So is this day 3 or 4 of Israel’s war against us? Does anyone know yet? Where the hell is Bill English?

By   /   December 29, 2016  /   91 Comments

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There should be a unified call from the Opposition to expel the Israeli embassy for their threat if Bill English won’t front.

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Folks.

The claim (which has not been denied by the Israeli Government) is that their Prime Minister, rang Murray McCully and told him on the phone that Israel would consider our vote at the UN a ‘declaration of war’.

We voted and co-sponsored the vote against their illegal settlements on Palestinian land.

Sooooooooooooooooo

Are we at war with Israel? Have we had any clarification yet as to whether or not we are technically at war?

The total lack of intellectual curiosity from our corporate mainstream media on this issue is honestly astounding.

Where the fuck is Bill English? He gets that as Prime Minister he’s on the job 24-7 right? Has anyone called him to ask what’s the Government’s position on this threat? Has anyone called him to tell him that it’s even happened?

I get our foreign policy is pretty relaxed and casual, but a country claiming they will see our vote at the UN as a declaration of war requires a bit more than ‘sweet as’.

NZ has shown surprising courage, we must not stop now. This is a moment when the rest of the civilised world turned their back on Israel’s brutal and cruel occupation of Palestine.

This is an opportunity to make a genuine stand.

For threatening us with war, the least we should do is ban their embassy from NZ until they have agreed to the immediate implementation of the 2 state solution.

It is time for the Opposition Parties to make a stand here if the National Party is too frightened.

There should be a unified call from the Opposition to expel the Israeli embassy for their threat if Bill English won’t front.

Can I also remind everyone, that the term ‘settlement’ is incredibly misleading. The word suggests some type of loose grouping of temporary buildings. Nothing could be further from the truth. Some of these ‘settlements’ are huge urban structures with hundreds of thousands living there. Israel have fed the radical right to settle huge swathes of Palestinian land and then confiscate it when the inevitable fights break out between the Palestinians living on that land and the new hyper aggressive fanatical zionist settlers taking it.

New Zealand has the opportunity to become a leader for international human rights by making  stand against Israeli aggression. We need to do something to save this terrible year.

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91 Comments

  1. Robert Atack says:

    the 2 state solution… isn’t a solution anymore, even the Palestinians are saying they couldn’t work alone, the place has been cut up so much they couldn’t make a country out of the mess that is left, the ‘solution’ would have to be more like South Africa ala Mandala.
    But then there isn’t enough time left in the global system to put anything together … bad luck

  2. Lois Griffiths says:

    I agree with expelling the Israeli Embassy. But I think demanding a 2-state solution could be a trap. Already too many years have been wasted with ‘negotiations’.
    Better to demand that Israel be expelled from the UN until it enacts and follows humanitarian laws and norms.
    It could start by demolishing the ‘Walls’, including the many many internal barriers to movement within the West Bank..and barriers to movement between Gaza, Israel and the West Bank, freeing all political prisoners, immediately urgently restoring safe drinking water to Gazans, immediately allowing Gazans with cancer to travel for treatment, disarming the trigger-happy IDF and border police, encouraging schools to teach the reality of the 1948 Nakba.

  3. countryboy says:

    Here they come !
    Israeli soldiers with machine guns patrolling Queen Street.
    And you jonky voting, inflated property values for a quick buck fuckers are to blame.
    I’ve said for years, the Israelis are going to take NZ / Aotearoa off us and it’ll be a deal brokered by jonky-stien and his predecessor clones.
    NZ protesting about something as emotive as the Israeli occupation of Palestine is the excuse they needed to react.

  4. Why do I get the sneaking suspicion that Israel’s vitriolic response, including threats of war, has taken the Nats by surprise?

    The silence from English is akin to a possum caught in the headlights of a fast-approaching truck (in this case, an Israeli military truck) bearing down on us – with the newly annointed PM not quite sure what to do.

    The U.N. Security Council resolution, coupled with Russian-Turkish peace initiatives for Syria, indicates some massive, radical geo-political changes underway in the Middle East.

    Something is happening. I believe we are witnessing the beginnings of something historical, unfolding in front of our eyes.

    • david says:

      Frank just a question

      Should the Western Wall and Temple Mount be considered Israeli territory. If not, why not

      • David, why are you concerned with the Western Wall anbd Temple Mount when Israel has seized, occupied, and colonising the West Bank? I think your priorities are a bit skewed, mate.

        • Andy says:

          The West Bank is land that Israel acquired from Jordan during the 1967 six day war

          • “Acquired”?

