A Weet-Bix packet for a flag


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SPOT THE DIFFERENCE  One is a right wing deluded fantasist who thinks a flag should be a logo, the other is Sean Plunket. 


So a large chunk of NZ has all the taste of cask wine. The flag referendum has become a panel of lepers judging a beauty competition. Given our horrific domestic abuse stats though, I suppose black and blue is an appropriate choice.

I didn’t vote in this vanity project as I refuse point blank to buy into National’s distraction tactics. $26million plus spent on changing the flag while 305 000 children live in poverty is the very definition of obscenity in my book.

Things that were most interesting from the numbers crunched were…

  • More people voted to spoil their vote than voted for the third choice
  • The poor show by Red Peak is further proof (if any were needed) that Twitter outrage don’t mean shit.
  • That John Key understands the bland low horizon imagination of middle NZ better than any other politician ever.

A flag design requires a mature discussion about the hopes, dreams and aspirations of a nation bringing in a country’s cultural, philosophical and artistic minds. This is a weet-bix designed process for the lowest common denominator carried out for pure political reasons to distract the sleepy hobbits whenever the Government need it.

I say again.

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  1. And the weak kneed opposition political pigs stand back as Boss Hogg flounders about in the trough eating everything in sight. Double Ugh. Are we the chickens watching from up on the fence while Farmer Brown-stien approaches us from behind with a sharpened axe ?

    Sean Plunket’s lying down while thinking of the money.

  2. A flag also has to fly well AND in reverse. Oddly enough the flag design that would have flown well both ways and probably even been still relatively recognisable even if there wasn’t so much as a breath of wind, was the koru.
    But then black on a flag is not a flash idea. Grey and dirty white flag, anyone.
    Black and blue only really go together on a bruise.
    And now was not the right time to change the flag, even if it needs changing. You need a reason, not “just because” for something like this.
    And being a PMs vanity project is probably the very worst reason for it, it will only ever be totally polarizing.

    • its not a vanity project..shesh sorry but on this subject a large number of kiwis are pig shit stupid .. it is a dead cat on the table distraction that lasts for almost 2 years and so far has been a superb success.. while JK has been robbing your intellect and property from under your noses

    • I would have thought it would have been bleeding obvious that the appropriate occasion for a change of flag would be when NZ becomes a republic, and not before.

    • The first comment telling it like it is. Koru actually looked OK in flight against a real bg (Ie not on white paper) and hanging limp, where you can still see the form.
      A koru is and should be our emblem, a bit of work would see fyfe’s design ‘fly’.

  3. So John Keys preferred flag won. Gee I didn’t see that coming, who would have thought, how coincidental. Funny old voting system it was isn’t it?

    The black flag wins even though the red flag got the most votes to start with. WHat an utterly bullshit system this was, but it achieved its makers goal I suppose.

    Allegedly 48% of voters voted of which 10% of the votes didn’t count because they weren’t filled out correctly, and by that I take they were defaced with messages of love to John Key.

    National have NEVER honoured a mid-term referendum and this lot have lied plenty during elections so what would make anyone think voting in this farce would be any different.

    I fear this master manipulator will have his way in the next vote. I will vote in that but I have little faith in the integrity of it when this National government have anything to do with it!

  4. Following the unveiling of the flag shortlist, there were many practical Photoshops showing the options being used in real-life situations: fluttering from flagpoles, stitched on backpacks.

    If only Sean Plunket’s gut had been used as an example! People might’ve thought twice about the horror their decision could unleash into the public sphere.

    This just demonstrates that everything that NZ produces with the name “Lockwood” attached to it is absolute shit (except for the houses).

  5. According to the Elections NZ website, just over 48% of the electorate (on average over all electorates) bothered to take part in this referendum. No electorate in NZ even got to 60% and none of the Maori seats even got to 30%. Even if you exclude the Maori electorates (National supporters always suggest that Maori are too lazy or apathetic to bother to vote any time) it is still under 50%.
    Conclusion: over half the electorate decided this referendum was not worth the paper it was printed on. Why? because either it was not a pressing issue for them, or they had no confidence in the character promoting it and saw it as a John Key personal ego trip.
    The only success for this expensive fiasco is that it has diverted a lot of attention from the social ills that plague this country, and that is what National aimed for all along.

