would emphasise is New Zealanders were not involved – and that’s categorical – in any civilian casualties or deaths”
– Jonathan Coleman in Stacey Kirk, ‘Categorical: ‘NZ troops did not kill civilians’, Stuff, 1 July 2014.
Defence minister Jonathan Coleman asked by reporters if coalition forces had killed civilians during the raid: “There is no evidence that they did.”
– Jonathan Coleman, New Zealand Herald, 1 July 2014.
John Key: “We don’t discuss the detail of SAS operations, but what we do say categorically is that no New Zealand soldier was involved in killing civilians”
– John Key in Ripeka Timutimu, ‘Key denies SAS involvement in civilian deaths in Afghanistan’, Maori Television Service, 1 July 2014.
New Zealand, your political, military and media class have lied to you about an atrocity and possible war crime that we have carried out and was signed off by the Prime Minister.
The denial and lies must stop now and we must have a independent inquiry. It is as simple as that.
ESPINER: There’s an Associated Press report around that time that contains a claim that a number of civilians were killed during that operation.
DR MAPP: And that’s been investigated and proven to be false.
ESPINER: So no civilians were killed in that? You’re satisfied about that? You’ve seen some reports on it?
DR MAPP: I am satisfied around that.
ESPINER: Only insurgents were killed in that operation?
DR MAPP: I am satisfied around that.
I suspect Wayne was using semantics to avoid lying outright. Ie his answer around the Associated Press report being investigated and proven to be wrong, could be due to the fact that the associated press report said 8 or 9 civilians were killed. If the numbers in the press report were different to the actual amount killed (such as the 6 that Hit and Run claims), then what he is saying is technically correct.
Saying that he “is satisfied around that” after being asked “So no civilians were killed in that? You’re satisfied about that? You’ve seen some reports on it?” is not the same as saying that there weren’t any civilians killed. It is a technique of not answering the question directly, so that he can quite correctly state later, that he didn’t say that no civilians were killed. Ask yourself this, why did he not just say, “no civilians were killed” or that “only insurgents were killed” when asked. “satisfied around that” can literally mean anything, it’s very ambiguous.
My take on that is that he has deliberately mislead with these statements, but has intentionally not actually outright lied.
media coaching or Freudian slip is the question Dougal …..
He was satisfied about everything around … but apart from the denial of Civilian deaths …
ie : yes there was a raid …
yes our SAS lead it ….
Everything around and apart from the massacre of defenseless civilians was very satisfactory …… sort of.
War is peace …… Wayne Mapp
I’ve previously Jerry Mateparae’s less than six month stint as GSCB Director, to then be made Governor General, a bit weird. Always seemed to me like he was being given some “special treatment”. After the Kim Dotcom illegal spying came out, I had a hunch it was to do with Kim Dotcom spying, although I am not sure that the time frame’s are correct for that.
But now, I see that his appointment to Director of the GSCB was only 4 days after the raid and civilian killings in the 22 August 2010. Something just doesn’t smell right.
From Wikipedia
In February 2002, Mateparae was promoted to major general and became the Chief of General Staff.[11] The title was changed in mid-2002 to Chief of Army. On 1 May 2006 he was promoted to lieutenant general and took up appointment as the Chief of Defence Force, New Zealand’s senior uniformed military appointment, which he held until 24 January 2011.[8]
On 26 August 2010, Prime Minister John Key announced the appointment of Mateparae as Director of the Government Communications Security Bureau. Mateparae was appointed for a five-year term commencing on 7 February 2011 but stepped down from the role on 1 July 2011.
The old boys’ network at work.
God! When all’s said and done, I feel deeply embarrassed by this. I was really hoping to be able to go to Afghanistan. I heard from a friend who’d been there a number of times many years ago, mainly to smoke the hashish with the locals, of how ‘amazing’ it was then.
I could never go there and look them in the eye now.
Cambodia was a similar experience. I refused to go to the ‘ killing fields’ and instead went to the Phnom Penh rubbish dump and hung out with the locals there while musing that we were U$A allies at the time of that particular genocide.
Just imagine if Afghani special Op’s came here and murdered our neighbours, friends and families? Imagine the outrage? Our pathetic little world stopped turning while images of a French woman caught short and shitting in a gutter circulated. Oh! The hand wringing! The horror of it!
We Kiwis must chase this debacle down and sort it or we’ll be seen as just like the rest of the fuckers. We’re better than where the Right Wing and jonky have dragged us down to ( For a Dollar, I might add. ) and we must show that to the Afghani people but perhaps most importantly, to ourselves. We must do all we can to reclaim our dignity in this matter.
When i link this article it reads, “why the right is luny in one article.”