            You make it sound like a transaction done through Trademe.

            No, Andy. The land was seized after Israel started the war. Can I “acquire” your land through similar means?

            • Andy says:

              Seized from whom?

            • Andy says:

              Hang on, are you claiming that Israel started the Six Day war?

              • Hang on, yes, I am.

                As is the Encyclopedia Britannica:

                In response to the apparent mobilization of its Arab neighbours, early on the morning of June 5, Israel staged a sudden preemptive air assault that destroyed more than 90 percent Egypt’s air force on the tarmac. A similar air assault incapacitated the Syrian air force. Without cover from the air, the Egyptian army was left vulnerable to attack. Within three days the Israelis had achieved an overwhelming victory on the ground, capturing the Gaza Strip and all of the Sinai Peninsula up to the east bank of the Suez Canal.

                ref: https://www.britannica.com/event/Six-Day-War

                From History.com;

                With every sign of a pan-Arab attack in the works, Israel’s government on June 4 authorized its armed forces to launch a surprise preemptive strike. On June 5, the Six-Day War began with an Israeli assault against Arab air power. In a brilliant attack, the Israeli air force caught the formidable Egyptian air force on the ground and largely destroyed the Arabs’ most powerful weapon. The Israeli air force then turned against the lesser air forces of Jordan, Syria, and Iraq, and by the end of the day had decisively won air superiority.

                ref: http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/six-day-war-ends

                Israel’s “bestie”, the US admits it on their CIA webpage;

                Helms was awakened at 3:00 in the morning on 5 June by a call from the CIA Operations Center. The Foreign Broadcast Information Service had picked up reports that Israel had launched its attack. (OCI soon concluded that the Israelis— contrary to their claims—had fired first.) President Johnson was gratified that because of CIA analyses and Helms’s tip, he could inform congressional leaders later in the day that he had been expecting Israel’s move.[11]

                ref: https://www.cia.gov/library/center-for-the-study-of-intelligence/csi-publications/csi-studies/studies/vol49no1/html_files/arab_israeli_war_1.html

                And even the Jewish “Virtual Library” admits this (in a roundabout way);

                On June 5, 1967, Israel was indeed alone, but its military commanders had conceived a brilliant war strategy. The entire Israeli Air Force, with the exception of just 12 fighters assigned to defend Israeli air space, took off at 7:14 a.m. with the intent of bombing Egyptian airfields while the Egyptian pilots were eating breakfast. In less than 2 hours, roughly 300 Egyptian aircraft were destroyed. A few hours later, Israeli fighters attacked the Jordanian and Syrian air forces, as well as one airfield in Iraq. By the end of the first day, nearly the entire Egyptian and Jordanian air forces, and half the Syrians’, had been destroyed on the ground.

                The battle then moved to the ground, and some of history’s greatest tank battles were fought between Egyptian and Israeli armor in the blast-furnace conditions of the Sinai desert.

                ref: http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/67_War.html

                Of course, Israel (and the US) defended their first strike by calling it “pre-emptive” in the face of an alleged Arab build-up. That’s the usual excuse from most aggressors and bullies; “We attacked first because they were going to attack us”.

                Is there any other aspect of apparent weak historical knowledge that I can assist you with, Andy?

                • Andy says:

                  I’m pretty sure that I can find evidence that Israel was fighting a defensive war against all the Arab countries that have borders with Israel, but what is the point? I have plenty of links which will no doubt be dismissed.

                  In your universe, Israel has no right to exist, “Jews” never lived there or have no rights to, and the only true path is Islam

                  Good luck with that

                  • So you understand that Israel started the Six Day War, Andy?

                    As for the rest of your rant;

                    In your universe, Israel has no right to exist,

                    Quite the opposite, actually.

                    If you can find a quote from me denying Israel’s right to exist, I’ll accept you are 100% right; I am deluded; and I shall refrain from ever commenting on Middle East issues again. Feel free to accept my challenge.

                    If you can’t find any such comment from me, you can do likewise.

                    “Jews” never lived there or have no rights to,

                    See above.

                    and the only true path is Islam

                    You’re delusional, Andy. Time to ‘up’ your meds, mate.

                    • Andy says:

                      “In your Universe” implies the boilerplate arguments that I hear from Leftists

                      I don’t expect you to actually come up with any original thoughts, Frank, because that would betray you to your Tribe

                      You may well have thoughts of your own, I can’t comment on that

                  • John W says:

                    Andy you can select what you like and believe what you like and be wrong as much as you like.