  6. What a surprise. Jonkey’s fave is the “prefered alternative.” As Xray says, didn’t see that one coming. I suppose that I am the only one who thinks a/ that the “prefered alternative” will miraculousy win the referendum; and b/ that Jonkey and his cohorts are not to be trusted. Period. This destryer needs to run out of office, out of town, and out of our once fair country. Preferably stripped of hie assets.

  7. the new flag-boy for ‘keys’-choice’ flag..

    ..a physical representation/manifestation of the fat/bloated/gloating/ever-richer/uncaring elites/1%..

    ..those who both these clowns represent..

  8. looks pretty bloody awful…old NZ flag looks better ( what a waste of $26 million dollars)

    Congratulations to Winston Peters and New Zealand First …who have the pulse and respect of most New Zealanders on keeping the existing flag

    ( unlike James Shaw and the Greens who wanted ‘Red Peak’ ….and kept the option of voting for the existing flag out of the first referendum by doing a deal with jonkey nact in support of ‘Red Peak’ flag inclusion…this meant the Greens forced a second costly referendum on New Zealanders who want their existing flag)

    Like many other New Zealanders:

    ….”New Zealand First leader Winston Peters wrote “keep our flag” on his ballot paper, meaning it would be counted as an informal vote.

    He said the fact that 149,022 people had cast informal votes (9.7 per cent) was “terribly high”, and showed the level of discontent over the flawed process.

    The vote had made it even more clear that the vast majority of New Zealanders did not want any flag change, Mr Peters said.

    The NZ First leader was no fan of tonight’s winner…


    (and yus Red Peak has been donged on the head in the first round !…not a popular choice)

    Red Peak a Green Lemon

  9. If you can persuade people to identify with symbols and patterns on a piece of cloth instead of with the natural world and community immediately around them you have won the battle for the mind and can do almost anything you like, including stealing from them and sending them (or their children) to die in a war.

    • Damn good point.

      How much good $26 million could have done for our Kauri trees in Northland.

      The natural world indeed. Our native species are endangered, kids are hungry, families are homeless….


      Where are our priorities people?!?!

  10. Now tell me, National party supporters….

    Can you really live with the fact that the man known globally as the ‘ pony tail puller’ from NZ was the man who permanently changed this country’s flag ?

    No…not a Mickey Joseph Savage, not a Holyoake, not a Kirk… not even an acerbic witted Muldoon…

    But a lying , duplicitous , diminutive , and totally dishonoring little money trader from New York …..is THIS your man?… is THIS your hero?…is THIS your man of the hour???

    Let me ask you then …how much does your country mean to you?

    That you allow such a rapacious , usurious and mediocre individual to be able to get anywhere near our current flag… the flag that embodies symbolically the very essence of who we represent…

    Do you no longer have any pride in you and your country?

    Does belonging to a party that calls itself the ‘ National ‘ party no longer have any relevance because of what the man you voted for has done to our country?

    It is almost beyond belief that National party supporters tolerate this… as I’m sure there are some who still have some modicum of self respect and patriotism left…. surely…

    • As usual, Wild Katipo, an exceptionally astute, witty observation of the naivety of many New Zealanders in their attitude towards John Key, and also the willful acceptance of Key’s cynical, dishonest, manipulative behaviour by many others.

      As expected, the Key adherents down-vote any insightful, intelligent comments that reveal Key’s self-serving motivations and character. Instead of simply down-voting comments that oppose Key, I challenge these sycophants to explain in writing how they believe Key and the National Government’s policies have benefited the majority of New Zealanders, including the most vulnerable people in our society, when it is evident that National’s policies benefit the wealthy minority.

      As I predicted several months ago, the flag “debate” has successfully provided Key with a way of distracting the public from the National Government’s policies that disadvantage most people, including many New Zealanders who support Key and are duped by his phony, “everyman” facade.

  11. FJK’s choice of flag in the lead, as it was also Mike “gobshite” Hosking’s preference too. The latter of course playing follow the dear leader! Then there is the picture above, with Sean Plunkett wearing FJK’s flag as a shirt. Subliminal manipulation of the thought processes obviously!