I mean accepted forms of reality just can not be applied to any one on the right. Clearly
Martyn,
We have a dirty little secret John Key drops onto us all now to struggle with along all the obscene social unrest and homelessness so he should be locked up for his part in those cover-ups instead of cynically he slinks away like a snake.
This is extremely sad.
Martyn – time to organise a protest march???
@dougal – the timing of becoming Govenor General is very interesting… Considering the GG is the one person who can question a PM’s behaviour and take action to remove them if necessary.
Seems a little boys club was form around this incident.
Have our NZ Defence Force, our Prime Minister Bill English, and Deputy Prime Minister Paula Bennett actually read the following?
The “Afghanistan Annual Report 2010
Protection of Civilians In Armed Conflict
United Nations Assistance Mission in Afghanistan
Afghanistan Independent Human Rights Commission
https://unama.unmissions.org/sites/default/files/engi_version_of_poc_annual_report_2011.pdf
” 2.2.4. 22 August, Tala Wa Barfak district, Baghlan province
International military forces conducted an investigation into an air strike on 22 August in Tala Wa Barfak district in Baghlan province that caused six civilian deaths and four injuries.
Reportedly, the strike was not coordinated with Provincial Reconstruction Teams based in Baghlan or with Baghlan authorities.
Although the investigation team was sent from Regional Command North on numerous occasions, it received minimal cooperation from district authorities.
The team was unable to interview victims, was not shown grave sites and was not able to visit the incident site.
Although the district governor presented a list of victims to the investigation team, the official ISAF investigation report has not been shared with district and provincial authorities, the AIHRC or UNAMA Human Rights in spite of requests.
According to the district authorities there was no further government follow up.
The AIHRC and UNAMA Human Rights continue to ask COMISAF to ensure that Tactical Directives are fully implemented through, among other means, creation of one central body that monitors, investigates and publicly reports on all incidents of civilian casualties.
Such a process would support both appropriate follow up with victims including compensation and disciplinary action against individuals found responsible for any violations.
Legal Analysis on Use of Deadly Force:
The use of deadly (or lethal) force by military forces against civilians is prohibited under international humanitarian law and international human rights law.
When combat operations are being carried out, the warring parties are required to distinguish between civilians as protected persons and those who are directly participating in hostilities, and not attack civilians.
Outside the combat zone, the rules of international human rights law apply.
Such rules limit the use of deadly force to the following situations:
(i) self-defense or defense of others against the imminent threat of death or serious injury,
(ii) to prevent a particularly serious crime involving grave threat to life,
(iii) to arrest a person presenting such a danger and resisting authority, or
(iv) to prevent his or her escape, and only when less extreme means are insufficient to achieve these objectives.
In any event, intentional deadly use of firearms should only occur when strictly necessary to protect
+100 Penny…clearly there should be a New Zealand Governement public independent commission of inquiry
Business as usual under our National Party led government: LIES, LIES AND MORE LIES!
They beat used car salesmen and real estate agents to the game.
Okay, so the Defence Force might have blood on their hands.
But lets have a look if that is possible at Defence Force policies and procedures for when we are asked to participate in or led a military act that is likely to cause civilian deaths and/or harm civilian property.
Has anyone thought to do that yet?
Has anyone thought to tell the Defence Force that as long as they are honest with, we have got their backs, that we will back them if America or any other nation says we have to participate in something we don’t want a bar of?
You would be surprised how much it means to people in difficult situations to know that officials knowing they are in a tight spot have their back.
“Apr 20, 2011
TVNZ’s One News said the Government had confirmed that SAS troops stationed in Kabul were involved in hunting down the Taleban insurgents and 12 were believed to have died during the counter-attack.
They mobilised from their base in Kabul two weeks after Lt O’Donnell was killed and, with American assistance, launched a counter-attack in Baghlan Province.
Defence Minister Wayne Mapp said New Zealand was taking an active interest in the region and New Zealand forces “were involved”.
“We have our special forces to be able to undertake military operations – that is part of their overall remit,” he said.
“It is in the remit of the special forces to be able to undertake operations at the direction of ISAF (International Security Assistance Force) and Nato, and in this case, particularly, to protect our people.”
Mr Mapp denies the attack was revenge.
Lt O’Donnell died on patrol in north-east Bamyan Province and it was believed insurgents who attacked the convoy had come in from neighbouring Baghlan Province, the report said
The report said there had been claims civilians died in the counter-attack but Mr Mapp said they had proved to be false.”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQc-paUXEyA
A year after the event and Wayne Mapp is still lying to the public
Shocking. Went to buy Hager’s book but already sold out on first day.
The propaganda of military – needs to be cleansed.
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