                    Israel is not a victim but an aggressor.

              • Otto Mann says:

                Andy, every time you take Frank on, he wipes the floor with you. You’re not a fast learner, are you?? LOL!!

    • Patrick says:

      Perhaps he knows exactly what he’s doing.
      He may well have decided that the best option is to say nothing.
      Mind you if Countryboy is right the toy tossing Israeli will be our PM soon anyway.

    • bert says:

      English who?

    • Patrick says:

      Why would any New Zealand PM respond to this childish sabre rattling? Threaten to take the skyhawks out of their gladwrap covers?
      I suspect that Bill English is doing exactly what Key, Clark, Bolger, Lange etc would have done.
      Don’t ramp it up, we are above that – ignore.

    • Jenny says:

      This is my feeling too Frank.

      Shifting alliances, Turkey, Russia, Iran, occupying a divided rump puppet state officially, (but only on paper), under the rule of Bashar Assad. The Assad dynasty will be happy with this arrangement, as long as they continue to get their ten percent.

      Mr Ten Percent

      The fly in the ointment in this cosy arrangement, and with armed forces on the ground, is Hezbollah.

      Turkey is demanding that Hezbollah leave Syria. Iran Hezbollah’s main ally and backer is resisting this demand, as it would lessen their power and influence and relegate Iran to the role of junior partner in this three way Axis.

      Turkey says Lebanon’s Hezbollah should leave Syria

      It is possible that the three powers, Russia, Turkey, Iran will come to some sort of agreement where a greatly strengthened and rearmed Hezbolla remains as part of the occupying forces on the ground. This obviously would be in Iran’s interest.

      But it might also be in Russia’s interest.

      It is quite likely that a more empowered Hezbollah, strengthend by Russian arms and Iranian manpower will go for a power grab in Lebanon and take over that country, probably with a coup sometime in the new year.
      In return for Russian backing, the new Hezbollah government in waiting) of Lebanon, has probably already offered Russia land and resources to expand Russian sea ports and military bases in the Mediterranean on the Lebanese coast.

      Obviously Turkey would not be to happy with all this, as it would then relegate them to the role of junior partner in the Axis, but Turkey could probably live with this, if Russia and Iran grant Turkey a bigger part of the partition of Syria (than Turkey already occupy at present), and also in exchange, these two other powers agree to turn a blind eye for Turkey to use their agreed area of partition as a staging ground to wage a war of extermination against the Syrian and Turkish Kurds.

      So where does the US come in?
      It’s hard to say. Trump cuddling up to Putin may see the US content with this new balance of power in the South Western Mediterranean. Who knows?

      Not so much a new cold war, but a tepid one.

      The wild card is the Arab people. How will the “Arab Street” come to regard this new imperialist carve up in the region?

      Could the Arab Spring get its second wind?

    • John W says:

      Agreed Frank.

      A different world lies ahead but just how it pans out may depend on public reaction to more of the same crap – for the short term gains for a parasitic “elite.”

  5. Chooky says:

    yes and Trump should be careful going against the UN and supporting the Israelis against Palestinian rights …he is on a very narrow margin himself

    …it will absolutely turn off many of those who thought he was a better option than the corrupt warmongering Hillary Clinton

    ( Clinton , who led in the campaign for the destruction of Libya and had Gaddafi killed creating a huge humanitarian and European refugee crisis as well as a stronghold for ISIS in Libya. Clinton was also bought by the Israeli lobby and supported Israeli crimes against the Palestinians and their land )

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-24/former-cia-spy-has-surprising-christmas-message-trump

  6. Whispering Kate says:

    Gordon McLauchlan once titled us “The Passionless People” and truly that’s who we are. We can rise to the occasion admirably when we are called upon – like the last two world wars but as for rising up and shaking off our inertia about local problems we are just in doze mode.

    We haven’t ever experienced serious unrest here because we don’t have land borders and we are not battle hardened to get shitty enough to make a difference in our own country to all the inequality within our citizenry and corruption in our political systems. The media is a serious concern here, we are deliberately being left ignorant about issues that really matter to us and we don’t give a shit about it – just continue to watch such utter trash it doesn’t bear to think about it.

    If we had been through a couple of centuries of border infighting or tribal hatred one against the other then maybe we would understand and get off our asses and get serious.