    Is it me, or do I suspect some dirty politics here, with FJK’s option being the (likely) winner to go up against our present flag? If so, it should be interesting to see what the final result will be in March! The legitimate outcome through public choice I’m sure will be the stars and jack. However, what will eventually emerge after some corrupt fiddling and rigging, I hate to say could well be the tea towel with the white feather!

    Hmm … white feather for cowardice and FJK a born coward … a good match there.

    Go the stars and jack.

  12. http://tinyurl.com/jd59e9w

    What about putting the Tino Rangatiratanga flag, the Weetbix flag and the current flag up for referendum in March?

    If Red Peak can be “squeezed in” because of the court of public opinion, surely Crosby Textor can persuade the PM that Tino Rangatiratanga flag is the least he can do to improve the aspirations of Maori?

    Why wasn’t Tino Rangatiratanga flag included in the first referendum?

    • Good idea it is a wonder John Key hasn’t thought of that, it would surely take votes away from our original flag and the new Weet Bix design would sail through the middle.

      • You know for sure that Gosman and the other trolls will pass on good ideas to Crosby Textor and the spin team for the Natz.

        We should type good ideas in invisible ink, or strikeout?

    • According to the ‘flag guy’ from the selection panel on Q&A the rights owners of the Tino Ranatiratanga didn’t want it.

      • Hardly likely to rock the waka, while sleeping with the enemy at the stern…excuse the extended mixed semaphore metaphor.

  13. Apart from the silver fern being similar in appearance to the international symbol for cowardice the white feather, from a distance it also resembles an old picked over fish carcass!

    So if in the very unfortunate event this design becomes this nation’s new flag, NZ will be known as the country represented either by an emblem of cowardice, or the decaying carcass of a fish!

    Nice one … I think NOT!

    Go the stars and jack 🙂

  14. Oh wouldn’t you know it Keys favourite flag won.i would be surprised if it didn’t given Keys propensity for dishonesty.
    Whats the betting his choice will win in the referendum,if it dosnt he will tell us he dosnt have to abide by referendum,he will get his own way,by any means possible.

    • @ Elle –

      Your final point is quite disturbing.

      Knowing the filthy, sleazy manner in which FJK operates, it’s on the cards what you suggest could well be the outcome. Even more so now that his flag choice has won the first ballot! Quite unsettling.

      Come on Kiwis, let’s hang on to this very important aspect of who we are, the old stars and jack flag. It’s part of our sovereignty and we must keep it and not allow one very corrupt and treasonous politician have so much power over our identity!

  15. All this mischief about changing our New Zealand Flag, sealed by Royal Warrant in 1908 is going to go nowhere. The 48.16% turnout in the postal referendum to choose an alternative has failed. I was one of the ten percent who registered my disaffection. The statistics show that the next referendum in 2016 will show a national resolve to reject his “key speak” assumption that this is ” justa another done deal”.
    There is a movement afoot to ignore the imbedded commands of our ” charitable PM???” and he and his caucus will see that the demise of National’s power in the House is drawing nigh.
    You could not pass the attempt to soften the RMA. at the third reading in the House and this is only a sign of things to come.
    Be warned Mr Prime Minister that your days of shooting down the opposing camps with raging vitriol is now over. The last Saturday in November 2017, is not far away. You are beginning to show your fear. You and your neoliberal cronies are almost done for , when you see the potent Opposition that you will be up against.

  16. Another great piece Martyn, their hasn’t been sufficient debate on the subject of flag change, and their hasn’t been sufficient justification to warrant changing the flag.

    Australia and NZ are two of the countries colonised by the British, where the colonies of British subjects were a after a short while the largest population and took control, democracy. The native and indigenous populations were out numbered.

    Those colonised countries that have changed their flag, have done so to truly represent their population, where the colony had only a minority of British subjects.

    NZ today is made up of a majority of British descendants, as is Australia.

    Realistically, changing the flag should only be considered as part of a change to a republic, and this sort of change could only be acceptable with a 75% agreement from the public.

    • When the Chinese become the dominant race in the not to distant future we can incorporate part of the Chinese flag into our flag.