    I am a young old person now but I have always said to my kids if there is a revolution here I will be behind the barricades doing my bit, old and feeble as I am. We have lost the primal instinct of rising up and actually doing what needs to be done – calling our politicians up and making them do their jobs properly. It was one thing Kim Dot Com said which I thought was so right – to the journalists he said “I wouldn’t have had to do this if you lot had got off your asses and been doing your jobs.”

    We most certainly are a passionless people, spoilt to the point of sheer uselessness – lacking in a true love for our country for we would be by hell cleaning our our political system and all its rorting and giving back the power to the media to publish the truth, somehow or other.

    • SARAH says:

      “We haven’t ever experienced serious unrest here because we don’t have land borders and we are not battle hardened to get shitty enough to make a difference in our own country to all the inequality within our citizenry and corruption in our political systems.”

      I’ve often wondered why Kiwi’s are so uninvolved in anything except their own little bubble and this makes a whole lot of sense.
      Like you I will be behind those barricades despite not being as young as I feel. It’s more than frustrating to see opportunities slide by with no one passionate enough about our wonderful country to fight for it.

    • J S Bark says:

      Excellent observation Whispering Kate. This is one of the pitfalls of an island nation. Specially one so far from the nearest foreign land. Australia? Foreign? Really?

      I guess the fact that everyone living here came from somewhere else, mostly to get away from that somewhere else, has led to a very insular and isolated way of living. A living doze more like…

      …and completely irrelevant in the modern global village.

      Do you really think that Auckland would be overlooked in a nuclear attack?

      Do you really think the bloody Yanks would come to our rescue?

      Do you not know which countries are nuclear capable?

      Israel for one…

      I too will be at the barricades along with my gold card for the bus…

      • John W says:

        Australian foreign?

        Who owns our banking system, much of our service industries and half of our property at least.

    • John W says:

      Not having borders is an advantage. Instead of looking at neighbours and being involved i Nationalist fervour we have a chance to look within and deal to the hawks who create the hardship and unrest while filling their mates pockets.

      In the 1930 we did make giant strides toward a fairer deal but money and media hoodwinked the naive Kiwi.

      Our strident emergent socialism has been wiped from the public consciousness. Growing hardship may well bring it back in a new form but resistance will be resolute and well funded. The investor state has NZ by the short and curlies.

      We did not take socialism far enough to prevent this turn around.

  7. Afewknowthetruth says:

    Many people seem to have forgotten who owns and operates the western banking system.

    We will be back to business-as-usual after the ‘silly season’ of the [NZ] summer holidays. That means continued genocide in Gaza, further development of plans for extraction of gas and oil from fields in the region, a bit more tourism, lots of weapons manufacture and sales, and further attempts by Israel and the US to destablise Syria, partly to provide Israel with access to more water.

    The loot-and-pollute, create-money-out-of thin-air, overpopulate-and- develop, destablise-governments ‘game’ has been played for well over a century, and the players are not going to stop until they have completely wrecked everything….. a point which will be reached in about 5 years.

  8. CLEANGREEN says:

    “There should be a unified call from the Opposition to expel the Israeli embassy for their threat if Bill English won’t front.”

    Bill English is just another stool pigeon of the Corporate cabal Martyn as you know, so all this hypocrisy as a good committed catholic with a strong conscious human fibre is just all talk as he has no spine or moral fibre even that I have as a common Presbyterian.

    They are all corrupted mate.

  9. Shona says:

    +1000 @ Whispering Kate

  10. Andy says:

    The international push back against NZ has started.

    About time too

  11. Helena says:

    We can rise to the occasion if it’s rugby! Politics … yeah, nah. We follow what our US Inc bosses told us to do. They aren’t in power anymore. What to do, what to do?

  12. Bert B says:

    So how many Mossad people in NZ at the moment?
    Betcha 20 sheckles the .govt.nz folks don’t know either.
    Can someone in Wgtn see if pizzas are being delivered to SIS HQ late into the night?

    • CLEANGREEN says:

      Yeah Bert,

      This was probably why ShonKey got the hell out of NZ now as he could see the crap coming?

    • Andy says:

      How many Jews are there in NZ?

      Presumably if Murray McCully wants a Jew free Judea and Samaria, then he wants the same for NZ?

      • Andy says:

        Obviously my question is rhetorical and aggressive, but countries outside of NZ are asking why an ostensibly centre-right government is supporting ethnic cleansing of Jews from Judea and Samaria.

        Maybe it has got something to do with all those sheep for Saudi deals, or maybe something Key and Obama cooked up on the golf course in Hawaii.

        Either way, my opinion of the National government has taken a major nosedive over the last few days

        • Judea and Samaria

          Andy, how about using modern day placenames for nations as they currently stand, not as they were thousands of years ago.

          Just as we now refer to the European Union, not the Roman Empire.

          Welcome to the 21st Century.

          • Andy says:

            The areas are known as Judea and Samaria, even now. The term ‘west bank” was coined by Jordan.

            The Roman Empire included modern day Israel. The roman emperor Hadrian expelled Jews from Judea and Samaria and renamed the area “Palestina”.

            • Otto Mann says:

              Well, bugger me, Andy, I tried looking for Judea and Samaria on the map, but can’t seem to find them. Do they have national flags? Seats in the U.N.? Help us out here, mate, our maps seems to have misplaced these so-called “countries”.

              • Andy says:

                They don’t have national flags because Judea and Samaria are not countries. These are the commonly used terms that date back to biblical times.

                The term West Bank was coined by Jordan, who also referred to the area as Cis Jordan, with Trans Jordan being the area now referred to as simply Jordan.

                The West Bank is just over 5000km2, an area of land that would fit inside the NZ Canterbury Plains

              • Andy says:

                Canterbury and Otago are not countries either

                • John W says:

                  And can Canterbury and Otago be “claimed back” by alleged descendants of earlier inhabitants as well.

                  • Andy says:

                    Good. I look forward to the UN passing a resolution demanding no more “Pakeha” development in NZ

                    It is what we deserve.

                    • John W says:

                      Andy in NZ we all live under one set of laws, races and religions mix after growing up together.

                      Intermarriage is common and martial law seldom invoked.

                      You must enjoy these things surely yet you seem to be reluctant to support others having such a chance.

      • Steve King says:

        Nonsensical post there mate, even by your standards.

      • Steve King says:

        Pretty nonsensical post, mate, even by your standards. In the spirit of helpful support, your mistake was to “presume”… and base an argument on that. You’re welcome.

        • Andy says:

          I guess “irony” is a bit hard for you to swallow. Tablet Mag has a piece “presuming” to understand the Maori land issue. Also intended as irony, as reported in Stuff today

      • Chooky says:

        @ ANDY…trying to twist the issue are you?…spin, mischief making, character assassination?…trying to undermine the United Nations and Murray McCully and the rest of the world concerned about human rights?

        There are many Jews who oppose the racist Israeli State and oppose how Palestinians are treated in their own land of Palestine

        …and this is interesting

        ‘Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu Faces Criminal Investigation For Fraud & Bribery’

        http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-29/israeli-prime-minister-benjamin-netanyahu-faces-criminal-investigation-fraud-bribery

      • Steve King says:

        Yeeeeaaaaah na, Andy. It’s not your best work is it? Never base your argument on a “presumably” The rest is just nonsensical. Have another go.

        • Andy says:

          Ok, I’ll have another go.

          NZ has sided with marxist tinpot regimes like Venezuela and Islamic Supremacists like Saudi, not because it wants to do “good” but because it sees some short term business value in dealing with Saudi Arabia

          This is of course speculation on my part. I assume that the Nats are only interested in grubby money (see I agree with you on some issues!) and any morals have long since left the room.

          Either that of McCully is deluded and actually believes he is a force for good

          • This is of course speculation on my part. I assume that the Nats are only interested in grubby money (see I agree with you on some issues!) and any morals have long since left the room.

            Oh, Andy, now you’re upset about “the Nats are only interested in grubby money”?!

            And every other time, when the Nats have wasted our money; sold off state houses; under-funded social services; to get the government books back into black, you’ve hysterically defended them?

            But now that the same “money grubbing” appears to have bitten you on the backside, you’re climbing a moral highground? You really are a sad case, Andy.

            • Andy says:

              I have never ever backed the Nats on this blog.

              I am not a political person. I find politics attracts the worst kind of bottom feeding vermin.

              However, feel free to make stuff up Frank.

              That’s what Leftists do best. Lie

  13. john stringer says:

    Given the present world-wide media focus on the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, it seems odd to me that so little background analysis to these events is being offered. It does, however, explain the almost instantaneous widespread condemnation of Israel – we’re simply making our judgments before we’ve heard all the evidence.

    As a nation, we New Zealanders pride ourselves on our ethos of a fair go. Shouldn’t we then at least listen to the whole story rather than the truncated version? Of course the Palestinians should be treated justly – no-one is suggesting otherwise – but shouldn’t the Jews be too? Not the justice long overdue them after 3,500 years of unrelenting genocidal attacks, persecution and pogroms, Crusades and Inquisition, nor even the Holocaust: Israel has a right to exist even if we limit our consideration to just the last 100 years in the Middle East.