  17. Flegs are at the end of the queue for me Martyn
    My 86 year old neighbour was the victim of a home invasion this week, she was horrendously beaten for a 2nd time, he came back after the last time.
    I can not help thinking Police could have benefited from some of the $26 million.
    I weep for my sweet, brave old neighbour lying in hospital, while the miserable vicious Fucker is still lurking in our community.
    We have no thoughts about flegs!

  18. So those on the left are going to vote to retain the union jack? It’s time to put aside the sour grapes and bitterness for the fact National and John Key remain popular. The flag doesn’t appeal to all, but the silver fern represents New Zealand better than the current design.

    • You are right, the winning flag doesn’t appeal to all – in fact it represented the first choice of about 37% of all voters To put it into context just over one third of voters thought it was the best option. In fact more voters preferred the second placed design as their first choice.
      Oh, and less than half of registered voters actually voted.
      Not really much for the John Key Appreciation Society to brag about eh?

    • Ed – this is not a Left/Right thing. I think you’ll find that this issue cuts across party lines.

      One friend of mine totally views Key with disgust, but at the same time has voted to change the flag. In her opinion, the current flag is symbolic of a colonial past and she wants it done away with.

      • The Irishman in me detests the presence of the butcher’s apron in our current flag, but I’m still unwilling to change it at the behest of this apology for a statesman.

        • This.
          And the abject little toady brought back British honours so ex-National party operatives and their cronies can bask in the title of ‘Sir’ and ‘Dame’ in order to maintain their feelings of inherent superiority right into their dotage.
          And he is running the least independent foreign policy we have seen in years – even plummy old Keith Holyoake had the sense to limit NZ sycophancy to just a token force in Vietnam.
          And the design is an ugly, ahistorical piece of crap with no gravitas.

        • Yes.
          And to pretend it is about independent identity is nonsense. The craven little sycophant brought back British honours so ex-National party operatives and their friends could bask in titles like ‘Sir’ and ‘Dame’ in order to maintain their feelings of inherent superiority right into their dotage.
          The design is an ugly, ahistorical, piece of crap.

          • I disagree, there are lots of fine New Zealanders who deserve their accolades. Sir Roger Douglas is the most important and I can’t think of any others.

            I have been a bit distracted by flags recently.

            “I’ve been thinking”, like only an ACT Leader can do about how to incorporate a Maori coque/heihei tane [sic.] on the winning New Zealand flag.

            And just because I put my pied en ma bouche, doesn’t mean to say my ideas are not relevant.

            I will be making my great ideas about having a Maori element on our NZ flag known to the PM tomorrow.

  19. A right wing deluded fantasist and a right leaning talk back host, who never convinces, when he claims to be politically “neutral”.

    As for the flag referendum, I did vote after all, only as I thought I better not leave it only to the ignorant and Key fans to vote. I chose the flag that has one, on a narrow margin, but for me that was the least attractive of a too narrow and too poor selection to pick from.

    So I am not all disappointed by the result.

    The coming referendum in February will be the crucial one, and we may see that most will vote to keep the also not thrilling flag we have, so yes, millions spent for a vanity project by a privileged PM, who pursues his hobbies, while the country falls behind many other developed nations and by the day becomes worse prepared to handle the challenges for the future.

    I am glad also that Sean Plonkers has lost his job on Radio Live, as he was only entertaining the Key fans and those right of centre, some far right ones, who are not ones I love.

  20. A correction is required. The New Zealand Flag was instituted by Royal Warrant in 1902. May I say again that the two or three generations from now WILL change the Flag, given the global pollution, species extinction et al that they shall inherit from us.
    Key might as well have laid the Flag out on the lawns of Parliament
    and fired a shotgun into it.

  21. The flag referendum looks more and more like a jack up. I’m not against a change. I think the choices offered weren’t that well designed. The Koru for example should have been in the centre and the background dark blue rather than black. Also the Matariki rather than the Southern Cross should have been used. Apart from the Koru there was nothing Maori about the rest. None of the choices were as well designed as the Tino Rangatiratanga flag. This means that at the next ref. I will stick with the status quo until we become the Republic of Aotearoa.

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