    Most of us only know about Palestine, Israel and the creation of the Palestinian refugee crisis through what we’ve been told by a television screen showing dead or wounded children and a voice-over blaming Israeli “occupation” of Palestinian land. One picture is indeed worth a thousand words but a picture can also tell a thousand lies. We need to understand the context of what we’re watching.

    Couldn’t we at least consider the Jewish situation in the light of the Arabs already having twenty-two sovereign states? Palestine will simply be number twenty-three. And as for the claim that a Jewish state would be racist, wouldn’t this mean the 50+ countries calling themselves Islamic should have to disestablish themselves?

    Our news media also seem completely beguiled by the narrative that portrays 1948 as the beginning of troubles, the Nakba or Catastrophe, as Arabs today describe the creation of the Jewish state and the displacement of Palestinians. Yet it is this truncated view that sets us up, at best for irrational judgments, or at worst for the blatant anti-Semitism prevalent today. Of course, those advocating only for the Palestinians today have to pretend it all started in 1948. After all, if anyone bothers to look back thirty years, they may well end up with a very different perspective on today’s events.

    In 1918 the Ottoman Empire lost control of the Middle East and a new era began. Their mostly Arab subjects had chafed under the Turkish yoke for some four hundred years so the British dismembered that empire into autonomous Arab states: Saudi Arabia, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, Kuwait, Yemen, Oman and the Gulf States. Today, the Arab nations, including North Africa, occupy some 13,333,296 sq kms. However, in 1920, the British Secretary ofState for Foreign Affairs Lord Arthur Balfour warned:

    So far as the Arabs are concerned, I hope they will remember that it is we who have established an independent Arab sovereignty of the Hedjaz. I hope they will remember it is we who desire in Mesopotamia to prepare the way for the future of a self-governing, autonomous Arab State, and I hope that, remembering all that, they will not grudge that small notch – for it is no more than that geographically – that small notch in what are now Arab territories being given to the [Jews].

    And the “small notch” was to become even smaller.

    In 1922, the British divided the 120,466 sq kms of Mandatory Palestine to establish “a Jewish National Home in Palestine west of the Jordan and a separate Arab entity in Palestine east of the Jordan”. This division granted the Arabs all of the 92,300 sq kms east of the Jordan (77% of Mandatory Palestine) which they promptly renamed Jordan (The Hashemite Kingdom of…), and then began today’s claims for another sovereign state called Palestine but within the remaining 28,166 sq kms west of the Jordan (23% of Mandatory Palestine). The latest UN call for dividing the land will leave the Jews with only 12%. Is that a fair go? As a matter of simple justice, shouldn’t the Arabs indeed remember that the British, whom they resent for giving any land at all to the Jews, gave the Arabs all of the sovereign states they have in the Middle East today? That the Arab Nation (comprising 22 countries) already has a land area 500 times the size of Israel and, with another Palestine, that will increase to 950 times? That they were given 77% Mandatory Palestine in 1922 and renamed it the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan? Why then are they begrudging the Jews even the 23%? Is it fair to now reduce that to 12%?

    Because the creation of Israel in 1948 created 600,000 Palestinian refugees, Israel needs to accept them all back. However, if that’s fair, what should be done for the 856,000 Jewish refugees driven out of the Arab nations at that time? These Jewish refugees left not only frozen bank accounts, homes, businesses and other assets but also an estimated 100,000 sq kms of Jewish-owned land, i.e. almost five times the size of the State of Israel (20,770 sq kms). Wouldn’t simple justice include their displacement as well as that of the Palestinian refugees?

    So… what happened to all these refugees? Almost a third of the Jewish refugees fled to Europe or the USA but some 600,000 were absorbed into Israel and the last refugee camp there closed in 1958. The 600,000 Palestinian refugees, however, were turned away by their fellow-Arabs and there are now 5 million, and 58 refugee camps requiring permanent international aid.

    Was it asking too much of the Arabs to accept their half-share, as the Jews did, in this population transfer of 1.2 million Jews and Arabs? After all, in other spheres of brutal antagonism, separation was considered the only possible solution. In 1923, the Treaty of Lausanne required the expulsion of 1.5 million Greeks and Christians from Turkish territory, and 800,000 Turks and Muslims from Greek territory; the 1947 partition of India, to halt Hindu-Muslim warfare, required 14 million people to change homelands, 7 million Muslims moving to East and West Pakistan from India and 7 million Hindus and Sikhs from Pakistan to India.

    Isn’t it racist to believe that Arabs can’t be as compassionate and accepting of their refugees as the Greeks, Turks, Indians and Pakistanis? Should the Jews alone accept responsibility for all of the 1.2 million Arab and Jewish refugees who wanted to stay in the Middle East in 1948? Is it really Israel’s fault that their often ostentatiously wealthy Arab neighbours prefer to corral the Palestinian refugees into 58 permanent refugee camps? Or even to massacre them, as they did in Jordan during Black September in 1970 and Lebanon in 1992? Vastly more Palestinians have been killed by their Arab brothers in the last 100 years than ever by Israel – why don’t we care about them?

    • John W says:

      A distorted history cannot justify present day crimes.

      Past wrong do not make similar wrong today OK.

      Religion and racism abound throughout your account.

      How do you account for the Arab unrest when their homeland was taken in 1948, then populated by a horde of foreigners.

      • Andrew says:

        John W:

        John Stringer presented an entirely factual account of recent history in that region so I’m not sure why you think it’s racist or anything to do with religion.

        Many here are ignoring the many Muslim Israelis who live quite happily in their homeland. Today. Here they are on Facebook:

        https://www.facebook.com/Muslims-of-Israel-700148946730005/

        Happy, smiling faces – no doubt pleased not to be living under the tyranny of Hamas in Gaza or the Palestinian National Authority and getting all the benefits of modern Israeli education and healthcare.

        These were the one in ’48 smart enough to embrace the Jews rather than fight them.

        It seems Israelis can accommodate Muslims in their land but not the other way around.

      • Andy says:

        John W,

        I guess it didn’t pass your irony filter to drone about “racism” in the same sentence as you complaining about “foreigners” coming into a country

        • John W says:

          Andy the word foreigner is not a racist term but refers to people from foreign countries.

          Many if the people who moved into Israel after it was so recently formed, came from foreign countries and had nationalities other than pertaining to the newly formed Israel, so then to call them foreigners is a non judgemental description. Race does not come into it.
          .
          This “invasion” was an aggravating factor for the local existing inhabitants who many of who were pushed out of their homeland.

          Why talk about accounts from over a thousand years and allude to those applying to present or recent populations. One sided arguments seldom account for much.

  14. The Lion Roars says:

    John Kerry came and meet with at the time Prime Minister John Key to talk about certain matters, one of them i believe was to do with Israel and Order 2334 they meet at roughly 11:45pm and at 12: 02am the at Kaikoura earthquake happens mmm what were they planning for Murry McCully to do and sign to. What happened with the earthquake was God’s Judgement if another nation or land tries to divide Israel up then God’s Judgement will come there are clear scripture’s in the bible God’s Word to point this out. Wake Up New Zealand and turn your hearts to God for he is the only way out of what is coming back to this land and to the earth!

    • mary_a says:

      @ THE LION ROARS … With respect to your religious beliefs, as the knowing God of all, how is it then the same God allows so much hatred, violence, pain and suffering in the world to perpetuate as it is at present, in many instances atrocities Zionism is responsible for?

      I find those facts hard to reconcile with a benevolent loving God.

      • Andy says:

        Of course, Arabs stabbing Jews and killing jewish children in their beds aren’t atrocities. They are justified by the evil Jews invading the homeland of the indigenous Arabs.

        • Would you snuggle up with an invader who had invaded your home, Andy? Somehow you don’t seem the turn-the-other-cheek type to me.

          Perhaps you think the French, Poles, Russians, et al, shouldn’t have fought back against evil Nazis invading their homeland?

          But wait, it’s all a matter of double standards for you, isn’t it?

          • Andy says:

            I take it by your comment that you support stabbings, car rammings and murder of Jews, Frank

            • Andy says:

              Apropos of the above, you’ll have no problem if some Maori nationalists break into your home, stab you or your family and then celebrate the event by naming streets after the perps.

              • Andy, why do you always avoid the issue of Israel’s actions? You seem fixated on trying to deflect away from Israel, using other countries, groups, etc.

                I thought right-wingers were ‘big’ on taking responsibility for their actions? Where is Israel’s responsibility for forcing 700,000 Palestinians from their homeland? And why do you keep avoiding this central issue? I can only assume you can’t answer it.

  15. captain boomerang says:

    bill english is a weak little baby, just like New Zealand has become. Israel has just committed a hostile act of aggression against New Zealand yet benedict billy just allows NZ to sit on the fence and get beaten up by a criminal entity without even firing a shot in return.

    New Zealand NEEDS a strong leader to immediately hit back against any country who actually does or threatens New Zealand with any hostile action. Israels rhetoric is an act of aggression against this land. We need a vladimir Putin type ruler in this land to defend our values, retaliate against anybody who dares to mess with aotearoa and put our enemies in their place.

    • I might pass on that suggestion, Captain. “Strongman” leaders have a tendency to put dissidents and political rivals “in their place” as well as “our enemies”.

    • Patrick says:

      It’s called statemanship.
      What do you want Bill English to do? Challenge whatshisface to a duel with feather dusters at 20 paces or do we menace Israel with a brace of Jet trainers and a photo of Willie Apiata.
      Do you think that would do the trick?

  16. BobW says:

    Three or four weeks ago:
    McCully: PM, our supporting that anti Israeli resolution thingee will make you pretty unpopular.
    John Key: Not me… I have an exit plan… It will be yours and Bill’s problem.

  17. Wha Left says:

    Phone call between Bill and John

    Bill:What do I do about the Israel crisis John?
    John:Ignore it, people are too busy paying off their Christmas Credit card bills to worry about it.
    Bill:But they want me to speak about it?
    John:Who does?
    Bill:The media does
    John:Stephen Joyce owns the media, the media won’t ask and anyway most of them are on holiday – The Nation and Q&A doesn’t start back until February.
    Bill:But it looks like I’m weak and insipid John
    John:You are Bill, that’s what’s so endearing about you – and anyway, you are the scapegoat for the impending 2017 election defeat, it doesn’t matter what you think.
    Bill:Should I do one of those press releases?
    John:No Bill, wait till the Black Caps win the series and go in and congratulate Kane and the boys. People know where Nelson is, and they couldn’t give a stuff about Israel.
    Bill:Anything else I can do?
    John:Go to the Auckland Nines and for God’s sake, get a decent suit, you look like a farmer from Dipton.
    Bill:I am a farmer from Dipton John
    John:We know Bill, we know! Just smile, it’ll all be fine. The Hollow Men have it all sorted – you won’t have to do a thing. Relax…it’s the festive season. Barack and I are going out for a game of golf. We’ll invite you , it’ll do your cred good, with the sporty ordinary Kiwi bloke.
    Bill:I don’t know what my handicap is John?
    John:We all know Bill, why do you think I endorsed you?
    Bill: So I just hunker down and ignore the Israel thing John?
    John:Yes Bill. And Bill?
    Bill:Yes Prime Minister
    John:Don’t call us, we’ll call you and let you know what to say. And for God’s sake, don’t print this Messenger Chat on the Daily Blog.
    Bill: Ooops 🙁

    • CLEANGREEN says:

      BRILLIANT SAID WHA LEAFT %100.

      English is just another sell-out pathetic gate keeper for the global cabal taking over the entire world as forecast in “Agenda 21”

  18. Stuart Munro says:

    It could just be my cynicism but maybe McCully has finally worked out how to get a trade deal with the Arab states. Hell, war with Israel would probably attract clandestine funding too.

    • Andy says:

      That is my assumption too, Stuart

      • Andy says:

        I’m sure war with a nuclear power wouldn’t be in the best interests of NZ

        • Otto Mann says:

          But, Andy, Israel denies it has nukes! Israel wouldn’t be lying to us now, would it?? Huh??

        • Judea has Nuclear Weapons?

          Oh no!

          Why are you scared of nuclear weapons, when there are some very nice CRISP-R biogenic weapons being developed – right here in New Zealand.

          If English was smart, he would telephone Volodiya, and have a conversation about how Russia, deals with Jews.

          Last time, Judea declared war on Germany, well – it did not end well for them? No?

          Comrade, you should read NZ anti nuclear legislation very closely, in your safe space closet. You will find there is little there about using nuclear weapons overseas in deployment zones for NZ Expeditionary Forces.

          I’m sure my friends in Moscow, can supply you with weapons that work. Real weapons.
          Not, pussy weapon – like F35, which is poor crappy copy of Yak-141 – with same engine.

          Why buy Amerikan shit, when you tanks and planes for fraction of cost – that work?

          Israel won’t do shit to NZ, they are half Slavs today anyway. Just look at the street signs in Tel Aviv?

          Cyrillic!

          Soon, Israel will be run from the Kremlin, like it should be.

          Slava Rossii!



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